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Wilwood Brakes
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ThomasD500
Posted 2005-12-09 8:20 PM (#45440)
Subject: Wilwood Brakes


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Hello,
I have a '57 Dodge and would like to get a front disc brake conversion.
I have read all about the AAJ conversion (that sells for $800.) It seems to be the popular choice.
However, info on the Wilwoods seems to be quite sparce.
I know that there is a $1500 kit out there. That is WAY over my budget!
However Wilwood's standard kits are only $650 shipped and come with all the same componants as the AAJ kit (except for the master cylinder which is $70 at Autozone.) And for that you also get aluminum hubs and aluminum 4 piston calipers!
The only problem being that they don't sell that kit for pre-'62 Mopers.
However, I learned (using the 'search' function) that you can order one of their kits for a later model (C-Body I believe it was), and with 'minor' modifications to the brackets and/or bolts it will work for thoose of us with FL cars.
However the info on that procedure was rather vague. Anytime someone mentioned any of AAJ's competition, this '62Chrysler' moderator would bully them and shut them down before they could get into more detail.
I was simply hoping that we could all respect the fact that we have different opinions and motives for want we want to achieve, and that I could have a discussion about the modifications requred to make a Wilwood system work, without being 'bullied' into the AAJ system.
So, has anyone used any of the Wilwood kits (or componants), and how much modification did you have to do to make it work?:)

Thanks!
Tom

Edited by ThomasD500 2005-12-09 8:22 PM
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DeSotohead
Posted 2005-12-09 8:58 PM (#45443 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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Thomas...

Welcome back to the forum.
Regarding brake kits other than Roger's at AAJ (and I have to say that I am a satisfied customer of AAJ), I think that 60Fury (Sid) in Germany has installed an alternative vendor's brake setup on his car. I know that car is Autobahn -capable, so it must work well.

You might PM him and see what he has to tell you.
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1960fury
Posted 2005-12-09 9:47 PM (#45449 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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i have front and rear wilwood brakes with vented 12"+ rotors and 4 piston billet lightweight calipers on my 60 fury. they work very well and never had trouble with them (put them on 7+ years ago) back then there was no 57-61 mopar kit and i used individual components from their parts catalog. the key are modified A body caliper brakets and their 0.50" ( i think) offset aluminum rotor hads. VERY easy conversion, you don't need the 57-61 kit, but you will have to use 15" or larger wheels because of the big rotors. i believe i paid only $650 for the front conversion. if interested i will try to find the part #s.
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ThomasD500
Posted 2005-12-09 10:24 PM (#45454 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes


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Hi All,
Thanks for the info.
And '1960Fury', Yes I would be interested in any specific information that you could give me.
By 'modified 'A-body caliper brackets- did you modify them yourself? Do you know what the modifications to the bracket are?
Are the 12" rotors the one piece cast-iron Mopar rotors? or are they custum made by Wilwwod? I don't mind the 15" wheels...I was planning on them anyway...probably larger, even.
My plan is to create a mild custum car...no permanant modifications...but create a nice driving, nice looking car that can actually be driven on real roads on occasion (mostly to show off and pick up chicks!!! )
Thanks for your help!
Tom
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1960fury
Posted 2005-12-10 12:23 AM (#45463 - in reply to #45454)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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yes, i "modified" them myself. very easy, just drilled two holes into each bracket and cut them into shape. these are very simple brackets, basicaly a sheet of aircraft quality aluminum, no welds, etc. i still have the cardboard templates somewhere. all the brake components i used are made by wilwood, including the 2 piece rotors. because of the aluminum rotor hads slightly longer wheel studs are required.

Edited by 1960fury 2005-12-10 12:43 AM
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1960fury
Posted 2005-12-10 12:41 AM (#45465 - in reply to #45454)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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wilwood part #s:

120-4997 calipers (2 required)
150-3668 set brake pads, soft
170-3265 rotor hats, 1.25" offset (2 req.)
160-0276 rotors (2 req.)
230-0150 rotor bolt kit (2 req.)
230-0204 mounting bolt kit (2 req.)
2 A body caliper brackets (sorry couldn't find #s) others might work as well

i used mopar performance braided teflon lines and 45° aluminum caliper to flex line adapters.




