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mhl0125 |
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Regular Posts: 65 Location: Medford, NJ 08055 | I have a 1961 Chrysler New Yorker 4-door hardtop. I need a windshield. Someone is advertising new LOF reproduction windshields for $425 on eBay. He said these will fit exactly except they are not the bubble type. What is a bubble type windshield? Does my car have one? What will the difference be if I buy one that is not bubble type? Thanks for the help. | ||
dukeboy |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 6203 Location: Big pimpin' | Not really sure, but I think the "Bubble" type he's refering to is like the '59 plymouth Windshield VS the '57-'58 type....I don't think they are interchangable... If I'm Not mistaken, the "Bubble" type is taller than the Flat type...Woul need a pic. of your windshield for some here to tell if it's the "Bubble" type or not... Edited by dukeboy 2009-02-11 8:17 PM | ||
1960fury |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 7400 Location: northern germany | mhl0125 - 2009-02-11 8:06 PM I have a 1961 Chrysler New Yorker 4-door hardtop. I need a windshield. Someone is advertising new LOF reproduction windshields for $425 on eBay. He said these will fit exactly except they are not the bubble type. What is a bubble type windshield? Does my car have one? What will the difference be if I buy one that is not bubble type? Thanks for the help. your car (1961) shouldn't have a bubble windshield, however the 1960 bubble windshield fits 61s too. (my 60 fury/60 desoto have "straight" 61 windshields) | ||
crvsir |
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Elite Veteran Posts: 967 Location: Canada | Note the curve of the windshield at top of the glass where it meets the roof header, bubble like.... (zWinter Storage 009.jpg) Attachments ---------------- zWinter Storage 009.jpg (67KB - 401 downloads) | ||
crvsir |
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Elite Veteran Posts: 967 Location: Canada | My understanding is some repros just have a straight angle bottom to top, no curve (bubble) at the top.. | ||
imopar380 |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 7207 Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada | 1960 through 1964 Chrysler windshields are all interchangeable, - the windshield opening is the same for all years, however 1960 used the compound curved windshield, with the " bubble " on the top. It was not used on 1961 and up but will fit them all, and many 1960 Chryslers, Plymouths, Dodges and DeSotos have been retrofitted with the non compound curved windshield as there are simply more of them around. 1958 -1959 compound curve windshields look very similar to the 1960 versions but are slightly different and are not interchangeable. The blue car is a 60 with the compound curve windshield, the red car is a '61 with the standard flat version, no curve on top. <br /> Edited by imopar380 2009-02-11 11:54 PM (6553b.jpg) (60974b_Side_Profile.jpg) Attachments ---------------- 6553b.jpg (44KB - 363 downloads) 60974b_Side_Profile.jpg (45KB - 354 downloads) | ||
mhl0125 |
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Regular Posts: 65 Location: Medford, NJ 08055 | Thank you all such much for all of the information. This is a big help> | ||
d500neil |
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Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil! Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca | Over on the (appropriate, but neglected) Body/Glass Board, I had Clive post a photo of Larry Welk's 57 Dodge CRL convertible, which appears not to have a compound curved windshield installed on it. I had thought that all the 57 convertibles, with the exception of Plymouth, had had the c.-c'ed windshields installed. Can anyone comment on the matter of compound curved windshields as per 57 and/or 58 Dodge convertibles? | ||
1960fury |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 7400 Location: northern germany | crvsir - 2009-02-11 8:27 PM Note the curve of the windshield at top of the glass where it meets the roof header, bubble like.... that picture makes want to have a 59 new yorker or saratoga! i love that car! just needs wide whitewalls and spinner caps! | ||
59CRL |
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Expert Posts: 2679 | 1960fury - 2009-02-12 2:25 PM crvsir - 2009-02-11 8:27 PM Note the curve of the windshield at top of the glass where it meets the roof header, bubble like.... that picture makes want to have a 59 new yorker or saratoga! i love that car! just needs wide whitewalls and spinner caps! The Bubble windsheild was also used in 59, thats what my 59 Dodge has...... | ||
firedome |
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Expert Posts: 3155 Location: NY & VT | Neil, I was always under the impression that the '58 converts and hardtops were the first to have the compound "bubble" windshields... a perusal of the brochures seems to verify that, but I'm not positive. I have the huge 55-59 factory parts book, I'll see if that will tell me. It's possible that in the parts book, the later type superceded the flat type, if both will, in actuality, fit. | ||
d500neil |
