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Location: Milano, Italy | Hi gang, Anybody knows how to get rid of this annoying dust from the brake shoes accumulating in the drums? last sunday I was driving my Belvy back from a 200 km round trip when I suddenly felt the car not responding to the accelerator as usual. I stopped in the first gas station and checked, and there I find that the wheels were holding the car, so that it couldn't be moved by pushing it by hands, of course in neutral, neither back nor forth. So I had to rise each wheel at a time on a jack, to find which one was holding...... In a 35°C hot afternoon.... Well it came out that the two rear wheels were locked to the point it was impossible to turn them by hand. Luckily I had a hammer in the trunk, so I hammered (slightly) the back plates all around until enough dust fell off (from the opening between the backplates and the drums), and I could resume my journey. Is this a common problem, or is it just me and some low quality brake shoes linings? |
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Location: Connecticut | Antonio - Your problem in not the dust, it's most likely a collapsed brake hose or weak return springs. The dust is a by-product of braking. When you did your brakes, did you use correct, new springs and brand new hoses ? You should never reuse these items. Also are your springs set up correctly, as per the factory service manual ? Ron |
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Location: Milano, Italy | Thanks Ron,
Every part in the drums are in good order.
This dust just keeps reproducing in my drums since the beginning, and of course is a by-product of braking.
Of course it happens only when you use normally the car on the street, and it doesn't happen if one goes to shows only.
It happens in other cars with drum brakes, even in europeans.....
I drilled some discharge holes in the drums (two 3/16" diametrally opposed ) and I cut some diagonal cut on the shoes in the sense of drum rotation, hoping that the dust could escape by centrifugal force, but it remains there.
Any ideas?
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Location: Hay Lakes, Alberta, Canada | Be careful of the dust, and wear a mask!! It most likely has asbestos in it! |
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Location: Milano, Italy |
I'll be careful......... However in Europe the linings (and pads) with asbestos were put out of the market long time ago. |
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Location: northern germany | never heard of that problem and never experienced that problem in 25 years. its not mentioned in any shop manual either. whatever caused that it was not the dust. dust is entirely normal of course.
you mean you drilled holes in the DRUM?! the lining contacting surface?! you will have to trash em now. drums are not stressed like disks. there is no counter pressure. they are prone to break or explode now. if they break chances are a forward shoe gets wedged causing a locked wheel = disaster. if this happens with a rear wheel you are doomed.
Edited by 1960fury 2013-08-05 2:13 PM
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Location: northern germany | lonesome mopar - 2013-08-05 12:26 PM
Of course it happens only when you use normally the car on the street, and it doesn't happen if one goes to shows only.
did drive 10 years daily, autobahn included. no dust problem ever.
there was a guy couple of miles away from me. his 58 buick had the same problem, turned out it was a faulty residual valve.
Edited by 1960fury 2013-08-05 2:18 PM
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Location: Arizona | 1960fury - 2013-08-05 11:09 AM
never heard of that problem and never experienced that problem in 25 years. its not mentioned in any shop manual either. whatever caused that it was not the dust. dust is entirely normal of course.
you mean you drilled holes in the DRUM?! the lining contacting surface?! you will have to trash em now. drums are not stressed like disks. there is no counter pressure. they are prone to break or explode now. if they break chances are a forward shoe gets wedged causing a locked wheel = disaster. if this happens with a rear wheel you are doomed.
A quick google on this topic produced this..
http://www.chtopping.com/CustomRod4/
Which says that drilling drums a good idea and won't cause any problems. Apparently race car drivers back in the day did it all the time to improve brake performance. And if you look at the photo, they drilled one heck of a lot of holes in the drums, dozens of them.
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Location: Netherlands | I agree the brakedust-problem won't be solved by drilling the drums. I tend to think the brakeshoes are made of a cheap material and wear down fast, or the drums are too rough and also wear down the linings too fast.
If you have drilled the drums (which is mostly done to cool the drums better), make sure you camphered the holes to resist cracks around them under very hard braking.