Edited by 1960fury 2005-12-10 12:57 AM
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ThomasD500
Posted 2005-12-10 9:53 PM (#45523 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes


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Thanks for all the info!
I will keep this thread updated with any more info I run across, so that others who want to cobble together their own 'hi perofrmance' braking system will know what they are getting themselves into!

Tom
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ThomasD500
Posted 2005-12-10 11:59 PM (#45536 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes


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Hello Sid,

Since you are using offset hats, I deduce that you are using MOPAR disk brake hubs of some sort. Is this correct? Which ones are you using?

The new Wilwood kits come with hubs, hub to disk adapters, and then the disks. As a result, they do no incorporate any offset hats. All alignment issues are addressed by the use of spacers between the caliper and caliper bracket.
They way I see it, If I am to order one of their kits and make it work, the most critical piece for me to get correct will be the hub. As you said, the brackets are just a flat piece of aluminum, and are easily modified. And the spacers for the bracket (to align the caliper over the disk) are nothing more than washers of specific thicknesse(another easily dealt with matter.)

Tom
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1960fury
Posted 2005-12-11 10:28 AM (#45557 - in reply to #45536)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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hi Tom,
no, i'm using the stock original 1960 hubs. the wilwood 1.25" offset hats fit as if they were made for 57-61 mopars. not even spacers required! just bolt the caliper bracket directly to the spindle assy. this conversion is so easy it can be done in a few hours. once you have all the parts in front of you, you will know what to do, if not, i'll be glad to help.
due to production tolerances it might be necessary to add a thin washer between the bracket and caliper or spindle. i believe that all hubs were identical on 57-61 plymouts, dodges, desotos and chryslers, BUT, i'm not 100% sure. so check the distance from the hub surface to spindle surface first.
these brakes are great. because of the relatively large rotors they give excellent pedal feel and there's no brake booster needed, but the best thing about them is their light weight (reduced unsprung weight) this made a HUGE difference on my fury that had the little (worn) 11"x2" drums, it should make an even greater improvement on cars with the bigger brakes.
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ThomasD500
Posted 2005-12-13 9:57 PM (#45704 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes


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Sid,

Thanks for the explanation. I now have a very clear picture in my head of exactly what you did. By the way, did you know that the hat you used was designed to be used with a F0rd??

I priced the parts...and they have gone up!!! about $900. That is the 'discount price' from Wilwood! I know they can be had for cheaper...for example, they quoted me $156 for each caliper. Summit has them for $130. Some discount!

Anyway, I went a different route. I just ordered a Wilwood 'kit' from a discount dealer. It was $593 including shipping.
What I get is:

Two Wilwood billet aluminum calipers w/ street pads
Two adaptor brackets
two disks and disk adaptors
A forged billet aluminum hub (this is the cool part!!! )
All associated hardware (bearings, bolts, etc.)
Adjustable proportional valve
Two stainless steal flexible brake lines.

That is A LOT of cool stuff for $593 (shipped)!!!

Here is the catch:
I ordered the kit for '62-'72 B-bodies w/ drum brakes.
As a result, the adaptor brackets probably won't work.
I know you said that you used the A-body brackets, but I could not order the A-body kit because it uses the wrong hub.
This is an important point for anybody attempting to use a Wilwood Kit:

The B-body hub 'SHOULD' fit the '57-'61 spindle. (I'll find out when I get the kit.)
In fact, hubs from '57 to '72, EXCEPT FOR 9" DRUMS (used on A-bodies), should fit any spindle shaft from those same years. The reason for this is that they all use the same bearings. Therefore, the spindle shafts must be the same diameters, and the race housings must all be the same diameter.

HOWEVER, this does NOT guarantee that the OFFSETS of the hubs will be correct!!! This is an important point! THis can throw off your alignment, and also prevent the drum backing plates from orienting properly w/ the brake drums.

For me, it doesn't matter, since I will probably have to modify or custom fab an adapter bracket. When I do this, I will account for any incorrect offset that is created by using the B-body hub on my '57 spindle.