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Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil! Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca | Roger, I know: the 57 verts were all supposed to have the bubble-glass, and appearances can be deceiving, but, that photo I posted of Welk's car sure looks like it's got a standard W/S on it. | ||
firedome |
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Expert Posts: 3155 Location: NY & VT | Maybe it was the hardtops that first got it in '58 - I'm working off memory from Mopar lore I heard in the 70s or 80s, back in the Sherwood Kahlenberg WPC days... a bad idea when you're pushin' 60 yourself! Edited by firedome 2009-02-19 5:17 PM | ||
d500neil |
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Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil! Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca | It was the 58 Hardtops, that got all the bubbles (except for poor-Plymmie), but the 57 verts were all (including PLY??) supposed to get the bubbles on them.. | ||
mhl0125 |
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Regular Posts: 65 Location: Medford, NJ 08055 | For 1961 is the windshield the same for a sedan as a four door hardtop? | ||
wizard |
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Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+ Posts: 13049 Location: Southern Sweden - Sturkö island | Yes it's the same | ||
59savoy |
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Expert Posts: 2338 Location: central oklahoma! | the 1960 belvedere had bubbles. | ||
Chrycoman |
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Expert Posts: 1819 Location: Vancouver, BC | For 1957-59 windshields from Chrysler Corporation parts books, 1957-59, showing both the Chrysler Corp. part numbers and the NAGS - Imperial : (26"x78") : W465 : 1957-1958 (clear) 1651431 (Solex) 1690871 Sedans / wagons : (24"x74") : W454 : 1957-59 (all) (clear) 1681706 (Solex) 1775045 Hardtops : (24"x74") : W451 : 1957 (all); 1958 (Plymouth) (clear) 1681710 (Solex) 1775046 Convertibles : (28"x76") : W453 : 1957-1959 (all) Hardtops : 1958 (Dodge,DeSoto,Chrysler); 1959 (all) (clear) 1695690 (Solex) 1759485 The last windshield, W453, is the bubble top unit while the W451 is the flat windshield. The sedan/wagon windshield glass will only fit 1957-59 sedans and wagons while the other two are interchangeable. | ||
Lancer Mike |
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Location: The Mile High City | My body shop was able to find a W451 windshield for my '58 Dodge convertible - a W453 windshield should be in there. If we can't find the W453, am I just begging for trouble keeping the W451 and trying to place that in? | ||
Finsinthemirror |
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Elite Veteran Posts: 1115 Location: CA | My '57 dodge conv has the compound curve glass with factory marking. | ||
Chrispy |
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Extreme Veteran Posts: 520 Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado | Ive got a tinted w453 that i pulled out of a junkyard with some funk between the layers at the base (i think it can be cleaned?) i'd love to use in my 58 plymouth but comparing the windshield openings between a 453 car and my 451 plymouth makes me think it wouldn't work. Ill post up some pics in the next few days. Edited by Chrispy 2011-06-20 6:58 PM | ||
ttotired |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 8443 Location: Perth Australia | There are both types on ebay I see them most of the time when i search for bits and pieces for my car. The bubble one is at about $1500.00 us while the flat one is just under $400.00. Would love to get the right one, but economics will most likely decide this | ||
GregCon |
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Expert Posts: 2524 Location: Houston | I actually like the look of the flat glass more. | ||
Chrycoman |
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Expert Posts: 1819 Location: Vancouver, BC | Chrispy - 2011-06-20 6:56 PM Ive got a tinted w453 that i pulled out of a junkyard with some funk between the layers at the base (i think it can be cleaned?) i'd love to use in my 58 plymouth but comparing the windshield openings between a 453 car and my 451 plymouth makes me think it wouldn't work. Ill post up some pics in the next few days. The 453 (bubble) and 451 (flat) will interchange. They were both used on hardtop and convertible models, depending upon model and year. The sedan/wagon windshield will fit only sedans and wagons as the glass is shorter top to bottom. Likewise the hardtop/convertible glass will not fit sedans and wagons. This is for the 1957-59 models. For 1960 Plymouth, Dodge, DeSoto and Chrysler windshields were the same for all body styles and fit all four car lines, and will not fit 1957-59 models. The bubble 1960 and flat 1961 will fit all 1960-61 Plymouths, 1960-61 Dodges, 1960-61 DeSotos, 1960-64 Chryslers and 1962-64 Dodge 880s. Windshields were laminated - two pieces of glass with a thin layer of plastic glued between. After a few years the glass and laminate will start to go their separate ways appearing as a foggy section along the edge of the glass. Many cars in the 1930's through 1950's also used laminated glass in their side windows - same problems as time goes by. | ||
