-------------- Original message --------------
From: therichardsonfamily@xxxxxxxxxxx
> I just love this forum! It's a fantastic opportunity to learn so much about
> these cars. Everything from theory, to engineering, to practical tips.
>
> >From what I understand, the heat riser should be turned clockwise to be held
> open, as viewed from the passenger fender. I'm not going to worry about the
> engineering of the opening action until I pull the manifold and set it up
> correctly.
>
> Again, thank you to everyone for the input.
>
> Dan Richardson
> 300L Family Heirloom
>
>
> -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: sosmi@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > Bob, not to make things fuzzy, but let me make a couple points: first if the
> > valve clock spring was truly designed to be thermostatic in operation, it
> would
> > be in a protected environment, enclosed so not to be affected by road
> elements,
> > such as wind generated by movement, rain, snow ,puddles etc.These would all
> > effect the spring. Also, the spring (clock style) is wound such that when it
> > closed, it's at least tension, or compression, to open the valve increases
> > tension. Now, most all clock style bi-metalic springs I've, seen, increase
> when
> > heated (expand) in that case, it would tend to keep the riser valve shut that
> > much more.Hope this helps, Dave.
> >
> > -------------- Original message --------------
> > From: "Bob Merritt"
> >
> > > Dave is seldom wrong but I disagree with "is not a thermal spring".
> > >
> > > >From page 11-5 and 11-6 of the 1962 ser vice manual:
> > >
> > > "When a cold engine is started the thermostatic coil exerts enough tension
> > > to keep the valve closed. This exhaust gases from the right exhaust manifold
> > > pass through the exhaust crossover branch in the intake manifold and into
> > > the left exhaust manifold.
> > >
> > > When the spring heats up, it loses tension and the valve opens."
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Also, same page of the service manual shows the valve is open when rotated
> > > clockwise, as others have previously replied correctly.
> > >
> > > Bob Merritt
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From:
> > > To:
> > > Sent: Friday, August 17, 2007 1:13 PM
> > > Subject: Re: IML: Heat rise r rotation?
> > >
> > >
> > > > The clock spring on the riser valve is not a thermal spring. Opening and
> > > > closing, is a function of exhaust gas flow(volume). When closed, all
> > > > exhaust gas runs through the passage under the carb, this pre-heats the
> > > > mixture for better cold weather warm-up.However if the valve is stuck shut
> > > > ALL exhaust from the right bank, will pass through the manifold with less
> > > > than a one square inch of passage.This only leads to poor performance, and
> > > > lean carb conditions. There was also a small coil spring, for anti-rattle
> > > > at low speed, or idle.Ya'll have a nice day, Dave.
> > > >
> > > > -------------- Original message --------------
> > > > From: David Wilker
> > > >
> > > >> Y ou could try finding another car with a working valve, and try it. See
> > > >> which
> > > >> way the valve opens. The spring will expand when it gets hot, so my guess
> > > >> would
> > > >> "against" the spring pressure. Maybe try moving it when the engine is
> > > >> running
> > > >> and seeing which way makes the engine run best?Isn't there a cross-over
> > > >> passage
> > > >> through the intake manifold to allow that side of the exhoust to go out
> > > >> the
> > > >> other manifold? I think it was to heat the intake up on cold starts.
> > > >> --
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> David C. Wilker Jr.
> > > >> USAF (RET)
> > > >>
> > > >> ---- randalpark@xxxxxxx wr ote:
> > > >> I have seen the counter weight slip on these, particularly between '64
> > > >> and '66. The only way to determine with certainty that the valve is
> > > >> open is to remove the exhaust pipe and look. The idea of comparing the
> > > >> amount of exhaust coming from the right side vs. the left side is a
> > > >> good one, but most Imperials built since 1962 have a single exhaust
> > > >> pipe, rendering this test useless.
> > > >>
> > > >> If the valve is stuck closed the car will over heat. If the valve isn't
> > > >> stuck, then it will always open when the engine is "reved". The counter
> > > >> weight isn't strong enough to keep it closed. If it is moving, it is
> > > >> working fine. If it isn't moving, then you should be concerned.
> > > >&g t;
> > > >> Paul W.
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> -----Original Message-----
> > > >> From: nicholasadamo@xxxxxxx
> > > >> To: mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > >> Sent: Thu, 16 Aug 2007 5:38 pm
> > > >> Subject: Re: IML: Heat riser rotation?