So, as you can see, this is NOT a 'plug 'n' play' system like the AAJ kit.
I will find out how much work it will be in about a month when I receive the kit!

But for a little bit of research and work (and hopefully a little luck), I hope to have a very high performance and high quality braking system for LESS money than any of the other kits out there (if everything goes as planned, that is!! )

Tom

Edited by ThomasD500 2005-12-13 10:04 PM
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1960fury
Posted 2005-12-14 1:24 AM (#45713 - in reply to #45704)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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thats a good deal!!! and in case the b body hubs fit our cars (very likely) it SHOULD work. probably more difficult to fabricate caliper brackets, but you save $200+!!! keep us updated! my girlfriend wants disks too on her 61 desoto but she also wants to keep her original 14" wheels (wheelcovers) so my route with the 12"+ rotors won't work. what diameter disks are you using with the B body kit? will this kit fit the stock 14" wheels?
no i didn't know the 1.25" hats were designed for f0rds

ps if the willwood b body kit is only 600 why is their forwardlook kit so ....... expensive?!

Edited by 1960fury 2005-12-14 1:29 AM
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ThomasD500
Posted 2005-12-15 12:25 AM (#45784 - in reply to #45713)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes


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Hi Sid,

The kit that I bought uses the 10.75 inch disks, so the 14" wheels SHOULD work. The same kit with the 11.75" disks is $999, and the kit with 12.19" rotor is $1099. The 10.75" kit I bought is usually $659, but it was on sale for $593 (10% off.)
Interestingly, I can buy an 'upgrade' kit for my kit that includes 12.19 rotors and brackets for $350...which adds up to $950...less than the $1099 that they want for the 12.19" kit in the first place! ...go figure... PLUS you will still have your 10.75" disks and brackets for spares.

The MagnumForce kit for FL cars uses the 12.19 rotors (I believe) and costs $1495. So essentially, they are charging an extra $400 for the correct brackets! MAYBE there are some other modifications that they had to make in addition to the brackets...I guess I will find out when I get my kit and try to install it!
Also, Magnum Force is a seperate company from Wilwood, they just use wilwood parts. So their bracketss are custom made by them. And thier kits are all priced higher than where I bought mine. The same B-body kit that I bought for $600 (from HotRods USA or HotRod Heaven)would be $675 from Magnum Force (pretty close), but Magnumforce does NOT include the proportioning valve, brake lines or shipping. Those would easily cost you another $100.
Tom
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1960fury
Posted 2005-12-15 5:01 AM (#45795 - in reply to #45784)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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i'd say 10.75" rotors are a bit undersized for a heavy car, actually the 12.19" rotors i'm using are rather small for a full size
i found a place were you can get the 4997 calipers for only $112.95 each: http://wilwood.carshopinc.com/index.php/manufacturers_id/402629
i couldn't find prices for the A body caliper brackets but i believe it's still possible to "build" a 12.19" rotor forwardlook kit for under $700. back in 98/99 i payed only around $650 without flex lines/adapters. however, please keep us posted if the B body hubs work on your car. good luck!
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ThomasD500
Posted 2005-12-16 6:25 PM (#45902 - in reply to #45795)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes


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Yep, 10.75 is minimal. I think that is the same size rotor AAJ is using. SSB is using 11.75-for$999 I believe. And I could have bought the Wilwood 12.19 kit for $1099-but that was an extra $400 that I did not want to spend.
At least I can upgrade later to 12.19 later for another $350...if I really think it is necessary.
But I will keep you all informed as to how well this works out.

Tom
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kcasey
Posted 2005-12-16 10:36 PM (#45918 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes


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tom, where did you buy your kit?
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ThomasD500
Posted 2005-12-17 10:24 AM (#45935 - in reply to #45918)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes


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Hi kcasey,

I bought my kit here:

http://www.hotrodheaven.com/

The regular price is $659. Check out their 'coupons' on their web page (at the top.) Any purchase over $500 is %10 off...I got mine for $593.
Although many other sites are selling Willwoods for a similar price, this sight is the only one I found that will throw in the proportioning valve and stainless steel brake lines and the shipping for that price.
I know I am repeating info, but the kit (2721) is NOT for '57-'61 Mopars. It is for '62-'72 B-Bodies (kit 2721.) I will have to do some fabricating to make it work, and I don't know how much yet.
I am hoping that the fabrication required will be minimal, as in some modifications to the bracket and maybe some shims to get things lined up correctly.

