IML: Ignition Help

[sosmi@xxxxxxxxxxx]

It's pretty sad, when local repair people are put back by basic point type systems. However there are some simple basic things, that you can do yourself. If your spark-plug wires, are the old carbon core type, and more than 5yrs. old, it may be time to up-grade, a simple test, is to open the hood while the engine is running, in a VERY dark place,(night time) and look at the wires, if you see any fire(spark voltage) on the wires, they're done. Spark-plugs can also be a problem, even if you inspect them, and think they look" OK", old fuel, additives,valve seals,rings, and high speed running, can GLAZE deposits on the spark-plug and create a resistive path to ground. As far as cleaning spark-plugs, the only RIGHT way is to use a sand-blast type plug cleaner.Never, Never, wire wheel, or wire brush spark-plugs, by doing so you will burnish the deposits, and transfer the wire material on the spark-plug, creating a better path for grounding, resulting in miss-fire or no fir e.Whether you use, point type or electronic ignitions, the most important factor, is the voltage supply to the system. This voltage should be no less .5-1 volt of battery voltage, if it is then wiring, connections, and possibly ignition switch, are of concern, low voltage in = low spark voltage out. The electronic type ignitions are more forgiving, than the point type. If the voltage drops on the point type, the current demand increases, resulting in over-heated points, and burned contacts, and lower spark voltage.As you can see, there are many factors effecting the performance of the ignition system, there are other factors to discuss, and I would be more than happy  to, if ya'll see the need.Ya'll have a nice Christmas, Dave

 

-------------- Original message --------------
From: JAY D'ANGELO <cadij@xxxxxxxxxxx>

Up until a couple weeks ago, the car ran perfectly, drove it all the way to LA and back.  It just suddenly started to act weird after sitting about a week.  It is a new reman engine with about 2K on it, so the timing chain and gears are new.  I replaced the coil with a blaster II, 40K volts, to go with the Pertronix (after it started acting up).

When I get it back, I'll double check the wires (new with the engine), the cap (also new) and check all the connections and reset the timing.  The fuel pump is also new (I know that new stuff can go bad).  I wonder if one of the wires got cooked if it was too close to the exhaust manifold - but I have to look at it.

I think I'll replace the Petronix and go back to points and a stock coil (the Blaster II would be too much juice, wouldn't it for stock?).

I changed the fuel filter when it started acting up and I also richened up the fuel mixture, to no avail.

Th e problem out here is everyone wants to make a quick buck and no one that I can find knows hows to trouble shoot older stuff, especially all the youngsters who don't even know what an Imperial is, much less a non computerized ignition system.

I know I'm going to find that it was some silly, stupid, simple thing....at least I hope so.

Thanks for the advice.

