Don't believe the propaganda about "greatly improved air quality" in California.....LA and Bakersfield routinely make the "dirtiest air" list every year......LA has the dirtiest air, and the highest concentration of do-gooders who lobby for "clean air".....also, our gasoline prices are 40 cents higher than every other state, due to the strict standards and cleaner blends demanded by the environmentalists.......also, in my city, Bakersfield, they have "air quality monitors" who drive around on "no burn" days dictated by the government and point infrared monitors at your chimney, to see if you're burning an "illegal" log fire.....they also take photographs through people's windows to document the presence of a fire in the fireplace (and this from the people who want to keep the government out of your business)......I like clean air too, but I don't want to live in a totalitarian state......driving my new Chrysler 300 puts me in a better mood..... Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx wrote: There are 25 messages in this issue. Topics in this digest: 1. Re: Causion From: Ray Jones 2. Gas chemistry From: "L.Andrew Jugle" 3. Re: Gas chemistry From: Ray Jones 4. Re: Gas chemistry From: 5. Re: Causion From: "Roger Schaaf" 6. Re: Gas chemistry From: "Roger Schaaf" 7. Re: Causion From: Ray Jones 8. Re: Gas chemistry From: "Roger Schaaf" 9. Re: Balancing Act From: "Roger Schaaf" 10. Balancing Act From: Rich Barber 11. 300E convertible From: John Hertog 12. Re: Gas chemistry From: mr-320@xxxxxxxxx 13. Tire Balance From: Hari Walner 14. Floor Pan for '61 G From: "Knutsen.Mark" 15. Re: Re: Balancing Act From: "Warren Anderson" 16. Re: Floor Pan for '61 G From: moparpjf@xxxxxxx 17. RE: Floor Pan for '61 G From: "Lee Meyer" 18. Re: Tire Balance From: "Warren Anderson" 19. Fw: Re: Balancing Act From: Marshall R Larson 20. Re: Balancing Act From: Ray Jones 21. Re: Re: Balancing Act From: dan300f@xxxxxxx 22. Re: Intake Manifold From: Ray Jones 23. RE: Gas Chemistry From: "Bob Jasinski" 24. link to 300E pix From: John Hertog 25. Re: Spring Meet Airports? From: GERALD OLSON ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 1 Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2005 16:44:18 -0600 From: Ray Jones Subject: Re: Causion There were 2 basic problems with this tire story. First and foremost, THEY did NOT sell the tires. (So don't care much) Secondly, anybody working there for minimum wage isn't that interested in mounting "Problem" tires, not to mention "tubes". What the heck are they?. Most kids have never seen them. And if they didn't know how to balance Statically (just measure the wheel and push some buttons on the Balancer), they don't need to work on my tires. Before retiring, I worked at an Acura dealer and was the NSX tech. Had to mount and balance tires on them and each tire was different. Fronts and Backs and Lefts and Rights. You just had to focus! I always spun the bare rim first and marked it's heavy spot, if any. Then when balancing the tire/rim assembly, if the heavy spot was near where the rims heavy spot was, I broke it down and shifted the tire around the rim to get a better (less or no weight) balance. And when balancing, I hid stick-on weights behind the webs, almost dynamic balancing. I deal now with a "good ol' boy" Rural shop, and they mount everything from 8" wheelbarrow tires to 38" Heavy equipment tires. Some with tubes and tread liners. They also have a pipe bender and custom make duals....you ought to hear my Dakota! Ray It's getting time for y'all to be polishing up your rides for the Spring Meet! Be there, or be Square! Ray Jones On Jan 4, 2005, at 11:02 AM, Warren Anderson wrote: > > > >> >> A couple of years ago I replaced my bias Remington's with Diamondback >> radials(had to do this twice as on the first set the whitewalls all >> turned >> brown). I had ordered them by phone and when they arrived by UPS, I >> threw >> them in my B and headed for the local tire store to have them mounted. > Mind >> you this was a store called Wheel Works and they were one of many >> stores > of >> a large chain of tire stores who you would assume would know something > about >> tires and TUBES. > > > We have seen a number of serious problems generated by tire shops. Big > chain > tire shops and local specialists. One common big mistake they make is > in the > use of air tools to reach final wheel fastener torque. With or without > 'Torque Sticks', air wrenches on street driven vehicles cause a lot of > problems. I did notice that the Flagstaff Sam's Club tire shop uses > manual > torque wrenches. > > A rotating static balance can be accomplished with weights in only one > plain. The dynamic balance is only accomplished with wheel weights in > two > planes (when weights are required). > > It is good practice to powder (talc and I have used baby powder when I > did > not have tire talc) the inside of tires when tubes are used. Always > inflate > fully and deflate then reinflate to road use pressure. > > Tire