Tom
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kcasey
Posted 2005-12-19 10:24 PM (#46106 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes


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thanks Tom. i'm also really curious if your 14'' wheels will clear the calipers with the small rotor. my brother put an aaj kit on his car and it works great, but i have put wilwood brakes on customers cars and wow! hope to hear how it turns out.
Kevin
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alumcanTandThd
Posted 2005-12-19 10:43 PM (#46109 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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Tom, I agree, that if something is 'shoved' down your throat, over 'handed' to you, no one wants to really have anything much to do with that item.
Case in point.
I guess, our (ex) lead moderator, in his over zealous (?) attitude, really did some 'shoving.'
Go back into the archives, and read Daven Anderson, "Einstine's" posts, reccomending the AAJ system.
Night and day, between 'them' two.
It's good that those, are posting their, $$, and finds!
Anybody check out what the PST people's, DB conversion kit? How does it compair with the others? PST supplies the highly reccomened KYB gas shocks for our vehicles. KG4507 and KG5511 (much discussion about these shocks, back in the archives.)
Sid, you seem to have the most usage, other than Einstine, on a '60 Ply DB conversion.
I have no idea what 15" wheels you are running.
Einstine's usage, is up and down the Rocky Mountains, at normal interstate speed limits.
Sis, your useage is more from zero to triple digits to zero.
Anyway, how much 'brake dust' do you get throwed up on yer whitewalls at those speeds?
Be nice, if pictures could be posted, by all parties involved.
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1960fury
Posted 2005-12-20 6:09 AM (#46140 - in reply to #46109)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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alumcanTandThd - 2005-12-19 10:43 PM

Sid, you seem to have the most usage, other than Einstine, on a '60 Ply DB conversion.
I have no idea what 15" wheels you are running.
Einstine's usage, is up and down the Rocky Mountains, at normal interstate speed limits.
Sis, your useage is more from zero to triple digits to zero.
Anyway, how much 'brake dust' do you get throwed up on yer whitewalls at those speeds?
Be nice, if pictures could be posted, by all parties involved.


actually i'm running 16" aluminum smoothies (centerline stealth type "77") with spinner "dog dishes". despite billet aluminum these wheels look period correct 50s/early 60s. these rims are completly closed so no dust on whitewalls
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ThomasD500
Posted 2006-01-24 8:33 PM (#48792 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes


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Well, after 6 weeks, the parts have finally arrived. They look very nice!
I will post some pictures.
My Dodge is still 300 miles away, so I cannot report on fit just yet.
But I weighed the parts....The whole combo, including the new hubs, weigh in at 16lbs per side! I think I will be reducing my unsprung weight dramatically! I bet the old cast iron drums alone weigh more than that.

Tom
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kcasey
Posted 2006-01-28 11:39 AM (#49044 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes


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cool! i am waiting to here how this swap turns out so please keep us posted. thanks for the updates.
kevin
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Bugman
Posted 2006-01-28 6:49 PM (#49066 - in reply to #49044)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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Hey Sid, got some pics with the wheels off?
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1960fury
Posted 2006-01-30 11:38 AM (#49183 - in reply to #49066)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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Bugman - 2006-01-28 6:49 PM

Hey Sid, got some pics with the wheels off?


yes, but no scanner
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Bugman
Posted 2006-01-30 5:15 PM (#49210 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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Rats...
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ThomasD500
Posted 2006-04-27 12:53 AM (#54808 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes


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Check out the 'Albums' section for a photo of the kit.
I still have not got around to installing it yet...my car is still about 300 miles away. Although, I purchased a tow dolly! So I am that much closer to getting it down here so that I can work on it!

Tom
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1960fury
Posted 2007-04-23 6:46 PM (#80962 - in reply to #54808)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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almost 12 months, no update does someone know if B body front hubs and 57-61 full size (except imperial) hubs interchange?
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BigBlockMopar
Posted 2007-05-15 10:03 AM (#83008 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



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Looks nice.
How thick of a rotordisc can those Wilwood-calipers take?

