Thanks Dave,
The starter acts strange and it does sometimes stop turning while the key is
in "start" position. I'll run through the tests within the next couple of
weeks. Sooner if it ever won't start. Thanks for the detailed how-to. That's
exactly the kind of explanation I need. I'll try to pick up a mini-starter
somewhere, maybe Carlisle.
As for the shudder, it's very mild. The car seems to have some minor
exhaust leak and when you lay off the gas it makes the kind of noise I
wouldn't expect from such a mild 318. It may just be the exhaust noise. The
front end will need to be gone through so that may be it. It has some really
dead wallowy steering feel. Even for a luxo-barge.
The dash is definitely screwy, I just don't know how screwy. The idiot light
thing bothers me because the other oil and volt lights up when you start,
but the coolant light only flashes. I guess it's because before the car
starts the oil pressure and voltage are low, but the coolant isn't hot.
It's just strange, because I have an '83, but the cars are so different.
Thanks a ton. I'm sure everybody will get to see it have trouble starting
at Carlisle.
Rob
>From: "Dave Grove" <dave@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>Reply-To: mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>To: <mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>Subject: Re: IML: some more '82 questions.
>Date: Thu, 8 Jul 2004 01:39:22 -0400
>
>Rob, - I seem to recall that your starter would stop turning even after it
>had been engaged, - and while you were still holding the key in the start
>position? - Is that correct?
>If so, - then there is definetly something wrong, - with the starter
>itself,
>or perhaps the starter relay, - or maybe even the ignition switch. Coudl
>also be the neutral-safety switch in the transmission I suppose.
>Easy enough to check, - using a test light, - hold it on the starter relay
>connector that goes to the starter (that is probably a brown wire, - about
>a
>12 gauge). As long as the relay is energized (key in the start position),
>-
>you should have voltage here.
>If it goes away, - the starter will stop turning. If it does go away, -
>then hook the test light to the small (18ga) yellow wire. This wire should
>also show battery voltage whenever the key is in the start position. If it
>goes away, - suspect the ignition switch.
>If this stays on, and the starter still quits turning, - then you need to
>check the signal from the N/S switch. You can do this with the test light
>too. Connect the "ground" end of the light to the battery POS terminal.
>Now anything "grounded" that you touch with the end of the test light will
>show "voltage". Touch the small brown with yellow tracer wire (20 gauge, -
>very small), - this wire supplies the ground to the starter realy via the
>N/S switch. If you lose a voltage reading here during cranking, - then
>replace the N/S switch on the transmission (there is also a 3-way connector
>over on the pass side of the engine, - near the firewall, - this wire is
>one
>of these three. Be sure the connector and it's wires are OK).
>If all the above checks out, - then the problem is either with the starter
>itself, - or for some strange reason, - you are losing the battery feed to
>it (you might check the BIG connection at the starter, - it comes directly
>from the battery POS post, - and be sure that the battery "end" is OK).
>On a possibly related note, - I have noticed that these cars have just
>barely enough wiring to reach from the firewall area (more specifically the
>starter relay) to the battery, and anytime a battery terminal has been
>replaced (where they cut off the old one and install one of those
>"temporary" ends (that's what they are - "temporary"), - that after that
>has
>been done, the wiring becomes even shorter (no matter how many times you
>cut
>it off, - it's *still* too short) - all you have to do is "lean" on the
>wiring over in that area (driver's side, - under the hood), and you will
>pull the starter feed wire (the 12ga brown one) right off the starter
>relay, - so check this first. I have been successful at moving the wiring
>around enough to make up for this, - with no further problems. Probably
>depends on how many times the battery terminal has been replaced
>though............
>
>"Shudder"? The torque converter clutch is often the cause of "shudder", -
>but not unless you are "on the gas" some, - won't do it if "coasting"
>(de-cel), - or even just "cruising". Could be a brake caliper starting to
>cause problems (seizing up some).
>
>Starting fluid would indeed work just as well as dribbling a little gas
>into
>the throttle body, - but might be more of a hassle getting it in there
>(taking the air cleaner lid off every time *would* be a hassle). Might be
>OK to just slide the fresh-air hose off and spray it in the "snorkle" I
>would suppose.
>
>I have owned two 81 Imperials. Both of them *did* illumate the dash
>whenever the door handle was lifted.
>As for the "idiot lights", - it sounds to me like the operation you
>describe
>is normal. The "voltage" light will be illuminated whenever the battery
>voltage gets below a certain point (forgot what that point is or I would
>tell you), and the seat belt light will be on for a short time too whenever
>you turn on the ignition. The temp light should illuminate when the
>starter
>is being engaged. This was called a "bulb check" function, - but I think
>they have gotten away from that in later years.
>
>The operation of the speedometer display that you describe (the way the
>bars
>light up) is *not* normal however.
>
>Hope some of that helps......
>
>Regards,
>DaveG.
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Rob P" <fristpenny@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>To: <mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>Sent: Thursday, July 08, 2004 12:20 AM
>Subject: IML: some more '82 questions.
>
>
> > I am now pretty certain that my starter is messed up. Won't be able to
>mess
> > with it too much over the next week or so. I tried the fuel down the
>wing
> > nut trick, once it seemed to work and once it didn't. Is there any
>reason
>I
> > shouldn't use starter fluid? I really don't want to carry gas around.
> >
> > The car has a moderate shudder at highway speeds. Particularly on
>coasting.
> > Is this likely the lock up converter? I'm wondering if that may be
>related
> > to the starter problem, since it occaisionally sounds like the teeth are
> > off.
> >
> > The dash also acts strangely. The speedo has almost all the bars lit all
>the
> > time. The ones for the speed you are actually going are a little
>brighter.
> > The km/h lights up and flashes in time with the low fuel light. The
>dash
> > goes on when you pull on the door handle. I don't think it's supposed
>to
>do
> > that. Any possible common cause for any/all of these problems. I'm
>hoping
> > there is a ground problem causing some of it. Also, the idiot lights
>for
> > volts and seat belt come on when you turn the key to start. The light
>for
> > temp only comes on when the car is cranking. Which is normal?
> >
> > Thanks for all the help so far. In a month or two I may be able to
> > concentrate on the dents.
> >
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