shops that deal with passenger car tires and truck tires should > have > people that can deal with tube tires in an expert manner. > > We are not a tire shop but do work with tires like the ones on a local > fleet > of Hummers http://hummeraffair.com/. The tires are bias ply things from > Mickey Thompson as all radial tire production is supposedly going to > Iraq. > Run flats for these vehicles are GREASE lubricated between the outer > and > inners. These we will not be working with; one very good man, one > hard, full > day to change out four tires we have been told. > > Warren Anderson > Sedona,AZ > > ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 2 Date: Tue, 04 Jan 2005 22:59:00 -0000 From: "L.Andrew Jugle" Subject: Gas chemistry Isn't MTBE Methyl Tert-Butyl Ethanol???The secret is to get as many complex bonds to condition the fuel rather than explode. Tetra Ethyl Lead was an additive that slowed combustion allowing short chain hydrocarbons in higher compression fuel mixes without pre-detonating allowing longer chain hydrocarbons to burn at same time. TEL helped stabilize cracked long chains in synthetic fuels by giving longer shelf life...about two weeks!! Research numbers are results of comparing fuel explosions in comparison to pure octane (thought to be the ultimate "pure fuel" hydrocarbon). The single cylinder "engine" is fired and height of free piston determines the rating as compared to octane reading as "100". Since the tree huggers could not fathom the concept "octane rating" is now legislated. Try as they might, the environmentalists cannot seem to re-write the laws of thermodynamics. The primary difference of classic 60's Sunoco 260 and todays "Premium" is that modified long chain hydrocarbons aren't there. The fuel physically has less weight. More heat energy is produced and lost to engine and less energy is transffered to pistons. Miles per gallon have been sacrificed to butterfly breath. L. Andrew Jugle, Elmhurst,IL. ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 3 Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2005 18:26:18 -0600 From: Ray Jones Subject: Re: Gas chemistry The real secret is that the Tree Huggers and other environmental groups consist of 3 wacky Scientists , and thousands of rumor loving idiots. All with good intentions, of course. For 20 years we've had constant improvement in Auto emissions, until cars almost run on smog, but they still want more. It all hides the truth that the biggest producers are the power plants and other big industry. They, unlike you and me, contribute heavily to the political campaigns and there-by get waivers. Our gas just goes up. A few years ago, Readers Digest had a story about power companies that sold unused emission credits. If they didn't produce a certain chemical in their exhaust, they could sell that to a plant that produced too much of that chemical, there-by averaging the emissions. This was also the basis of the CA junker buying campaign. Give you some money for your old broke car and get credit for the inflated amounts of emissions not produced by the car for the next 10 years. Then they just gave the Gov the credits instead of fixing their emission problem. Sort of like Social Security, it's not going to run out of money, there is none, just IOU's for the money the Gov has spent for the last 30 years. Ray It's getting time for y'all to be polishing up your rides for the Spring Meet! Be there, or be Square! Ray On Jan 4, 2005, at 4:59 PM, L.Andrew Jugle wrote: > > Isn't MTBE Methyl Tert-Butyl Ethanol???The secret is to get as many > complex bonds to condition the fuel rather than explode. Tetra Ethyl > Lead was an additive that slowed combustion allowing short chain > hydrocarbons in higher compression fuel mixes without pre-detonating > allowing longer chain hydrocarbons to burn at same time. TEL helped > stabilize cracked long chains in synthetic fuels by giving longer > shelf life...about two weeks!! > > Research numbers are results of comparing fuel explosions in > comparison to pure octane (thought to be the ultimate "pure fuel" > hydrocarbon). The single cylinder "engine" is fired and height of > free piston determines the rating as compared to octane reading > as "100". Since the tree huggers could not fathom the > concept "octane rating" is now legislated. Try as they might, the > environmentalists cannot seem to re-write the laws of thermodynamics. > > The primary difference of classic 60's Sunoco 260 and > todays "Premium" is that modified long chain hydrocarbons aren't > there. The fuel physically has less weight. More heat energy is > produced and lost to engine and less energy is transffered to pistons. > > Miles per gallon have been sacrificed to butterfly breath. > > L. Andrew Jugle, Elmhurst,IL. > > > > > > > > To send a message to this group, send an email to: > Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > > For list server instructions, go > tohttp://www.chrysler300club.com/yahoolist/inst.htm > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > ? To visit your group on the web, go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Chrysler300/ > > ? To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > Chrysler300-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > > ? Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to theYahoo! Terms of Service. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 4 Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2005 21:12:01 -0500 From: Subject: Re: Gas chemistry Ray, I don' t know where you live, but it probably isn't California. Those of us who live here are grateful for the substantial improvement in air quality over the last 20 years. Despite enormous growth and vehicle miles travelled, air quality has steadily improved. As a person who is involved in setting vehicle tailpipe standards, all I can say about your comments is that you do not have your facts right, either about scrappage or stationary source emissions or credit programs. I won't go into the details because it rarely helps when someone has their mind made up. Not everyone is as stupid as you might think. Nor is government as corrupt as you suggest. Those of us in this field are doing all we can to improve air quality in an open deliberative process. Perhaps on to other topics more germane to the purpose of this board. Steve Albu ---- Ray Jones wrote: > > The real secret is that the Tree Huggers and other environmental groups > consist of 3 wacky Scientists , and thousands of rumor loving idiots. > All with good intentions, of course. > For 20 years we've had constant improvement in Auto emissions, until > cars almost run on smog, but they still want more. It all hides the > truth that the biggest producers are the power plants and other big > industry. They, unlike you and me, contribute heavily to the political > campaigns and there-by get waivers. Our gas just goes up. > A few years ago, Readers Digest had a story about power companies that > sold unused emission credits. If they didn't produce a certain > chemical in their exhaust, they could sell that to a plant that > produced too much of that chemical, there-by averaging the emissions. > This was also the basis of the CA junker buying campaign. Give you some > money for your old broke car and get credit for the inflated amounts of > emissions not produced by the car for the next 10 years. Then they just > gave the Gov the credits instead of fixing their emission problem. > Sort of like Social Security, it's not going to run out of money, there > is none, just IOU's for the money the Gov has spent for the last 30 > years. > > Ray > > > It's getting time for y'all to be polishing up your rides for the > Spring Meet! Be there, or be Square! Ray > > On Jan 4, 2005, at 4:59 PM, L.Andrew Jugle wrote: > > > > > Isn't MTBE Methyl Tert-Butyl Ethanol???The secret is to get as many > > complex bonds to condition the fuel rather than explode. Tetra Ethyl > > Lead was an additive that slowed combustion allowing short chain > > hydrocarbons in higher compression fuel mixes without pre-detonating > > allowing longer chain hydrocarbons to burn at same time. TEL helped > > stabilize cracked long chains in synthetic fuels by giving longer > > shelf life...about two weeks!! > > > > Research numbers are results of comparing fuel explosions in > > comparison to pure octane (thought to be the ultimate "pure fuel" > > hydrocarbon). The single cylinder "engine" is fired and height of > > free piston determines the rating as compared to octane reading > > as "100".  Since the tree huggers could not fathom the > > concept "octane rating" is now legislated. Try as they might, the > > environmentalists cannot seem to re-write the laws of thermodynamics. > > > > The primary difference of classic 60's Sunoco 260 and > > todays "Premium" is that modified long chain hydrocarbons aren't > > there. The fuel physically has less weight. More heat energy is > > produced and lost to engine and less energy is transffered to pistons. > > > > Miles per gallon have been sacrificed to butterfly breath. > > > > L. Andrew Jugle, Elmhurst,IL. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To send a message to this group, send an email to: > > Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > For list server instructions, go > > tohttp://www.chrysler300club.com/yahoolist/inst.htm > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > � To visit your group on the web, go to: > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Chrysler300/ > >  > > � To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: > > Chrysler300-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > >  > > � Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to theYahoo! Terms of Service. > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > To send a message to this group, send an email to: > Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > > For list server instructions, go to http://www.chrysler300club.com/yahoolist/inst.htm > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ ________________________________________________________________________ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 4 Jan 2005 20:24:33 -0800 From: "Roger Schaaf" Subject: Re: Causion 14.00 per hour at this store for these guys. You are correct that I did not buy the tires there as they do not sell Diamondbacks, however have purchased 6 new sets of tires from these guys the past 4 years. My family members and neighbors have also given their business to these folks. The last set cost me 280.00 per tire for my XJR Jag(18 inch wheels). So I am not just an average rumdum customer who buys his tires elsewhere at a cheap price and have someone else mount them just to save a few bucks. My real point was that never trust anyone to mount your tires if you are not there to watch and guide. In fact I hate to have any work of any kind done on my cars or motorcycles by any shop where I can not watch the action. As most of us know and can all relate tales of woe, a large percentage of them are totally incompetent, will cheat you royally when given the opportunity, sell you much of what you do not need at grossly inflated labor charges(perhaps you all have not heard of the so called "flat rate scheme" so popular in California. I know there are many honest competent shops out there, but picking the pepper out of the flyspecks is about as hard as buying the right stocks that will be going up and not be going down. So I do most all of my own work and service where possible. I have the same feeling when eating in restaurants where I cannot see what is going on in the kitchen. Would probably really give me a good case of religion if I did however. Taping or gluing weights on the insides of the wheels is what I was suggesting as a method to almost get a good dynamic balance in the hands of a competent tire guy using a decent balancer. Most guys either cannot or will not take the time(preferring to just pound a bunch of weights on the outside of your multi-hundred dollar aluminum or wire wheels). Take a look at the beat up edges of some of the aluminum wheels that you will see on late model cars. Much of what you see could be curb rash, but a large percentage of it, is the result of mounting/dismounting of tires using machines not designed to protect these wheels from damage and or poorly trained technicians who should be doing some other line of work. Someone else noted too, those who just "cinch" them up with their 400 ft pound air wrench, thereby stripping threads or warping hubs and wheels. Watch the action when they remove your lug bolts with their 400 pound air wrench when they are doing your reverse threads on your 300. Does all this make anyone else want to watch next time you get your tires mounted at Costco? Roger Schaaf 300 B Calif ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ray Jones" To: "Warren Anderson" Cc: "Listserver" ; ; "Roger Schaaf" Sent: Tuesday, January 04, 2005 2:44 PM Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] Causion > There were 2 basic problems with this tire story. > First and foremost, THEY did NOT sell the tires. (So don't care much) > Secondly, anybody working there for minimum wage isn't that interested > in mounting "Problem" tires, not to mention "tubes". What the heck > are they?. Most kids have never seen them. > > And if they didn't know how to balance Statically (just measure the > wheel and push some buttons on the Balancer), they don't need to work > on my tires. > > Before retiring, I worked at an Acura dealer and was the NSX tech. Had > to mount and balance tires on them and each tire was different. Fronts > and Backs and Lefts and Rights. You just had to focus! > I always spun the bare rim first and marked it's heavy spot, if any. > Then when balancing the tire/rim assembly, if the heavy spot was near > where the rims heavy spot was, I broke it down and shifted the tire > around the rim to get a better (less or no weight) balance. > > And when balancing, I hid stick-on weights behind the webs, almost > dynamic balancing. I deal now with a "good ol' boy" Rural shop, and > they mount everything from 8" wheelbarrow tires to 38" Heavy equipment > tires. Some with tubes and tread liners. They also have a pipe bender > and custom make duals....you ought to hear my Dakota! === message truncated === [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Give the gift of life to a sick child. Support St. Jude Children's Research Hospital's 'Thanks & Giving.' http://us.click.yahoo.com/5iY7fA/6WnJAA/Y3ZIAA/8LmulB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> To send a message to this group, send an email to: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx For list server instructions, go to http://www.chrysler300club.com/yahoolist/inst.htm Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Chrysler300/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: Chrysler300-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/