Jay D'Angelo
64 Iml Cvt
Las Vegas

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> From: jlandis81044@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> To: mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: Re: IML: 64 Iml Cvt engine fire - need alt gauge
> Date: Mon, 25 Dec 2006 11:57:25 -0500
>
> Sounds like crossed plug wire(s) to me.
> >
> > From: randalpark@xxxxxxx
> > Date: 2006/12/25 Mon AM 11:40:28 EST
> > To: mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: Re: IML: 64 Iml Cvt engine fire - need alt gauge
> >
> > Good luck on that.
> >
> > My experience with plug wires has been nothing more than running on six or seven cylinders rather than all 8 and no back firing. If they are all really old (I mean really old) and arcing, then what you describe could happen. You would see blue flashes under the hood in the dark. Are you sure that the distributor cap isn't cracked? Your description doesn't sound as much like a misfire, as maybe a cross fire. I wouldn't be so quick to eliminate th at ignition system either. If it isn't working the way that it is suppose to, it can do the things that you describe. I have experienced the complete failure of electronic ignition systems, and I have also experienced partial failure, caused by loose or dirty connections (check the coil), and ultimately frying sensitive circuitry.
> >
> > I am still concerned about the fire. For that to happen, a spark or heat needs to come into contact with something combustible, like gasoline or some other fluid. That is unless you are running with no air filter and catch the hood insulation pad on fire due to a seriously mistuned engine. Are you sure that isn't a pin hole leak in the pressure hose on your power steering, or maybe the fuel filter or line?
> >
> > Timing chain can skip without hot rod ding the car, but this is very uncommon in the 413, unless the timing gears were replaced with non-original nylon coated ones as were used in the 440 form 1966 o n. If the car truly is running flawlessly on idle, and gradual acceleration, I would be looking for a starving fuel condition that could be caused by incorrect carburation, clogged fuel filter, restricted line, or weak fuel pump. On the ignition side, arcing ignition wires, bad distributor cap, or otherwise weak ignition or coil.
> >
> > Paul W.
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: cadij@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > To: mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Sent: Mon, 25 Dec 2006 6:34 AM
> > Subject: RE: IML: 64 Iml Cvt engine fire - need alt gauge
> >
> >
> > I don't know yet. I don't think it was the carb. They installed a new 1406, same as before and rewired everything.
> >
> > However, when I picked it up, it still was flat spotting and backfiring when I give it more gas. Got to be electrical. I doubt it's the Pertronix ignition module, though. Spent a lot of time researching and found that when they fail, they do so suddenly without any warning.
> >
> > The timing is at 5 degrees BTC; I changed it from about 15. I'm thinking the plugs and wires - sounds like a misfire to me. I had this problem before and found that one of the spark plug boots had come loose and was barely making contact and on acceleration or turns, the engine would falter and pop.
> >
> > I checked the connections before the fire, but perhaps one of the wires or plugs is bad and is causing a misfire. I'll pick the car up again from the shop on Tuesday and I will replace the plug wires and switch to Autolite 85's.
> >
> > Someone mentioned that the timing chain may have jumped. I don't hot rod it, so I can't figure how that may have happened.
> >
> > But, it idles steady as a rock and at slow feed on the gas, there is no problem. Keep your fingers crossed for me - I hope it's the plug s and wires, cause that's a heck of a lot cheaper than alternatives.
> >
> > Thanks all for the suggestions, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year! (Would you believe it snowed in vegas last week?)
> >
> > Jay D'Angelo
> > 64 Iml Cvt
> > Las Vegas
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > To: mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: Re: IML: 64 Iml Cvt engine fire - need alt gauge
> > Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2006 19:49:15 -0500
> > From: randalpark@xxxxxxx
> >
> >
> > I don't recall the actual cause of your fire. Can you briefly tell us again? Was it electrical, fuel, or power steering related?
> >
> > Thanks!
> >
> > Paul W.
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: cadij@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > To: mailing-list@ imperialclub.com
> > Sent: Sat, 23 Dec 2006 3:37 PM
> > Subject: IML: 64 Iml Cvt engine fire - need alt gauge
> >
> >
> > Well, the engine compartment was re-wired by a shop in Las Vegas that specializes in automotive electrical work. They did everything from the fuse box out through the firewall and did a nice job. Instead of wrapping all the wires to make it look original, I opted for the coiled plastic sheathing - looks pretty good actually.
> >
> > The first place I took it to wanted $2300 and, after a week of looking at it, they decided they didn't want to tackle the job. The other outfit did a clean job and only charged $1300, including the new carb.
> >
> > Next week, I will clean up the engine bay and detail everything again; and get a new fire extinguisher. I want to emphasize again the importance of having a FIRE EXTINGUISHER on board - it saved my car.
> >
> > I have o ne problem, though. The alternator gauge got fried when the wire got too hot and I need a replacement.
> >
> > Anyone have a spare working amp gauge for my 64?
> >
> > Jay D'Angelo
> > 64 Iml Cvt
> > Las Vegas
> > 702 400-3749
> >
> >
> >
> >
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