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Location: northern germany | jimntempe - 2013-08-05 2:32 PM
A quick google on this topic produced this..
you can find the most hilarious things and advices in the www. racers on racetracks back in the day have done the craziest things to be faster than the other guy. no car would pass the mot with home drilled drums for a good reason.
this is from the very same article:
"Another benefit is reduced unsprung weight, which improves ride quality. Surprisingly, a brake disc weighs three times what a drum does, and calipers are four times heavier than a wheel cylinder. Cars designed with discs take all those extra pounds (approximately 60 total) into consideration in their suspension system. Therefore, adding discs to the Plymouth would likely roughen up the ride quite a bit if I didn't change the springs and shock absorbers to compensate for the extra pounds."
a good disk system weighs WAY less than a 50s mopar drum system. that article also does not mention rotating mass which eats power (fuel). drums have, unlike disks, all the weight in the outer circumference away from the wheel center. so drums not only weight more they also eat more power (even if they would weight the same).
(and of course installing stiffer springs/shock absorbers can't make the ride smoother. heavy unsprung weight is always bad, you can't eliminate its negative effects no matter what you do)
another thing. ever got water in your drums? i got (coolant) it locked the wheel instantly. very unpleasant experience. the FSM advices to seal the brake cylinders/backing plate gap to prevent water/dirt entering the drum. backing plates with adjusting slots use rubber grommets to seal the opening. i think a car with drilled drums is no longer roadworthy.
was there ever a regular car that came from the factory with drilled drums?
Edited by 1960fury 2013-08-06 9:44 AM
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Location: Milano, Italy | ok, my turn now;
No i did not drill the drum in the shoes contact area, my holes (tiny) are in the outward drum rail, because I noticed the dust was accumulating there.
As for reliability, this job was done in 2003, never a problem (except the dust)., I have done more than 30.000 km in town and on the highways ever since and I am not a quiet driver. So, drums are not to be trashed. At least not yet.... :-))
BTW I can say now those holes are useless. Darn dust keeps accumulating - maybe local linings are a different quality than those in Usa.....? Specialized shops here tell me that linings cannot be made of asbesto anymore, here, it ihas become illegal. So I wonder if they make the linings out of wood?
and holes in the drum yes, I have a friend down here, he used to race cars in the 50s, ( formula with 1600 cc engine and all four wheel exposed) that is with with drum brakes (discs were not invented yet) and he and all his competitors used to drill MANY holes in the drum, on the shoes contact area, to cool them faster and to keep them clean.
He suggested me to do the job I did.
Then in the sixties someone came out with aluminium finned drums, which worked much better.
I am truly amazed by hearing that somebody over there never encountered this "dust"problem. I have seen myself many other cars with this dust in the drums. That are to be cleaned periodically. Of course we are talking of cars that are driven daily in heavy traffic. Not enough air to extract the dust from the back plate maybe? (I am developing another idea here...)
The only drum brakes I saw without the dust inside were those from a Fiat light truck, where drums had two huge holes (1 inch) on their outside.
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Location: Southern Sweden - Sturkö island | Antonio, I drive my '60 Chrysler for long country trips and I do follow the traffic rythm (if I don't lead it  ).
I check my brakes at least once yearly - yes, there is some dust, but not very much - I'd call it normal wear n' tear dust. The amount of dust is like half a liquor bottle cap - maximum.
I never had any problems with accumulating dust in the brake drums.
Only thing is that I suspect that my brake shoes are either the OEM ones, or some old aftermarket ones.
It could very well be as you indicate - the brake shoes you use are of lesser quality as for the lining material. |
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Location: northern germany | lonesome mopar - 2013-08-06 7:17 AM
As for reliability, this job was done in 2003, never a problem (except the dust).,
you mean you have that problem for over 10 years and you regularly creep under the car tapping the drums with a hammer???? i worked in a large vw dealer garage back when drums were still common and i'm working on fl mopars for over 25 years, never heard of that problem and if it was a problem back in the day you can bet the fsms,etc would mention it.
have you tried new/different linings? have you checked the residual valve/brake hoses/lines? i mean i would try everything before drilling the drums which is, as i said before, dangerous and of course can't be a solution for that problem. no fl mopar ever came with drilled drums from the factory.
drums can crack even without drilled holes and even drilling disks is illegal. my guess is you have just contaminated linings that makes the wheel lock/shoes stick to the drums, mostly in hot weather. very common problem.