mikes2nd |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 5006 | BLAST from the past! Is this true? Are there any 2d ht 58 Plymouths with a bubble top? Obviously the gasket is the same? Since it fits in the same frame? Obviously the converts used this windshield.. but is it really possible to put one in a 2 door ht? oh wait... I would have to have the bubble top "window trim" wouldn't I? Edited by mikes2nd 2015-04-21 3:00 PM | ||
big m |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 7807 Location: Williams California | The roof is actually shorter on the cars that use the bubble type windshield. Fitting one into a '57-8 Plymouth coupe would be a challenging feat without replacing the entire roof. ---John | ||
Ray |
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Expert Posts: 1497 Location: Fairfax, Minnesota | imopar380 - 2009-02-11 10:46 PM 1960 through 1964 Chrysler windshields are all interchangeable, - the windshield opening is the same for all years, however 1960 used the compound curved windshield, with the " bubble " on the top. It was not used on 1961 and up but will fit them all, and many 1960 Chryslers, Plymouths, Dodges and DeSotos have been retrofitted with the non compound curved windshield as there are simply more of them around. 1958 -1959 compound curve windshields look very similar to the 1960 versions but are slightly different and are not interchangeable. The blue car is a 60 with the compound curve windshield, the red car is a '61 with the standard flat version, no curve on top. Ian, I still haven't done anything with the bubble windshield that I found at a salvage yard. Although I found it in the back of a 62 Chysler wagon, I had better determine what year I have before I try to use or sell it. Any idea as to how I can tell the difference? Thanks | ||
imopar380 |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 7207 Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada | Ray - 2015-04-21 5:00 PM Ian, I still haven't done anything with the bubble windshield that I found at a salvage yard. Although I found it in the back of a 62 Chysler wagon, I had better determine what year I have before I try to use or sell it. Any idea as to how I can tell the difference? Thanks Not sure unless you can get a P/N on it somewhere. Edited by imopar380 2015-04-22 12:18 AM | ||
Ray |
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Expert Posts: 1497 Location: Fairfax, Minnesota | I still haven't done anything with the bubble windshield that I found at a salvage yard. Although I found it in the back of a 62 Chysler wagon, I had better determine what year I have before I try to use or sell it. Any idea as to how I can tell the difference? Thanks Anyone? | ||
ronbo97 |
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Expert Posts: 4042 Location: Connecticut | Measure it with a tape measure. How tall ? How wide ? Then compare these numbers with a known hardtop or sedan. Ron | ||
ARIZONA-CLASSIC |
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Veteran Posts: 103 Location: Phoenix, Arizona | I always thought the "straight" windshields were inexpensive aftermarket glass, not originally installed by mother Mopar. We use the very high quality Finnish made bubble windshields in most all cars we work on but every now and again we use cheaper glass (you can't allways spend $1500 on a windshield) on cars that are not as valuable. We order the bubble windshields straight from the maker in Finland and at our restoration shop in Arizona we sell both the cheaper straight glass and the more expensive but correct bubbe windshields. I know most dealers get $1500-$1600 plus anything from $150 to $250 for shipping, we sell them a little cheaper. Last week we recieved 7 new windshields, 5 1957-59 Mopar convertible and 1958-59 2 and 4 dr ht glass plus 2 1960-64 Mopar windshields from Finland. One of the 1960-64 windshields is spoken for already. It takes 3-6 months from ordering to recieving the glass when we order from Finland so it's not as fast as getting the cheaper glass that we get from a distributer in Los Angeles. Bo. | ||
imopar380 |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 7207 Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada | The non bubble windshields were standard on closed cars from 1961 through 1964, but the convertibles still used the compound curved ( bubble) type. Yes, the flat type were installed new by Mother Mopar! | ||
Adventurer 60 |
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Elite Veteran Posts: 827 Location: tailFinland | If there is one good thing here in Finland, it's gotta be windshield and rear glass availability to forward-look Mopars. You guys actually should be thankful for those finnish Mopar guys who took their glasses to the shop and said "make me one of these". First windshield is the most expensive. After that it is just baking them more when there is the mold. Edited by Adventurer 60 2015-05-28 3:38 AM | ||
Ray |
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Expert Posts: 1497 Location: Fairfax, Minnesota | Here is a comparison; 57 Chrysler vs 60 Chrysler bubble windshield. The difference in camera angle and lighting may be a culprit, but it appears as if the 57 has the bubble nearer the top and therefore it has a more radical angle?
