You'll get a lot of advice about engine swaps for these cars. I am unaware of anything with double the HP that would fit and would pass our friendly smog specs. I too suffer with our Southern California smog rules. Dick Benjamin ----- Original Message ----- From: Paul A. Feeney <paFeeney@xxxxxxxx> To: <mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2002 2:19 PM Subject: Re: IML: 82 Imp EFI won't start/run > Hi Dick, > > I think I'll take your advise on the compression check before I invest any > more time/money into the car. If the motor is bad, I'll probably just yank > it out and replace with something a little more "fun". 135HP doesn't sound > too good to me. This would be such a nice highway cruiser with about 250HP > or more. Nobody likes to get tailgated by kids in Hondas covered with > stickers after all. Have you heard of anyone doing an engine swap into one > of these cars? Keep in mind that I'm in So. California, so it will HAVE TO > pass smog. (we're cool on engine swaps as long as the engine is newer than > the car, and 100% of the smog for the engine follows into the car, including > diagnostics). > > I'll check, and probably change the oil tonight. At the very least I would > guess that the cylinders are getting "washed" with gas at this point. You're > right on when you said I'm getting too much fuel. That's why checking the > pumps/filters hasn't been a priority for me. > > I'll check all the connections, take them apart, clean them with electronic > parts cleaner, apply a little dielectric grease and re-connect checking > continuity on the pins. I don't mind doing this type of work, as long as I > only have to do it once (do it right the first time). > > Thanks again for the info, I may check a lot of this tonight and report my > findings in the morning. > > Paul > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dick Benjamin" <DickB@xxxxxxxxx> > To: <mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> > Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2002 1:14 PM > Subject: Re: IML: 82 Imp EFI won't start/run > > > > These make great daily drivers, as they are superbly comfortable and quiet > > on the road, and get very good mileage. What they are not, though, is > > performers. The are very slow off the line, with the 2:20 rear end, and > > 4500 pounds being pulled by a 135 HP engine. Once you get them rolling, > > however, they will cruise all day at 75 and give you 22 MPG or better > doing > > it. > > > > You can make a good air cleaner gasket with closed cell foam, as used in > > weather-strip (it must be closed cell foam, however, anything else will > let > > the air sneak in there without passing the air flow sensor. This drives > the > > computer mad! > > > > The EFI is throttle body injection, with 4 nozzles feeding 2 cylinders > each > > at low flow rates, and 4 more chiming in for more fuel demand. The > nozzles > > are controlled by fuel pressure, with the low flow nozzles opening below > 20 > > PSI and the higher flow coming on stream above that. This function is > > entirely controlled by pressure operated mechanical plungers in the > > plumbing - no electronics involved at all here. The system monitors RPM, > > throttle position, fuel and air flow, temperature of fuel, air and > coolant, > > time since startup, the O2 content of the exhaust, fuel pressure, brake > > pedal position, ignition key position and perhaps the phase of the moon, > and > > compares this data with pre-programmed and memory data to set the flow of > > fuel. The computer is basically an analog in - analog out device, so it > is > > not much like our modern digital controlled devices at all. > > > > There is no provision for on board diagnostics. The dealers were supplied > > with a test set, which is little more than an box full of switches and > > meters. Some on the IML have this device, but I have not bothered with > > one, as I can learn quite a bit about what is going on with normal test > > equipment. > > > > Chrysler dealers sometimes have parts, more often you have to run your > needs > > on PartsVoice.com to see who can come up with what you need. You will > need > > part numbers, of course. > > > > The fuel filters are under the car near the passenger's door hinge post. > > They are very normal in-line filters, with good availability. Take the > old > > ones into NAPA and match them up. > > > > I think your problem is more likely to be too much fuel than not enough. > If > > you have flames coming out the breather, though, you may a have a cracked > > piston or worse. I think it's time to do a compression check! It also > > would be a good idea to smell the dip stick - if you smell gas, you have a > > bomb waiting to go off there! Drain the crankcase and refill it before > > doing anything else to the car. > > > > Dick