Edited by 1960fury 2013-08-06 10:13 AM
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Location: Milano, Italy | <p>thanks Sid. No, not with a hammer. When I disassemble the 4 drums I *brush* the dust off. Everything is clean and at its place, no fluid around, no grease from the axles bearings, nor from the differential shoes work perfectly, everything is DRY. the braking is crisp and powerful... except I have to brush the dust off the inside of the brakes, front and rear, every 2000 km or so. Yes this story of dust accumulating in the drums is there since 25 years now. I have relined the shoes many times (local lining shops) - and refacing the inner face of the drum EVERYTIME - I have bought and tried OEM shoes on epay from Usa, (which is what I have now) I have also tried some special linings for heavy trucks with the only result brakes were noisi and even worse, shoes grabbed after a week parked in winter time. No way, dust is always there. The dust is more present in rear wheels rather than on the front. Maybe because they got twisted and shooked more than the rear?</p><p>Or probably because I driive with much camber ( same as some sport cars have)</p><p>that maybe keeps the drum at a little angle so that they discharge the dust off by themselves?</p>
Edited by lonesome mopar 2013-08-06 11:59 AM
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Location: Southern Sweden - Sturkö island | 1960fury - 2013-08-06 4:11 PM
lonesome mopar - 2013-08-06 7:17 AM
As for reliability, this job was done in 2003, never a problem (except the dust).,
my guess is you have just contaminated linings that makes the wheel lock/shoes stick to the drums, mostly in hot weather. very common problem.
Agree on this - check the brake shoe return springs as well |
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Location: Milano, Italy | P.s. @1960 Fury Sid......drilling disks is illegal ? come on, do not let those TUV monsters terrorize you. They work for big corporations, not for the people. In our motorcycle days, we were all drilling our disc brake just to be cooler ( in both ways).... :-)) and no one ever got his disc brake explose betweeen his legs while riding, nor did those racers in the good ol' Fifties...... :-))
Edited by lonesome mopar 2013-08-06 12:31 PM
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Location: Milano, Italy |
Brake springs are fine.... :-))
as soon as I remove the dust everything returns normal. |
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Location: Milano, Italy | 1960fury - 2013-08-05 8:11 PM lonesome mopar - 2013-08-05 12:26 PM Of course it happens only when you use normally the car on the street, and it doesn't happen if one goes to shows only. did drive 10 years daily, autobahn included. no dust problem ever. there was a guy couple of miles away from me. his 58 buick had the same problem, turned out it was a faulty residual valve. There is something here that escapes me: How can a residual valve in the master cylinder create dust in the drums? |
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Location: Connecticut | First, how much brake dust are we talking about ? A small amount, like a cap full, or much more ? Second, can you explain how the brake dust would cause your brakes to lock up and make it impossible for the wheels to move ? Third, how do you know that your springs are 'fine' ? Just because they look good doesn't mean that they retain the proper strength to return the shoes after hard braking. Have you replaced your brake hoses recently ? That may be the cause of the problem. What other 'mods' have been done to the braking system besides drilling holes in the drums ? I agree with Sid that this is dangerous, as it may cause the drums to crack. Ron |
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Location: Milano, Italy | Thanks Ron. here is the points: 1) Sorry I did not measure it, but more than a cap full is the approximate quantity - that might be enough, because I do *not* back up too much the registers, less than a quarter of turn back. 2) I haven't got a minicamera to check into the drum but I guess that the dust accumulates on the front of the leading shoe and the rest sticks all over the shoe, filling the space between shoe and drum, therefore dragging the drum. 3) the springs require a special plier to be unhooked from the shoes - and quite a lot of hand force - and when they are released, the coils are tight and the spring lenght is shorter than the distance to the hook . 