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Forward Look Technical Discussions -> Engine, Exhaust, Fuel and Ignition | Message format |
GregCon |
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Expert Posts: 2524 Location: Houston | My fuel pump was leaking oil and gas so I suspected it was time to give it some attention. I did some searching on this site and found this thread: http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=46680&... It mentions the Airtex 4280 as a works-but-not-correct pump but doesn't say what the differences are. I ordered a 4280 from Rock Auto. The pump I had, which was on the car when I bought it, is an Airtex 4609AX. I know this because it is stamped as such and the box it came in was in the trunk along with an even older, used 4609AX. You can see from the pics that the 4280 is much smaller in diameter. I assume this means it has a lower capacity but who knows? Another oddity is the 4609AX (both of them) have a notch cut into the body to allow them to clear the block. It seems odd .... When I had the engine out, I was aware of this clearance issue and ground the block enough to clear the pump without any notch in the pump body. What really gets me is the 4280 has the screwy reversed in/out ports, so the rear port is the outlet. I used to see cars with the reversed pump (always aftermarket) and I loathed them. On my car, this of course looks screwy and required me to make up a new fuel line. I'm going to live with it until I get a 4609AX rebuilt. The 4280 does seem to work well, at least at normal driving flow conditions. So..... 1) Does a stock pump have a notch in the body? 2) Does anyone know what engine the 4280 is actually meant for? (354 fuel pumps.jpg) (4609AX fuel pump1.jpg) Attachments ---------------- 354 fuel pumps.jpg (100KB - 239 downloads) 4609AX fuel pump1.jpg (94KB - 227 downloads) | ||
StillOutThere |
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Location: Under the X in Texas | Of course without knowing the year and displacement of your motor, we can't begin to answer this. | ||
Shep |
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Expert Posts: 3433 Location: Chestertown, NY ( near Lake George) | I have the 4280 on my 55, just had to re-clock the fuel inlet position. | ||
Mopar1 |
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Expert Posts: 3064 Location: N.W. Fla. | To finish my comment I started on the other Thread...there been a number of hemi F/Ps that have been crapping out lately or having other problems. I solved mine by buying an adaptor from HH & used the LA F/P. | ||
wayfarer |
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Elite Veteran Posts: 896 Location: Peoples Republic of Oregon | I have seen numerous examples of the 4280 with varying styles of actuator arms which may or may not allow them to properly work in an EarlyHemi type application. Recently I had occasion to check the NAPA supply for this exact pump and their cross-reference showed the pump application as a 49-54 6cyl... For anyone attempting to use any AirTex 4280 I recommend drawing an outline of the actuator arms and comparing the new to the old to see if they are even close. Same can be done with the A-LA pump by shifting it over a bit...if the arm, at some point, overlays the original then you can make a spacer. | ||
GregCon |
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Expert Posts: 2524 Location: Houston | I compared the arms before I installed it. On my particular pump, the 4280 arm was laminated, riveted steel. It was about 1/2 longer than the 4609, but the 4280 arm still would allow proper contact with the eccentric. | ||
57chizler |
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Expert Posts: 3802 Location: NorCal | From eyeballing the two pics in the OP I'd say the 4609 is a 3-valve pump...larger in diameter. | ||
jimntempe |
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Expert Posts: 2312 Location: Arizona | So what's the advantage of a three valve pump? Higher flow? Higher pressure? More things to break? Just another way to get-er-done? | ||
GregCon |
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Expert Posts: 2524 Location: Houston | .....this one goes to 11. | ||
57chizler |
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Expert Posts: 3802 Location: NorCal | The 3-valve pump delivers a higher volume....pressure depends on the spring under the arm. | ||
mstrug |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 6552 Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | AIRTEX 4280 Mechanical Pump Info Category: Fuel Pump AIRTEX Category: Fuel Pump Gasket Included Y Inlet Count 1 Inlet Type Threaded Maximum Pressure Rate (psi) 5.5 Minimum Free Flow Rate (gph) 20 GPH @ 1800 RPM Minimum Pressure Rate (psi) 4 Outlet Count 1 Outlet Size 1/8-27 NPSF Outlet Type Threaded Package Contents Pump & Kit Warranty Limited 1 Year CHRYSLER 300 1955 CHRYSLER IMPERIAL 1955 CHRYSLER NEW YORKER 1955 CHRYSLER NEWPORT 1955 CHRYSLER ST REGIS 1955 CHRYSLER TOWN & COUNTRY 1955 DODGE CORONET 1953-1955 DODGE CUSTOM 1954-1955 DODGE LANCER 1955 DODGE ROYAL 1954-1955 DODGE SIERRA 1954-1955 DODGE TRUCK 1954-1956 PLYMOUTH BELVEDERE 1955-1956 PLYMOUTH FURY 1956 PLYMOUTH PLAZA 1955-1956 PLYMOUTH SAVOY 1955-1956 PLYMOUTH SUBURBAN 1955-1956 http://www.rockauto.com/en/partsearch/?partnum=4280 https://www.summitracing.com/parts/atx-4280 Edited by mstrug 2016-10-19 1:03 PM | ||
56D500boy |
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Exner Expert 10K+ Posts: 10177 Location: Lower Mainland BC | Hmm....I am working on my 56 D500 with the 315 Hemi and Carter WCFB 4 bbl carb . I am currently in the process of renewing my fuel system (tank has been cleaned and resealed, fuel line flushed, carburetor restored to OE condition (beautiful work), etc ). This is going to include a new fuel pump. I have a new Airtex 4280 and also a new Spectra Premium SP1280MP to choose from (one will be returned). Based on this discussion, I might have to return both and keep looking. (?). Spectra 1280MP info: http://ecat.spectrapremium.com/prod/SP1280MP It does list them for 1955 5.4L Chrysler engines which, to me, should be a hemi. (?) | ||