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> So Dave, I've wondered about this too. If the valve is open (engine
> > > >> warm position), it is rotated all the way clockwise??? The cold
> > > >> position would be all the way counter-clockwise or too the left? I am
> > > >> correct??
> > > >>
> > > >> -----Original Message-----
> > > >> From: sosmi@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > > >> To: mailing-list@imperialclub. com
> > > >> Sent: Thu, 16 Aug 2007 4:52 pm
> > > >> Subject: Re: IML: Heat riser rotation?
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> NOT a dumb question, If memory serves me correctly, the valve rotates
> > > >> clockwise. There should be a stop pin which prevents the valve from
> > > >> opening past center.If you feel a lot of restriction opening the valve,
> > > >> its possible to break the spot welds on the valve, and it will remain
> > > >> shut.If you have dual exhaust, have someone listen to the right pipe
> > > >> for a louder exhaust sound, when you open the valve.This is one of the
> > > >> simplest issues for performance, and mileage that goes un-checked.When
> > > >> we remove the manifolds, we remove the valve completely.Ya'll have a
> > > >> nice day, Dave.
> > > >>
> > > >> Â
> > > >>
> > > >> -------------- Original message --------------
> > > >> From: therichardsonfamily@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > > >>
> > > >> > Dumb question time:
> > > >> >
> > > >> > On a '67 440 (from an Imperial - required content), looking at it
> > > >> from the
> > > >> > passenger's fender, which way does the heat riser rotate as it opens?
> > > >> I suspect
> > > >> > mine does not work correctly and I want to wire it open.
> > > >> >
> > > >> > Dan Richardson
> > > >> > 300L Family Heirloom
> > > >> >
> > > >> > ----------------- http://www.imperialclub .com -----------------
> > > >> > This message was sent to you by the Imperial Mailing List. Please
> > > >> > reply to mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and your response will be
> > > >> > shared with everyone. Private messages (and attachments) for the
> > > >> > Administrators should be sent to iml.webmonster@xxxxxxxxx
> > > >> > To UN-SUBSCRIBE, go to http://imperialclub.com/unsubscribe.htm
> > > >> >
> > > >>
> > > >>
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> > > >>
> > > >>
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> > > >>
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> > > >>
> > > >>
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> > > >>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
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> >
>
From: | therichardsonfamily@xxxxxxxxxxx |
To: | mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx |
Subject: | Re: IML: Heat riser rotation? |
Date: | Fri, 17 Aug 2007 21:12:54 +0000 |
From: | sosmi@xxxxxxxxxxx |
To: | mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx |
Subject: | Re: IML: Heat riser rotation? |
Date: | Fri, 17 Aug 2007 19:44:21 +0000 |
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "Bob Merritt" <bob@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Dave is seldom wrong but I disagree with "is not a thermal spring".
>
> >From page 11-5 and 11-6 of the 1962 service manual:
>
> "When a cold engine is started the thermostatic coil exerts enough tension
> to keep the valve closed. This exhaust gases from the right exhaust manifold
> pass through the exhaust crossover branch in the intake manifold and into
> the left exhaust manifold.
>
> When the spring heats up, it loses tension and the valve opens."
>
>
>
> Also, same page of the service manual shows the valve is open when rotated
> clockwise, as others have previously replied correctly.
>
> Bob Merritt
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From:
> To:
> Sent: Friday, August 17, 2007 1:13 PM
> Subject: Re: IML: Heat riser rotation?
>
>
> > The clock spring on the riser valve is not a thermal spring. Opening and
> > closing, is a function of exhaust gas flow(volume). When closed, all
> > exhaust gas runs through the passage under the carb, this pre-heats the
> > mixture for better cold weather warm-up.However if the valve is stuck shut
> > ALL exhaust from the right bank, will pass through the manifold with less
> > than a one square inch of passage.This only leads to poor performance, and
> > lean carb conditions. There was also a small coil spring, for anti-rattle
> > at low speed, or idle.Ya'll have a nice day, Dave.
> >
> > -------------- Original message --------------
> > From: David Wilker
> >
> >> You could try finding another car with a working valve, and try it. See
> >> which
> >> way the valve opens. The spring will expand when it gets hot, so my guess
> >> would
> >> "against" the spring pressure. Maybe try moving it when the engine is
> >> running
> >> and seeing which way makes the engine run best?Isn't there a cross-over
> >> passage
> >> through the intake manifold to allow that side of the exhoust to go out
> >> the
> >> other manifold? I think it was to heat the intake up on cold starts.