I'm currently fitting '73 discbrake-rotors on the front my '64 NewYorker Salon, and I'm using the stock C-body sliding/pin (?) calipers.
I've already made a caliper-bracket adaptorplate for it and I'd rather use a fixed multi-piston caliper if possible, but have got none to test with.




Edited by BigBlockMopar 2007-05-15 10:07 AM
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ebbsspeed
Posted 2007-05-22 9:19 PM (#83946 - in reply to #45465)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes


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1960fury - 2005-12-10 12:41 AM

wilwood part #s:

120-4997 calipers (2 required)
150-3668 set brake pads, soft
170-3265 rotor hats, 1.25" offset (2 req.)
160-0276 rotors (2 req.)
230-0150 rotor bolt kit (2 req.)
230-0204 mounting bolt kit (2 req.)
2 A body caliper brackets (sorry couldn't find #s) others might work as well

i used mopar performance braided teflon lines and 45° aluminum caliper to flex line adapters.




Could I use the same parts list for a 56 New Yorker? Is there a difference in the front spindles between a 56 and the 57-61 cars?

Thanks!
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Devioussquirrel
Posted 2007-06-20 7:07 PM (#86885 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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Have the prices at Magnumforce really gone up since this message thread got started?

I recently looked at their website and saw three different kits being marketed to the '57-'61 MoPar crowd:

$1495 kit: http://www.magnumforce.com/store/detail.asp?ProductID=2870&Category...

$1695 kit: http://www.magnumforce.com/store/detail.asp?ProductID=3106&Category...

$2095 kit: http://www.magnumforce.com/store/detail.asp?ProductID=3107&Category...

All three of these kits advertise 11 3/4" rotors. I know the calipers are different, but can anyone explain the cost and the large cost difference between the lowest and highest kits?
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dukeboy
Posted 2007-06-20 8:27 PM (#86896 - in reply to #86885)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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Looks like the calipers are the only difference....Of course the mounting hardware will be diff. too so...........


Personally, I don't see much difference between the stopping power of the larger rotor's vs. the smaller 11" rotor's......
I've run the 11" A-body rotor's on my 3800 LB B-body, and never had a problem with them..(Fade).

The cheaper route, as I can't see $2000.00 worth of brake kit, when I got the 11" A body's on mine for around $150.00-$200.00.....

They all do the same thing....STOP the car...Some do it with expensive parts some use "Stock" parts...I prefer to use the "Stock" parts as these were good enough to stop a 3800 car, then they should stop a 4000 LB car.....

Do any of ya'll drive these cars that hard? I mean to need all that braking......Don't get me wrong I love to go fast, but also love to stop too, but the stock brakes as far as disc set-up's go, are just fine for me...Cheaper too....
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matador60
Posted 2007-07-31 3:49 PM (#91660 - in reply to #80962)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes



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I ordered the front brake kit (Wilwood) for a B body and everything is a bolt on operation (except the plate that holds the caliper). I'am in the process of having them machined now. I'am putting these on a 60 Dodge Matador.
When I get done, will have pictures. Also putting them on rear, you have to change axle to the later style for the green brg.
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narleycharlie
Posted 2007-08-02 5:53 PM (#91900 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes


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With the Wilwood brakes , arn t ya ll concerned abouth the specialty calipers and pads if you break down in TimBuckTwo on a Sunday morning . I would be concerned about the availability of parts when out on the road . The AAJ kit uses GM calipers and pads correct ? Those would be a lt easier to find .
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matador60
Posted 2007-08-06 8:00 PM (#92292 - in reply to #91900)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



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I'am in the process of removing the AAJ brakes from my car. I have the four wheel disc setup.
They flat don't work. I have a long list of problems connect with them. Roger last comment to me was
(I don't know anything about brakes, when I get a question I call someone. I went threw salvage yard till
I found stuff that would fit, Its your job to figure out how to make it work. Call and tell me when you do.)
I can get any part I need over night from Wilwood. I'am tired of draging my feet to stop.
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narleycharlie
Posted 2007-08-07 1:16 AM (#92362 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes


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Thats funny , I don t think I ve heard any other complaints on the AAJ setup . I don t have one , sooo I am all ears before I plunk down my money . I have station wagon brakes on my 59 Ply, 2.5 in wide , big diff from the 2 in . I m not in a rush to do a conversion .
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Fanbladeus
Posted 2007-08-07 9:31 AM (#92386 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



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Hmm same here charlie...

