Re: IML: Catastrophic oil loss 69 LeBaron

Thanks for the replies. My first thought was the rear main seal, but I did not think that it was under pressure and did not understand why it would fail so badly. Then I remembered the sending units at the back of the engine. After I went out to lunch and gave time for both me and the car to cool down I had a quick look at the sending units. There are two of them. A large one (pressure?) and a smaller one? The leak may have been coming from this area, but it is not entirely obvious. The car was still too hot to do anything. I also checked the oil at this time. The level was about half way (or slightly below that) between the add line and the bottom of the dip stick.

My plan is to do an oil change and measure the amount of oil remaining in the engine right now. I will tighten up the sending units and then fire the engine up to see if there is a leak. I just feel really lucky that the gas station was only 2 miles away and that there was no traffic. I hope that I am lucky.

I remembered over lunch about a 1966 Fury that I had. It had a mechanical oil pressure gage and the line to the gage broke pumping all of the oil out. Ironically I was driving the car over to a friends to get the engine rebuilt so it did not really matter. The biggest problem with this leak was all of the oil on my friends drive way.

Original Message -----
From: "Brooks Harkey"
To: mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: IML: Catastrophic oil loss 69 LeBaron
Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2006 14:38:44 -0500

I’d like to clarify my earlier statement (below) with this:

The rear main oil seal is not under pressure from the oil pressurization system. The oil level is also not above this level at a standing stop. Should it fail, the oil will be running out because the oil lubrication exiting the rear main bearing just found that as the “easy way out”, despite the pathway provided for it, or just oil naturally splashing back there and finding an easy way out.

So when you started the engine, a failed rear main seal would not change the oil pressure reading on the gauge nor in the oil galleries AT ALL until the sump was no longer sucking oil out of the pan (because it had all run out on the road) and you’re saying the slight drop in oil pressure was almost immediate – giving a strong indication that the problem lies with the oil pressure switch at the top of the engine.

Good luck!

--Brooks in Dallas

-----Original Message-----
From: mailing-list-owner@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:mailing-list-owner@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Brooks Harkey
Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2006 1:44 PM
To: mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: IML: Catastrophic oil loss 69 LeBaron

Fred,

The first thing to check is the oil sending unit. On these engines, if I recall correctly, it’s at the back of the engine, on top. They go bad with time on any car. It would also drain straight down near the engine/transmission seam and give the appearance of coming from the bell housing. Since they are cheap, readily available, and easy to replace, I’d begin there. (wait till the motor cools off) You’ll know if there’s oil everywhere around it.

With that out of the way, always start at the top of the engine and work down till you find where the leak starts. With one this massive, it should be pretty easy.

Unfortunately, the next “obvious thing to check” is the engine rear main seal. They do fail. If you remove the flywheel inspection cover, you should be able to tell if that’s where it’s coming from. It’ll probably be all over the front of the flywheel.

(You’re sure it’s motor oil, right, and not transmission fluid? Which could be coming from the converter seal. But I’ll presume you’re sure it’s oil at this point – easily discovered by check-the-dipstick.)

Good luck – and I’ll cross my fingers for “oil sending unit”. A clue is your statement that the oil pressure read lower than you remembered at idle – a hint that it was probably the sending unit failing, and losing oil under pressure.

If the engine was still running OK, I’m sure it’s fine. Probably a good thing you were using synthetic.

--Brooks in Dallas

-----Original Message-----
From: mailing-list-owner@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:mailing-list-owner@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Frederick Joslin
Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2006 1:00 PM
To: mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: IML: Catastrophic oil loss 69 LeBaron

I am slowly replacing the vinyl roof on my 69 LeBaron 2 door and making all of the necessary rust repairs.

I took today off to do some work on it and figured that it would be a good opportunity to take it out for a short drive to get some fresh gas. I paid abot $2/gallon for the gas in it.

The car fired up great witha freshly charged battery and some ether and ran fine. I had set the idle a little low last year, but it was running OK. The oil pressure was lower than I remember it at idle, but did come up with RPM's and was fine while driving. I checked all of the fluids, let the car warm up and then took it for a short drive in my neighborhood. It ran great for not having been driven for about one year. I went back home, checked all of the fluids again and then headed off to the nearest gas station 2 miles away. Put $35 of gas in it and drove home. The car was running great with lots of power. I live at the top of a steep hill and came up the hill in second gear at about 35-40 mph with the engine feeling really good.

I backed the car into my driveway and then into the garage. After I got out of the car I could see several large oil puddles and a very significant oil trail. One of the puddles where I had stopped the car for a few seconds was about 1' x 2'. I was shocked.

I quickly grabbed an oil drain pan and put it under the car. The oil seemed to be coming from the bell housing. I jumped into my trusty Intrepid and retraced the route I had taken to buy gas. I figured that something had probably happened coming up the hill. I traced the oil trail all the way back to the gas station (2 miles) and then could see that the car had been dripping on the way to the gas station. I then traced the trail all the way back to my house. It looks as if the oil started to leak right as I left my house on the trip to the gas station. Leaving the house I did not jump on it, give it a hard shift or anything and the car had been warmed up and driven about one mile before this.

I hope that I have not damaged the engine. I was running synthetic 20/50 weight oil, but I am sure that there is none left since I was able to follow the oil trail for 4 miles. Does anyone have ideas about what happened. The engine did not leak oil or burn oil prior to this and was not over filled

Fred Joslin

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Fred Joslin