Benjamin > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Paul A. Feeney <paFeeney@xxxxxxxx> > > To: <mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2002 9:38 AM > > Subject: Re: IML: 82 Imp EFI won't start/run > > > > > > > Hi Dick, > > > > > > Thanks for the great advise. I'm planning on looking at the car this > > weekend > > > (after tuning-up my 68). If the lid gaskets are bad, is this something a > > > dealer would still have, or should I improvise with a generic seal? I > > > bought this car for next to nothing ($250, it sat for about 5 years) and > I > > > don't mind putting a few bucks into it as I plan to use it as a daily > > driver > > > (kind of). Heck if this engine doesn't work out, I was thinking a newer > > > Magnum 360, or even a V-10 from a truck. > > > > > > At the parts store I ran into a little confusion on fuel filters. It > > listed > > > two types, one seemed to be "normal" with a simply "in" and "out", but > the > > > other had a third, smaller in/outlet. I haven't crawled under the car > yet > > to > > > check what's under there, but I found it interesting, and confusing. > > > > > > I couldn't hear any pumps, pumping, but the engine is obviously getting > > > fuel, as it stinks of gas and will somewhat start. Ever seen fire coming > > > from the crankcase breather??? (the breather hose is gone, but I've > > > completely sealed the inlet the air cleaner housing until I get a new > one) > > > > > > I have a sound understanding of modern fuel injection (which may hurt my > > > chance of understanding this car). I read about the fuel "nozzles". Is > > this > > > just a type of fuel distribution system, all feeding from a centralized, > > > single injector? > > > > > > Also, is there any type of electronic self-diagnosis system on these > cars? > > > Even my 97 Ram (with OBD-II) can be accessed by cycling the key. > > > > > > Are parts still available at the dealer for these cars, or has Chrysler > > left > > > us out in the cold (again)? > > > > > > I appreciate any/all help with this project. > > > > > > Thanks again, > > > > > > Paul > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Dick Benjamin" <DickB@xxxxxxxxx> > > > To: <mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > > Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2002 9:05 AM > > > Subject: Re: IML: 82 Imp EFI won't start/run > > > > > > > > > > Paul; > > > > > > > > This may take a while, and is going to lead you into doing some > research > > > > yourself. As a first step, though, remove the new air filter element > > and > > > > reinstall the lid tightly, just to make sure you don't have an air > leak > > > > induced by a poor fitting air filter element. > > > > > > > > Assuming this is not going to help, the next step is to carefully > > inspect > > > > all the wiring and vacuum hose tubing, making sure all the harnesses > are > > > > completely plugged in with all pins and connectors intact, and that > the > > > > vacuum hose routing is exactly in compliance with the information on > the > > > > passenger inner fender sticker (it's near the hood hinge and may be > > quite > > > > dirty, but it is there.) > > > > > > > > Assuming you haven't yet found a problem, read up in the IML archives > > > about > > > > how to run the car with the air cleaner lid off. Basically, you need > to > > > > fool the computer into ignoring the air flow sensor by telling it that > > you > > > > are cranking to start the engine. > > > > > > > > If you haven't been using the IML archives long, you may need to > search > > > > around a bit before finding the step by step procedure, but it is > there, > > > I'm > > > > sure, because I wrote it. > > > > > > > > Once you know the trick for starting the car with the lid off, have a > > > helper > > > > try to start it while you watch the fuel plumbing lines inside the air > > > > cleaner assembly. I'm guessing you will see some liquid fuel leaking > > > from > > > > somewhere, probably the fuel pressure switch tubing, or the nozzle > > > assembly > > > > valves. This is all very simple stuff, which you can remove, > > disassemble > > > > and clean with spray type carburetor cleaner, so that you get all 8 > > > nozzles > > > > spraying nicely. Then put it back together and reassemble the lid > > etc., > > > to > > > > see if you've fixed anything. > > > > > > > > If still no go, take a very close look at all the other air seals in > the > > > > whole top of engine hardware. Pay particular attention to the lid > > > gasket, > > > > and to the one beneath the hydraulic support assembly. > > > > > > > > If you don't have the two manuals for this car, get busy on eBay or > from > > a > > > > literature dealer and find yourself a set, these are mandatory for > > > > maintaining this car. > > > > > > > > Don't