4) yes I am aware that old or collapsed hoses can give a locking shoe ( even a locking pad in the disc brake). But this is not the case. Hoses are just 5 years old. And as soon as I shook the dust off, everything returns normal. In case of a collapsed hose, the situation should return at the next brake action. which doesn't happen. 5) modifications: a) shoes are put on a disc so that their outside diameter (assembled on the disc) is a little over the internal diameter of the trued or refaced drum. Then the assembly is put on a lathe and brought to the exact inner diameter of the drum. This way the *expanded* shoes have the exact inner diameter of the drum. b) all pistons in the cylinders have two rubber O rings to keep the fluid inside, expecially for those front pistons that work upside down. We are talking of the total contact brake by Chrysler here. This mod is on the car since 25 years (the first version was with one o-ring). 6) No. Sid is exaggerating. After extended usage, all the brake drums with 2 (on the front) and 4 (on the rear) 1/8" holes did not explode nor crack. Please sleep peacefully...... One might need to drill *plenty* (50?) of them all around the circumference to cause that....... :-))
Edited by lonesome mopar 2013-08-06 1:24 PM
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Location: Arizona | SOmething of a mystery. In you last you said ""I do *not* back up too much the registers, less than a quarter of turn back." Maybe this is the reason the dust causes the problem for you that no one else seems to have. I suspect you don't back them off much because you want the nice quick firm pedal you get with that "tight" an adjustment but maybe that's just "too tight" in terms of dust clearance. Why not try giving them a little more "back off" next time you clean the dust out and adjust things and see what happens. Maybe the pedal won't change as much as you fear and your dust problem will disappear. |
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Location: northern germany | lonesome mopar - 2013-08-06 12:21 PM
There is something here that escapes me: How can a residual valve in the master cylinder create dust in the drums?
as i said before your problem is not the dust. your problem are locked wheels and you simply assume its the dust in drum that makes your wheel lock. |
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Location: Milano, Italy | jimntempe - 2013-08-06 9:12 PM SOmething of a mystery. In you last you said ""I do *not* back up too much the registers, less than a quarter of turn back." Maybe this is the reason the dust causes the problem for you that no one else seems to have. I suspect you don't back them off much because you want the nice quick firm pedal you get with that "tight" an adjustment but maybe that's just "too tight" in terms of dust clearance. Why not try giving them a little more "back off" next time you clean the dust out and adjust things and see what happens. Maybe the pedal won't change as much as you fear and your dust problem will disappear. Thank you Jim. indeed I have been thinking about that too, but anywhere in this world of drum brakes you hear saying "adjust the shoes until you can feel some drag and you can still turn the wheels by hand"..... And that slight drag corresponds to less than a quarter of a turn to the registers......... 
Edited by lonesome mopar 2013-08-06 4:50 PM
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Location: Milano, Italy | 1960fury - 2013-08-06 9:24 PM lonesome mopar - 2013-08-06 12:21 PM There is something here that escapes me: How can a residual valve in the master cylinder create dust in the drums? as i said before your problem is not the dust. your problem are locked wheels and you simply assume its the dust in drum that makes your wheel lock. Thanks Sid. By the way that does not explain why after I clean the dust the problem disappears..... If it were the residual valve malfunctioning, the drag should arrive everytime I push the brake pedal.... while the wheels resume their normal functioning -and braking- right after the cleaning. Of course just for the next 2000 km.
Edited by lonesome mopar 2013-08-06 4:59 PM
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Location: Milano, Italy |
I guess, just as Wizard way above here suggested, it must be a matter of low quality linings.
