RE: [Chrysler300] Brake shoe retainer/hold down spring

Hi Rich,

I really think we should not call it proportioning valve, ..what do you think? That implies it is proportioning brake effort. It is responsive to proportion , not a cause of it.

The ones on 70’s dodge trucks called same thing by mechanics , disc front drum back, --it is a switch for red brake warning lights and a sliding piston that will block one outlet if flow to that outlet goes high..thus sensitive to “proportion” of pressure/ flow on each side. Balances in middle. Why 4 lines too . It does nothing to change that pressure and sits indexed in the center position unless needed . Unbelievable how much apparently wrong folklore is out there on this thing. There is a pin sticking out that some try to push. No instructions I could ever find on that. One would think it is a manual way to center it, but did not seem to do anything, would not move on one I had, did not want to break it. . Maybe used in factory? . I only learned all this out of frustration trying to bleed brakes…no where does it say what this “thing” does ; so I found drawing and opened it. On Dodge truck site lots of experts and tales of woe, usually ending by “buying new one” which comes centered. But easy to knock to one side while bleeding. It sort of cannot fail? They tell you exactly how to bleed it,---- if you do it exactly their way , with it starting centered, it works.. your favorite way to do it is out!!. Your favorite way will light the light , now you have get it back to middle, which you can do by opening other side but then it typically overshoots and light is on again from other side . See frustration, + quart of silicone fluid .

It has been ok since teasing it to middle.

There is good drawing of it in Dodge light truck manuals around 77 or 78. Even if light is marginally off, on edge , it unbelievably seems to center itself when you drive car if all is really ok. Sort of makes sense, but might be just luck.

If someone really knows more as opposed to opinion about it, I am wide open to learn. But physics are physics. Pressure is the same on each side of it (or it would move, light would light) ,

More thoughts, maybe main purpose is a way to tell non tech people that one half of master , half of brakes, is/are not working? Some might keep driving with half the brakes, but not with the red brake light on? Also will stop fluid loss on a major rupture I think by blocking that outlet. Keeps pedal up on dual master? Otherwise it falls way down if half fails.

100% a safety thing,--- imho.

From: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of 'Rich Barber' c300@xxxxxxx [Chrysler300]
Sent: Friday, August 14, 2015 1:35 AM
To: 'Anna F Noia'; 'Ronald Kurtz'; 'Ray Jones'; 'Rick Vitek'
Cc: 'Listsaver 300 Club'; Chris Pinder
Subject: RE: [Chrysler300] Brake shoe retainer/hold down spring - G

I don’t believe there is a proportioning valve in our ’64 Ram K with the 3” rear drums & shoes. Not that it might not be a good idea. Anyone seen them on 300’s before 1999? Mine get a little grabby in a hard stop—to rear lockup. Not many hours on the new brakes yet.

The service manual indicates 3” drums and shoes on all ’64 300’s & NY’s. 2.5” rear drums on Newport only. Length and material of lining are different. Interesting footnote-Police car HD brakes are not self-adjusting.

The remote power brake booster on ram-engined cars makes disk brake conversion problematic.

Keep calm and 300 on.

Rich Barber

Brentwood, CA.

From: Anna F Noia [mailto:sa-noia@xxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2015 6:46 AM
To: Ronald Kurtz <mark6268@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>; 'Ray Jones' <1970hurst@xxxxxxxxx>; 'Rick Vitek' <rpvitek@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>; Rich Barber <c300@xxxxxxx>
Cc: 'Listsaver 300 Club' <Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] Brake shoe retainer/hold down spring - G

Ron K.

Remember when you add the extra stopping power with the 3" rear brakes shoes, you will need to adjust the proportioning valve for less stopping to the rear. I did a similar job on a Montego Cyclone, went from 2" to 2.5" shoes on the rear. I immediately had rear lock up on hard braking. A second thought, going to 3" rears, I assume your front are also 3", correct? Or, do you have disc brakes on the front? I would suggest going disc's all the way round, front and rear. The front are an easy change with several choices, all using stock Chrysler parts. The rear also can be done using the 74 Imperial Rear disc set up. Believe it or not, it bolts straight on to the 8.75 rear end from the 9.25 Imperial rear. I did this on my 66 Sport Fury Convertible, anyway Good luck with it all, any increase in "Brakes" is a Good Thing!

Best Regards,
Stephen A. Noia
1-408-210-4736 cell

On Tuesday, August 11, 2015 2:50 PM, "Ronald Kurtz mark6268@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300]" <Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Hello, all:

I converted the rear brakes on my "Knewport" to 3-inch rear brakes. What was needed to go from 2 1/2 inch to 3 inch drums and shoes are support plates that that can mount 3" shoes, hardware and a 3" brake drum. Mine works fine. Three-inch support plates drop back 1/2 inch to accommodate 3" drums on the axles.

Best,
Ron Kurtz
E #292

--------------------------------------------
On Sun, 8/9/15, 'Rich Barber' c300@xxxxxxx [Chrysler300] <Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Subject: RE: [Chrysler300] Brake shoe retainer/hold down spring - G
To: "'Ray Jones'" <1970hurst@xxxxxxxxx>, "'Rick Vitek'" <rpvitek@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: "'Listsaver 300 Club'" <Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Sunday, August 9, 2015, 8:32 PM

Be very
careful to get the parts for HD brakes as the wider rear
shoes may require different springs and nails. These may
be included under 300, wagon or HD suspension.
Rich in Brentwood with a 300 Ram K car having HD
brakes standard. 3” wide shoes & drums vs. 2 ½”
on most other ’64 Chryslers. Came to me with 2 ½” shoes
in the 3” drums. Worked OK, but t’warn’t right.
Shoe lining material and length on different ‘64’s were
different also, but that’s too much to ask.
From: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Ray
Jones 1970hurst@xxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300]
Sent: Sunday, August 09, 2015 11:10
AM
To: Rick Vitek
<rpvitek@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc:
Listsaver 300 Club <Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; Ray
Jones <1970hurst@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] Brake shoe
retainer/hold down spring - G Have you checked your local parts
house?This kinda thing is readily
available at any of the 4 parts houses here in
Mena.These springs, pins and cups are
generic, I believe, and fit thousands of
cars.Even if they don't have a kit
listed for your car, check what they have for
fit.I just bought kits for the rear of
my Hurst, and I'm sure the hold downs are the same as
any I have ever installed.The kits may differ due to the
other springs included, which may be different from model to
model, but the shoe hold down is the same.Ray On Sun, Aug 9, 2015 at 11:05
AM, 'Rick Vitek' rpvitek@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[Chrysler300] <Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Looking for
the brake shoe retainer spring hardware (nail, 2 cups, coil
spring) for a G. Don't see it listed for this
application on internet searches. Does anyone know of a
source? I imagine this retainer length was used on other
applications and would be willing to get a hardware set for
that other application.

Thanks.

-- Ray Jones. Y'all
come on down an see us. Ya
hear?

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