give up - just listen to those of us who have fought our way > > through > > > > all the sin previously committed by the unwashed in trying to get > these > > > cars > > > > to run. Once you have it all back to normal, you will be delighted in > > the > > > > way the car starts, runs, and drives! > > > > > > > > I doubt this is enough information to solve the whole series of > > > complaints, > > > > but see if you can plow through the above and report back to us. > There > > > are > > > > 5 or 6 people on here who know a lot about these cars, and one of us > > will > > > > jump in with good advice on every point. > > > > > > > > If you don't already have one, it is a good idea to pick up a decent > > > analog > > > > type volt-ohmmeter. Radio Shack has an adequate one for under $50. > > > > > > > > As someone else has implied, 90% of the engine problems on these cars > > are > > > > blamed on "that damned EFI", and when it's all said and done, about > 10% > > of > > > > them turn out to be actually related to its being an EFI car. > > > > > > > > Dick Benjamin > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: Paul A. Feeney <paFeeney@xxxxxxxx> > > > > To: <mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > > > Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 12:09 PM > > > > Subject: IML: 82 Imp EFI won't start/run > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi All, > > > > > > > > > > I just bought this car a few weeks ago and have since joined the > club. > > > > > Thanks for welcoming me. I've enjoyed the club so much in the last > > > couple > > > > of > > > > > weeks that I've already gone out and bought a 68 Crown Coupe (runs > > > great, > > > > > 99.9% original from a man who bought it in 69). > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, about my non-running 82. It has the EFI still installed. I > > just > > > > put > > > > > new plugs in it and a new 0-2 sensor, fresh gas, new air filter and > a > > > new > > > > > battery. > > > > > > > > > > Result- If I crank the car FOREVER, it will fire and immediately > > stall. > > > If > > > > I > > > > > give it some gas (step on pedal) as it fires it will increase RPM > and > > > then > > > > > die within a couple of seconds. If I then crank it again it will > fire > > > and > > > > > stay running (very rough) as long as I keep my foot on the gas. WAY > > DOWN > > > > on > > > > > the gas. It will NOT idle, not even close, it will run above about > > 2,500 > > > > rpm > > > > > only and it sounds like it's running on 5-6 cylinders only. Actually > > it > > > > > feels like the plug wires are on wrong (they're not, I checked). > > > > > > > > > > Where should I start? I've read briefly through the info on club > > > > > website but most of it deals with vehicles that idle rough or have > low > > > > > power. Mine just isn't drivable at all. I'm sure that I'm not the > only > > > > > person to come across this problem as I see 81-83 Imps for sale > cheap > > > all > > > > > the time that "don't run". This car is extremely clean. No dents, no > > > rust, > > > > > great interior. As soon as I get it running it will go out for a > fresh > > > > coat > > > > > of paint. > > > > > > > > > > Any help would be greatly appreciated. I'm sure all be back online > > about > > > > > things on my 68 as I learn more about it. I've already had the VERY > > > > painful > > > > > experience of taking a power window motor off the regulator (watch > > out, > > > > this > > > > > thing is like a bear trap as the spring will snap it closed on your > > > hand, > > > > I > > > > > got ten stitches out of it) > > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > > > Paul A. Feeney > > > > > > > > > > 82 Lt Blue EFI Wire Wheel > > > > > 68 Black Crown Coupe > > > > > 97 Dodge Ram 3500 (tow rig) > > > > > 82 Maserati Quattroporte (at least it has a Mopar Trans, starter, > and > > > A/C) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----------------- http://www.imperialclub.com ----------------- > > > > > This message was sent to you by the Imperial Mailing List. Please > > > > > reply to mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and your response will be > > > > > shared with everyone. Private messages (and attachments) for the > > > > > Administrators should be sent to webmaster@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > > To UN-SUBSCRIBE, go to http://imperialclub.com/unsubscribe.htm > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----------------- http://www.imperialclub.com ----------------- > > > > This message was sent to you by the Imperial Mailing List. Please > > > > reply to mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and your response will be > > > > shared with everyone. 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