Does anybody knows the behaviour of the "carbon-metallic" linings I can read somewhere here on the forum? |
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Location: Connecticut | Be sure that when you turn the adjusters, you are turning them in the proper direction, as per the Factory Shop Manual. Just FYI, they turn differently than the front wheels. Ron |
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Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada | I had the issue of brake-dust build up in the rear drums of my ex- 62 300 two different occasions, but the brake shoes at that point were very old, but still had lots of material left. The drums were removed and the dust blown out both times and drums re-installed. When it happened to me, the first time was here in town. I found the drums locking up when stopping, and I couldn't move forward. By going into reverse, it would free it up until the next stop until I got the drum off and cleaned it out. The second time it happened I was driving on I-5 on the way to Oregon from BC....... it was white knuckle driving for a while, let me tell you!! We got to our destination at Mount Hood / Welches Oregon, and one of my forward look friends happened to live almost next door to where we were staying at a resort, and we pulled the drum next morning and cleaned out the dust. And it was only the LR shoe that was the culprit, the right one was fine with no dust build up, but the left drum was so packed with dust that it locked up the wheel.
Edited by imopar380 2013-08-06 6:12 PM
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Location: Williams California | I've never run across this exact problem, although excessive dust is generally caused by cheap linings or brake shoe drag. Another side effect of dragging shoes, is a burning, or hot smell also. Antonio, are your drums getting very hot just after a drive? If so, this would indicate friction from the shoes being either adjust out to9 far or dragging.
---John |
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Location: northern germany | imopar380 - 2013-08-06 6:09 PM
I found the drums locking up when stopping, and I couldn't move forward. By going into reverse, it would free it up until the next stop until I got the drum off and cleaned it out.
yes known problem happened to me many times with contaminated linings. its the "forward" shoe that locks when driving forward (in 57+ fl cars 2 at each front wheel) the "rearward" shoes can't lock in forward gear. in my case it had nothing to do with dust.
Edited by 1960fury 2013-08-06 7:46 PM
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Location: northern germany | lonesome mopar - 2013-08-06 4:55 PM
1960fury - 2013-08-06 9:24 PM lonesome mopar - 2013-08-06 12:21 PM There is something here that escapes me: How can a residual valve in the master cylinder create dust in the drums? as i said before your problem is not the dust. your problem are locked wheels and you simply assume its the dust in drum that makes your wheel lock. Thanks Sid. By the way that does not explain why after I clean the dust the problem disappears..... If it were the residual valve malfunctioning, the drag should arrive everytime I push the brake pedal.... while the wheels resume their normal functioning -and braking- right after the cleaning. Of course just for the next 2000 km.
i didn't say its the residual valve. just a possible source of trouble . the 58 buick i mentioned did not have that problem each time the brakes were applied, just occasionally for some reason. okay very likely it was just dirt in the system that was flushed out when the valve was exchanged.
what is your theory that its the rear wheels that create most of the brake dust (if they really do)? the front brakes do probably 80% of the work and therefore should create more brake dust.
so you own the car for over 25 years and you clean out the brake drums every 2k?........... |
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Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada | 1960fury - 2013-08-06 3:56 PM
imopar380 - 2013-08-06 6:09 PM
I found the drums locking up when stopping, and I couldn't move forward. By going into reverse, it would free it up until the next stop until I got the drum off and cleaned it out.
yes known problem happened to me many times with contaminated linings. its the "forward" shoe that locks when driving forward (in 57+ fl cars 2 at each front wheel ) the "rearward" shoes can't lock in forward gear. in my case it had nothing to do with dust.
In my case it was definitely dust - there was so much dust in between the shoes and the drum it was clogged almost solid. |
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Location: Milano, Italy | big m - 2013-08-07 12:51 AM I've never run across this exact problem, although excessive dust is generally caused by cheap linings or brake shoe drag. Another side effect of dragging shoes, is a burning, or hot smell also. Antonio, are your drums getting very hot just after a drive? If so, this would indicate friction from the shoes being either adjust out to9 far or dragging. ---John Thank you john for your advise. Yes I'm getting more and more convinced that I need better quality linings. As for the heat or hot smell, I can say the 4 hubs (or drums) that I check everytime I stop at a gas station during some highway driving are *not* hot. Quite warm, yes , but not hot. I can touch them with my hand, but of course I can't let it on for long.. BTW I wish I could know more about those carbon-metallic linings I read somewhere else in this forum......