DepsilonD |
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Elite Veteran Posts: 792 Location: Buena Park, CA | 56D500boy, if you have your original pump, send it off to Then And Now Automotive for a rebuild. You will be very happy. By the way, the Hemi's across the Dodge, Desoto, and Chrysler line were somewhat unique to themselves and not a lot interchanges in general. | ||
mstrug |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 6552 Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | http://then-now-auto.com/fuel-pumps/ | ||
56D500boy |
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Exner Expert 10K+ Posts: 10177 Location: Lower Mainland BC | Okay these are my options for a new fuel pump for my 56 Custom Royal D-500 Left to right: 1. Have the pump that came off the car rebuilt. Note it has no notches and looks like the other three which all seem to be 4280s. 2. Use the NOS 4280 that I bought from a local FL person with several 56-56s (including rumour has it two 300s). Note the strange hack in the pump body and the shorter pivot/lever arm (still within the wear zone of the pump that came off my engine) 3. Use the Spectra Premium SP1280MP (I think the 280 part comes from 4280 and MP = MoPar??) 4. Use the Airtex 4280 What to do, what to do. (I am leaning towards No. 2, keeping No. 4, returning No. 3 and rebuilding No. 1 sometime, i.e. I like my spares to have spares) (315HemiFuelPumpOptions.jpg) (OEFuelPumpAsRemoved.jpg) (WearZoneOnOldFuelPump.jpg) (NewOldStock4280.jpg) (SpectraPremiumSP1280MP.jpg) (AirTex4280.jpg) Attachments ---------------- 315HemiFuelPumpOptions.jpg (217KB - 211 downloads) OEFuelPumpAsRemoved.jpg (169KB - 209 downloads) WearZoneOnOldFuelPump.jpg (210KB - 218 downloads) NewOldStock4280.jpg (192KB - 220 downloads) SpectraPremiumSP1280MP.jpg (173KB - 212 downloads) AirTex4280.jpg (189KB - 203 downloads) | ||
58coronet |
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Veteran Posts: 139 | Everyone, please be aware that the Hot Heads adapter / LA fuel pump WILL NOT work on a Dodge based hemi/poly without grinding away quite a bit of the pump casting at the top of the engine mating surface area. Reason is the shape of the engine casting in this area causes interference. I made it work for my 325 by doing this, but would only consider it a short term solution until the original pump is rebuilt, for this reason. | ||
Powerflite |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 9874 Location: So. Cal | I didn't have that kind of issue when I put it on the 315 poly in my '57 truck. It does get close, but I got it in there without too much difficulty. ('57DodgeFuelPump.jpg) Attachments ---------------- '57DodgeFuelPump.jpg (124KB - 223 downloads) | ||
56D500boy |
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Exner Expert 10K+ Posts: 10177 Location: Lower Mainland BC | I've installed the NOS 4280 fuel pump. On temporary basis, I am going to run two Fram G2 plastic fuel filters - one before the pump to catch any remaining crud in the fuel line between the newly refurb'd fuel tank and the fuel pump and the second one between the fuel pump and the restored WCFB carb. This will all change once I am confident that the fuel system is clean (enough). I am going to temporary run a barbed fitting on the fuel pump discharge. I want to have this pointed straight up. I tried to find a brass male/female NPT "Street" Elbow but came up dry in two local autoparts stores and one hardware store. Ended up going to a pluming wholesaler and bought a bronze Street elbow (rated to 150 psi - should be fine). I know its not "Period Correct", etc. but it will work in the short term. The selected carb that I installed yesterday: The selected fitting (try not to laugh too hard) (the male NPT will go into the FP discharge and an NPT/Barb hose fitting will go into the female receiver end): Edited by 56D500boy 2016-10-31 7:27 PM (StreetElbow.JPG) Attachments ---------------- StreetElbow.JPG (37KB - 204 downloads) | ||
56D500boy |
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Exner Expert 10K+ Posts: 10177 Location: Lower Mainland BC | 56D500boy - 2016-10-31 7:24 PM I am going to temporary run a barbed fitting on the fuel pump discharge. I want to have this pointed straight up. I tried to find a brass male/female NPT "Street" Elbow but came up dry in two local autoparts stores and one hardware store. Ended up going to a pluming wholesaler and bought a bronze Street elbow (rated to 150 psi - should be fine). I know its not "Period Correct", etc. but it will work in the short term. The selected fitting (try not to laugh too hard) (the male NPT will go into the FP discharge and an NPT/Barb hose fitting will go into the female receiver end): This job would be way easier if I didn't have CRS (Can't remember sh*t). I looked all day yesterday for the street elbow that I bought on Monday. Only after I went back to the plumbing wholesaler today and picked and paid for another one (easier than wasting more time looking for the first one), did I remember where the first one was: exactly where I left it - < slaps forehead> - on the scanner I used to take this "photo". DUH. Oh well. | ||
hemidenis |
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Expert Posts: 3903 Location: Northen Virginia | I found this one at carlisle. (pump392.jpg) Attachments ---------------- pump392.jpg (104KB - 204 downloads) | ||
hemidenis |
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Expert Posts: 3903 Location: Northen Virginia | I also have a NOS but not at hand unfortunately. it is already in the restored engine overseas. However i managed to find a picture of the original CARTER pump that was in the car, notice the one piece stamped steel arm. Edited by hemidenis 2016-11-02 8:52 PM (DSC03035.jpg) Attachments ---------------- DSC03035.jpg (76KB - 196 downloads) | ||
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