Edited by Ray 2015-05-31 11:25 PM (lores bubble close crop.jpg) Attachments ---------------- lores bubble close crop.jpg (245KB - 317 downloads) | ||
Ray |
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Expert Posts: 1497 Location: Fairfax, Minnesota | Chrycoman - 2009-03-03 2:09 AM For 1957-59 windshields from Chrysler Corporation parts books, 1957-59, showing both the Chrysler Corp. part numbers and the NAGS - Imperial : (26"x78") : W465 : 1957-1958 (clear) 1651431 (Solex) 1690871 Sedans / wagons : (24"x74") : W454 : 1957-59 (all) (clear) 1681706 (Solex) 1775045 Hardtops : (24"x74") : W451 : 1957 (all); 1958 (Plymouth) (clear) 1681710 (Solex) 1775046 Convertibles : (28"x76") : W453 : 1957-1959 (all) Hardtops : 1958 (Dodge,DeSoto,Chrysler); 1959 (all) (clear) 1695690 (Solex) 1759485 The last windshield, W453, is the bubble top unit while the W451 is the flat windshield. The sedan/wagon windshield glass will only fit 1957-59 sedans and wagons while the other two are interchangeable. The measurements on the window that I have --following outside curve -- 27 1/16" high by 72 1/6 width". Directly across, width is approximately 63 1/2" Since this glass doesn't appear to match any of the 57-59 measurements provided, the odds are that I have the 60s version? | ||
di_ch_NY56 |
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Expert Posts: 1530 Location: ZH, Switzerland | imopar380 - 2009-02-11 5:46 AM 1960 through 1964 Chrysler windshields are all interchangeable, - the windshield opening is the same for all years, however 1960 used the compound curved windshield, with the " bubble " on the top. It was not used on 1961 and up but will fit them all, and many 1960 Chryslers, Plymouths, Dodges and DeSotos have been retrofitted with the non compound curved windshield as there are simply more of them around. 1958 -1959 compound curve windshields look very similar to the 1960 versions but are slightly different and are not interchangeable. The blue car is a 60 with the compound curve windshield, the red car is a '61 with the standard flat version, no curve on top.
From the impression of my Letter - it has a standard flat windshield or a very slight bubbled windshield. I don't know if it was ever exchanged. From the seller I know and personally I recognised the dent in the windshield. It's a small dent from a stone my Letter got once in his live. The windshield on my Letter is not that pronounced like your Saratoga, but more pronounced than the red convertible.
Happy Motoring!