Edited by lonesome mopar 2013-08-07 6:54 AM
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Location: Netherlands | Excessively dusting brakeshoes are probably made of a cheap organic material. I always thought they used compressed horsesh!t for this... 
FirmFeel CarbonMetallic brakeshoes;
http://www.firmfeel.com/carbonme_c.htm
You might have to contact them first about the costs to reline your brakeshoes.
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Location: northern germany | imopar380 - 2013-08-07 12:06 AM
In my case it was definitely dust - there was so much dust in between the shoes and the drum it was clogged almost solid.
so how much dust can be there??? its 99.99% brake linings. so lets assume you did wear 50% of the lining (very unlikely)all the dust would probably fit into a liquor glass.......
many years ago i used up a full set of rear brake lining down to the metal (not proud of that) no cleaning in between. there was some dust yet no clogging/locking did occur.
Edited by 1960fury 2013-08-07 9:21 AM
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Location: Southern Sweden - Sturkö island |
Will the "C"-body shoes fits Chrysler '60 cars Herman? - looks like it in the picture. |
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Location: Netherlands | I would think so, but I couldn't find a page on that shaky website that mentioned FLWK-cars. That's why I also mentioned it would be best to contact them before hand.
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Location: central Illinois | I contacted FF about the carbon metallic linings for 11x2.5" shoes and was quoted $95 plus shipping. |
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Location: Milano, Italy | I opened the link to FF but there is no e-mail address to contact them and calling them from Italy is not the most economic move.
My Belvie uses the 11" x 2" shoes.
I saw they price $85 the next measure, so I guess that is the price for mine too.... but is that $ 85 referring to one shoe or to all the 8 ? They don't say..........
Moreover, How could I be sure that those carbon shoes do not produce the same dust , or less ?
Is there anybody who already uses them? |
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Location: central Illinois | The price I was quoted was for one axle set, or 4 shoes. And that means you send them yours and they return your shoes. You pay shipping both ways.
Edited by b5rt 2013-08-08 8:01 PM
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Location: Milano, Italy | Thank you Greg. Well, that may be affordable, after all. I still wonder if there's anybody who istalled those carbon linings and is willing to report how did they behave.
Edited by lonesome mopar 2013-08-09 7:13 AM
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Location: Southern Sweden - Sturkö island | Neil has those brake shoes - I think that he will kick in here soon. Far as I know, he's very pleased with them.. |
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Location: Springville, CA | Product Information email is: dennis@firmfeel.com |
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Location: Milano, Italy | 56Fanatic - 2013-08-09 2:54 PM Product Information email is: dennis@firmfeel.com Great info ! Thank you very much |
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Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | Ask & ye shall receive....
By the time I get done finding & posting all of my accumulated knowledge....
The first two pics are from a magazine article, extolling the merits of metallic brake linings.
The next pic is from the 12/03 MoPar Action, which induced me to buy the (11x3") carbon metallic linings from Firm Feel.
Next pic shows the carbon-metallic "Firm Feel" (from their subcontractor) shoes, as received.
The next few pics show what was/is actually drilled: the BACKING plates, for cooling.
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PICT0001.JPG (106KB - 153 downloads)
PICT0002.JPG (123KB - 173 downloads)
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PICT0008.JPG (113KB - 158 downloads)
PICT0919.JPG (105KB - 132 downloads)
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Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | I think that this is Firm Feel's carbon-metallic lining, bonded-on to a Lockheed brake shoe,
and here's a shot of my well-used front C-M linings, and a brake drum, with no appreciable
brake dust present.
