RE: [Chrysler300] Cold start--Electric fuel pump

["Rich Barber" <c300@xxxxxxx>]

OK.  What everyone wants is one of the engineer's dreams--the intermittent,
latching switch.  The other dream is the non-slipping, non-locking fastener.


You can't have it both ways.  

If I can ever find a 6-Volt fuel pump for my '55, I'll connect an
appropriately sized wire to the ST terminal of the starter switch and add an
inline fuse for the pump.  If the system needs more than a brief prime, I
can put the dagger-on-the-dash out of neutral and turn the key to start to
run the pump until the carbs are primed, then put the granny impaler in
neutral for a nice, easy start.  It is not clear if there is a circuit
breaker in the ST circuit.  To prepare for the day when I might need the
fuel pump full time, I will add a second pigtail to the IGN terminal of the
switch with enough lead so that I could switch the inline fuse body from the
ST terminal source wire to the one from the IGN terminal.  The wiring
diagram for my '55 shows only a 16 ga wire from the ST terminal to the
starter relay, so connecting the pump to the starter relay end of that wire
might well overload the small wire from the switch.

I think the accessories are de-energized when cranking, but I'm not sure.
If so, I think the gas in the carbs would start the car and the electric
pump would kick on when the key was back in the run position.  I can't tell
if the ST circuit has a built in circuit breaker or not so if the pump does
pop the circuit breaker, one would lose power to the coil and that would be
inconvenient!

Another alternative is to use a toggle switch and add a big red pilot light
somewhere visible to the driver so as to heighten awareness when the pump is
on.

Still looking for a source of an appropriate 6-Volt, positive ground
electric fuel pump that will allow flow through when not running.

Fire-by-wire guys will recognize this creative work as that of a mechanical
type.  But, I was able as a kid to get the little guy to come out of his
house and wave his lantern when the Lionel train went by!

C-300'ly,
Rich Barber
Brentwood, CA (got a good 3" rain today with high winds)
1955 Chrysler C-300

-----Original Message-----
From: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Bob Jasinski
Sent: Friday, January 04, 2008 6:38 PM
To: 'Ray Jones'
Cc: 'Chrysler 300 Broadcast'
Subject: RE: [Chrysler300] Cold start--Electric fuel pump

Ray and all,
 
What started out as relatively simple is getting confusing because of
different years and switch types.  The way I have my G elec fuel pump wired
is the way Ray  describes, a wire from the "on" terminal to the pushbutton
then to the pump and then to ground to complete the circuit.  What Bruce is
doing is connecting the pump to the "start" output from the key switch,
where it connects to the starter relay.  When the key switch is turned to
"start", voltage is applied to the elec pump and it is then energized.  To
keep the starter from turning over, he depresses the trans selector button
to any position BUT Neutral while he is pumping up the fuel.  This way the
neutral safety switch keeps the starter relay from closing because there is
no ground present.  Once the fuel is pumped up, press the Neutral button,
turn the key, and it fires right up.
 
Please note, this only will work on later cars that use the ignition key to
start the motor, NOT the Neutral pushbutton.  I'm not sure what years use
the Neutral button for starting, but I think it is '55-'57, someone can
correct me here.  As far as using both a pushbutton and a connection to the
starter relay, I don't recommend it because if you pushed the fuel pump
switch button with the car in Neutral it would close the starter relay and
turn over the engine at the same time, and if the engine is running, that
would not be a good thing.  So, the point here is to use one or the other,
but not both.  What Ray is describing is having both a toggle switch AND a
separate pushbutton, yet another way to do it, but in my opinion unnecessary
because the only time you would need the toggle is if the mechanical pump
fails. Sorry for all the confusion, but installing the electric fuel pump
really is the answer to hard starting after the car sits for an extended
period.  I just hope you all aren't tired of the subject and my postings!
 
Bob J
 

  _____  

From: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Ray Jones
Sent: Friday, January 04, 2008 4:58 PM
To: Bob Jasinski
Cc: Chrysler 300 Broadcast
Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] Cold start--Electric fuel pump




Sounds like y'all are picking up your power at the wrong place. You 
don't want to use the "Start" circuit at all. Use the "ON" side of the 
Ing. switch, and from there to both switches. From both switches to the 
pump. Actually, it only takes one wire on either leg. From the Ing. 
switch "ON" to the momentary button, with a jumper to the toggle 
switch. That supplies power to both. Out of the push button to the 
"OUT' side of the Toggle and then to the pump. This way it will only 
work with the ing. switch ON, and using either button or toggle will 
send current ONLY to the pump as the other switch is not used and 
leaves an open in the circuit. Turn your Ing. switch on, push the 
button until it stops "ticking" and then start. If the mechanical pump 
quits, flip the toggle, and use the Elec. Pump to get ya home. And when 
you turn off the Ing. switch, the pump's off even it you forget to 
switch the toggle off.

Hope that's clear without a diagram.
Ray

On Jan 4, 2008, at 2:41 PM, Bob Jasinski wrote:

Warren,

I agree it could be a problem having a pump connection made both 
through the
starter solenoid and a separate momentary switch, in that the momentary
switch could energize energize the starter, IF the car was in neutral,
otherwise the neutral safety switch would be open and not allow 
current flow
to the starter relay. I think I'll just stick with one switch 
controlling
the pump, either the starter solenoid or the separate pushbutton, but 
not
both.

Bob J


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