Dieter Edited by di_ch_NY56 2015-06-01 2:29 PM | ||
alaskaracer |
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Regular Posts: 59 | I bought a rubber gasket (my 58 D500) from Andy Bernbaum Auto Parts - fingers crossed. Anyone use parts from him? | ||
philcojohn |
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Member Posts: 16 | above it states W451 and W453 can interchange, yet in the list of windshields above, supposedly from parts book (?) they have differing inch dimensions.Something is wrong? one person talks about buyng a bubble one which then did not fit ,although post was murky, maybe he mixed up seda nand hardtop or 4 dr (hard to belive that though) So will the bubble 453 fit a 57 Dodge hardtop? came with 451. Another pewrson talks about a "longer roof" , but that cannot be either? 57-59? | ||
Powerflite |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 9670 Location: So. Cal | I wouldn't attempt to put a bubble windshield in a '57 hardtop. They have a roof overhang that would make it look really funky. It may make it difficult/impossible to fit the roof trim on afterward too, depending on how far down it extends. Save the bubbles for '58-'59 or convertibles with smooth roofs. However, I do believe that they are completely interchangeable in terms of size. At least I know that flat windshields are used in place of bubble ones all the time. | ||
mikes2nd |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 5006 | well I was going to cut the over hang back and replace it with the complete "frame" not just try to fit glass in there. John said the 58 roof is lower than the 57 though, which means I would need to bring the lower lip up to match the top and not use custom glass(cost prohibitive) welding a new lower lip isnt a bad idea, if its small distance it would be fine and easy. The 57 300C custom (Black one with a 58 dodge roof) probably chopped the whole thing off. I have a complete bubble top setup (new glass, steel window frame cut 1 foot back off roof and gasket) and trim that I can put in my 300C or my 58 Plymouth.
How much higher is the 57 vs the 58 car roof? Edited by mikes2nd 2017-07-18 7:31 PM | ||
scottbit |
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Veteran Posts: 166 | W451-1957 and w453 -58-59 will not interchange they are different shapes, w451 is about 1 inch shorter in height as the 1957 roof is longer and overhangs in the front and the windshield fits under the roof. 58-59 roofs are the same height but shorter in front and the taller bubble windshield meets the roof at its front edge rather than sitting under the roof as in the 57's side curve is slightly different as well, 1957 hardtop vent windows and frames are not interchangeable with 58-59 for that reason. The confusion results I believe because as the bubble windshields are more difficult to make that aftermarket glass manufactures make a straight replacement glass that fits the w453 opening, those are the $400 replacement windshields, the $1400 imported ones have the original bubble. | ||
Powerflite |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 9670 Location: So. Cal | Thanks for clearing that up, scottbit. That makes a lot of sense now. Edited by Powerflite 2017-07-18 9:21 PM | ||
mikes2nd |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 5006 | eh some wrong info, the "new" 453 is not a "straight" windshield its just not as sharp as curve, and its new and I got mine for like 225$ I can live with a little less curve. I also have the 58 door parts, the entire front window "frame" cut with 1 foot back off the roof, the seal etc. once I get my 57 Royal under way, I will be moving this bubble top to one of my cars(either the 58 Plymouth or 57 300C). | ||
scottbit |
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Veteran Posts: 166 | To further clarify my above comment refers to Chrysler, Desoto and Dodge, Plymouth stayed with the front roof overhang and the w451 windshield for 1958 and did not get the short roof and w453 tell 1959. I believe all 1960 cars had a bubble style windshield. In 1961 they went to a flat style for everything except convertibles which kept the bubble style through 1964. Windshield was a new shape, more laid back starting with the 1960 unibody cars but all models 1960 through 1962 used the same windshield. | ||
philcojohn |
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Member Posts: 16 | thank you Scott...so w451 only on 57 Dodge, or any 57, and any straights or almost straights replacing 453 bubbles are not a W451. They are a third thing. A better way to say all this is if roof overhangs the windshield, all 57 and some 58 plymouths, any bubble does not fit and is a different overall size .58 up straights would not fit either. Some of above infers 57 and 58 etc are same size opening in car, not right. Thank you Scott, that is what happened to guy who bought a bubble, for a 57 car. I was almost going to do same thing.Saved! BS baffles brains, for a while. | ||
scottbit |
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Veteran Posts: 166 | Yes the 57 through 59 windshields are confusing at first as there are 3 different shaped windshield openings on what appear to be the same cars. One, the pillared sedans,wagons and the Dodge 2dr post cars. W454. Two, 2 and 4 door hardtops with the overhanging style roof, W451 and three, 2 and 4 door hardtops with the 1958-1959 short roof that takes the "bubble" style windshield W453. There are may different variants of the amount of bubble in the W453, the more you pay the more "bubble" you get. In the original factory windshields the glass is horizontal for the last inch before meeting the windshield rubber. Its a stunning look but very few windshields have that amount of bubble anymore. | ||
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