Edited by d500neil 2013-08-09 7:42 PM
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 397
Location: Milano, Italy | Wow, Neil, the stuff you provided is awesome and very interesting. Thank you very much for the infos you shared. BTW in your second picture, (PICT0179) the one showing a magazine feature, they write of some "grabbiness" when cold. This might be the case of one of the many linings I tried from local shops here, the guys told me it was "heavy trucks material" but I had to take them off after a few months, as we were in winter and at every cold start in the morning I had one wheel or another locking up at the first brake touch. Quite annoying. Probably trucks'shoes return springs are way stronger than my Belvie's. I replaced the linings with the normal type and the grabbiness disappeared. Your sixth pic ( PICT0002) confirmed me the idea that I am developing: a flexible tube to bring air to the brake. I wonder if it is necessary a way out for the air ? Or would the area between the drum/backplate be enough? However, I am a little scared by foreign particles entering the brake through the tube.... but maybe putting a filter upfront? (Headaches, headaches....) Pic. n. PICT0001 is not a total contact brake, is it? To me it looks to be missing lining material where it brakes the most (the upper section)... or is it due to the geometry of the shoes contact area? As for the whole back plate turned in swiss chees... Certainly a good solution for races, although I wouldn't do it on mine for the street, because we have plenty of rain here. Great infos, anyways. (Still I'm puzzled on the fact that you and many other do not encounter dust in your drums !)
Edited by lonesome mopar 2013-08-10 5:52 PM
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Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | The "grabbiness" is actually the normal operation of the Bendix "Duo Servo" brake system, where the front shoe is
allowed to rotate backwards(?) until it comes against a stop, so that the brake application features a definite 2-stage
application.
At (very-) slow speed, the brakes can jam-on dramatically when the brake pedal is firmly depressed.
At higher speeds, the brakes are so powerful that modulating their application, in emergency situations, can be daunting.
But, they DO stop a car.
The FWDLK Lockheed "Centerplane" brakes (in front) have two wheel cylinders that very evenly apply lining contact to
the drum surface.
The main problems with the Centerlines was/is their too hard(?) composition, which allows their linings to glaze-over, and to
'skid' across the drum surface.
Also, the Centerlines' drums extend almost fully to the inside of the 14" wheels, so that the linings can get very hot, very quickly (the 11" Bendix'es have a lot of clearance between their circumference and the wheel interior).
I think that drilling out the backing plates....(that NASCAR racing wheel, with expanded-metal replacing the solid metal structure of the backing plate is very sexy, and maximum-ly efficient)...will probably provide for good brake cooling---especially if the holes are chamfered toward the oncoming air.
I can't remember how/why I had that lining be applied to that/those shoes, but it probably was done back when I still trusted FWDLK'ers to honor their commitments, as a favor to someone.
I hadn't thought about driving in the rain, with opened up backing plates, but, a ducted vent could work out very well, as long as the wheel turning would not wear out the ducting.
A short, scalloped scoop on the upper side of the backing plate would probably work well.
I haven't thought about the extent to which drilled cooling holes in backing plates would admit roadway water spray onto the brake shoes/linings....
Edited by d500neil 2013-08-10 6:23 PM
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Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | Here's a fairly dramatic comparison....(from my article, which was published in the 10/90 issue of
the WPC Club News' magazine)....of the Lockheed (on left) brakes' close fitment inside the
14" wheel, compared to the 11 x 3" Bendix brake, which also extends inboard of the inside of
the wheel.
The car was still wearing its G78 series bias plys, back then; note how fully-inflated they were.
Also, note how the Bendix-side shows my installation/experimentation with 6-full leaf springs.
The Lockheed side was photographed with the OEM 4 1/2 leafs (the 1/2 leaf ends at the middle
of the axle and is not seen, from the rear) still being installed.
The Bendix side has had 6-full leafs installed, but subsequently found that the 6-full (with the
bottom-three coming off of a 62 CHY wagon-donor; note how they are obviously thicker than
the car-leafs) made the rear too stiff.
So, shhitt-canned the second-stiffest leaf and am running on 5-full leafs, since 1990.
Edited by d500neil 2013-08-11 3:16 AM
 (PICT2281.JPG)
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PICT2281.JPG (107KB - 146 downloads)
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shoes' dust in drums