> >> --
> >>
> >>
> >> David C. Wilker Jr.
> >> USAF (RET)
> >>
> >> ---- randalpark@xxxxxxx wrote:
> >> I have seen the counter weight slip on these, particularly between '64
> >> and '66. The only way to determine with certainty that the valve is
> >> open is to remove the exhaust pipe and look. The idea of comparing the
> >> amount of exhaust coming from the right side vs. the left side is a
> >> good one, but most Imperials built since 1962 have a single exhaust
> >> pipe, rendering this test useless.
> >>
> >> If the valve is stuck closed the car will over heat. If the valve isn't
> >> stuck, then it will always open when the engine is "reved". The counter
> >> weight isn't strong enough to keep it closed. If it is moving, it is
> >> working fine. If it isn't moving, then you should be concerned.
> >>
> >> Paul W.
> >>
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: nicholasadamo@xxxxxxx
> >> To: mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >> Sent: Thu, 16 Aug 2007 5:38 pm
> >> Subject: Re: IML: Heat riser rotation?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> So Dave, I've wondered about this too. If the valve is open (engine
> >> warm position), it is rotated all the way clockwise??? The cold
> >> position would be all the way counter-clockwise or too the left? I am
> >> correct??
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: sosmi@xxxxxxxxxxx
> >> To: mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >> Sent: Thu, 16 Aug 2007 4:52 pm
> >> Subject: Re: IML: Heat riser rotation?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> NOT a dumb question, If memory serves me correctly, the valve rotates
> >> clockwise. There should be a stop pin which prevents the valve from
> >> opening past center.If you feel a lot of restriction opening the valve,
> >> its possible to break the spot welds on the valve, and it will remain
> >> shut.If you have dual exhaust, have someone listen to the right pipe
> >> for a louder exhaust sound, when you open the valve.This is one of the
> >> simplest issues for performance, and mileage that goes un-checked.When
> >> we remove the manifolds, we remove the valve completely.Ya'll have a
> >> nice day, Dave.
> >>
> >> Â
> >>
> >> -------------- Original message --------------
> >> From: therichardsonfamily@xxxxxxxxxxx
> >>
> >> > Dumb question time:
> >> >
> >> > On a '67 440 (from an Imperial - required content), looking at it
> >> from the
> >> > passenger's fender, which way does the heat riser rotate as it opens?
> >> I suspect
> >> > mine does not work correctly and I want to wire it open.
> >> >
> >> > Dan Richardson
> >> > 300L Family Heirloom
> >> >
> >> > ----------------- http://www.imperialclub.com -----------------
> >> > This message was sent to you by the Imperial Mailing List. Please
> >> > reply to mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and your response will be
> >> > shared with everyone. Private messages (and attachments) for the
> >> > Administrators should be sent to iml.webmonster@xxxxxxxxx
> >> > To UN-SUBSCRIBE, go to http://imperialclub.com/unsubscribe.htm
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >> ------------------------------------------------------------
> >> AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free
> >> from AOL at AOL.com.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ________________________________________________________________________
> >> AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free
> >> from AOL at AOL.com.
> >> =0
> >>
> >> ----------------- http://www.imperialclub.com -----------------
> >> This message was sent to you by the Imperial Mailing List. Please
> >> reply to mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and your response will be
> >> shared with everyone. Private messages (and attachments) for the
> >> Administrators should be sent to iml.webmonster@xxxxxxxxx
> >> To UN-SUBSCRIBE, go to http://imperialclub.com/unsubscribe.htm
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ----------------- http://www.imperialclub.com -----------------
> >> This message was sent to you by the Imperial Mailing List. Please
> >> re ply to mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and your response will be
> >> shared with everyone. Private messages (and attachments) for the
> >> Administrators should be sent to iml.webmonster@xxxxxxxxx
> >> To UN-SUBSCRIBE, go to http://imperialclub.com/unsubscribe.htm
> >>
>
>
>
>
> ----------------- http://www.imperialclub.com -----------------
> This message was sent to you by the Imperial Mailing List. Please
> reply to mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx and your response will be
> shared with everyone. Private messages (and attachments) for the
> Administrators should be sent to iml.webmonster@xxxxxxxxx
> To UN-SUBSCRIBE, go to http://imperialclub.com/unsubscribe.htm
>