I kept going back to AAJ as the failsafe while I'm shopping for a conversion kit. I'm running the stock setup (aside from my dual jar MC) only until I need to service them again. Its disheartening to see that they aren't the gold standard for a reliable conversion.

Matador:

What kind of problems were you having? Does the kit have fundamental design flaws or did you just get some bad apples?

I am surprised you had such a problem with Rodger as well, he was always real nice on the phone to me and seemed to know his stuff.
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matador60
Posted 2007-08-07 10:07 PM (#92480 - in reply to #92386)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



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I'am not trying to get into a p--sing contest with anyone. I have some bad problems with his conversion,
not stopping is the first one. I will just go with the front now. front caliper bracket is warped and out of parallel
and perpendicular with disc rotor. it was the design and the manufactured. bolts to hold caliper out of parallel.
when brakes were applied with the 70 thousandths disparity on each side. made for very low brake pedal.
it also destroyed the wheel bearings by trying to bring everything back in line. I tried 4 different master cylinders
15/16, 1, 1 1/16, 1 1/8, nothing helped just too much play in system.

I have his four wheel disc setup on the car. the rear are worse.

There has been some problems with his conversion on the forward look, but were deleted by someone.
I have seen this stated in other post after I bought mine.

His last comment to me was: I went threw the salvage yard and found parts that will bolt up, Its your job to
figure out how to make it work and when you do call and tell me.
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aajbrakes
Posted 2007-08-12 1:04 AM (#92836 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: RE: Wilwood Brakes


Member

Posts: 17

Location: Beautiful Portland,Oregon


I just read E. Moore's post. I have never said that I went through salvage yards to find parts that would work. And I did not say its; "your job to figure out how to make them work".

I have never answered a post before but this is an lie. I don't know what this man's problem is but I have worked to help him and even offer to buy the kit back but that is not about to happen now.,

If there was any bad stuff about us here I would like to read it.

We are sorry Mr. Moore is not happy with us. We can not please everyone!

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portlandfury
Posted 2007-08-12 4:32 PM (#92881 - in reply to #45440)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes


New User

Posts: 1

Regarding AAJ Brakes: I have had several dealings and conversations with Roger at AAJ. He really does know what he's talking about and I have never had any problems with his brakes. I have never heard of any problems either. Perhaps Matador60 isn't quite as knowledgable as they would like to think? I know of several people who have gone to AAJ and all seem very satisfied.....
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matador60
Posted 2007-08-12 9:32 PM (#92921 - in reply to #92881)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



Regular

Posts: 71
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Location: Kansas City, Missouri
For the record, I've worked on virtually all car systems (both foreign and domestic) for 50+ years, including extensive work on automotive braking systems, so I am not a dilettante when it comes to car repair.

In trying to solve the problem I've had with AAJ brakes, I've spoken with several knowledgeable engineers (including General Motors SAE engineers and technical consultants at Eaton Manufacturing), all of whom have agreed that the system which I purchased from him is poorly designed and in all likelihood will not perform as promised.

While I understand that Roger is trying to protect the reputation of his product, I feel anyone contemplating purchasing same should be informed about the product-related difficulties I have had in trying to make it work.

I have not misquoted him in any way (including his comments about 'finding parts from a salvage yard' and 'it's my problem to figure out how to make it work'); in fact, I couldn't even think up such absurd remarks to make to a customer. When I advised him it wasn't working he did not offer to take it back and refund my purchase price. And I most assuredly take exception to his calling me a liar, which I am not.

If anyone wants the stuff I'am replaceing all you have to do is pay the freight. This will be the last posting I will make regarding this product.
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dukeboy
Posted 2007-08-12 10:23 PM (#92930 - in reply to #92921)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



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Location: Big pimpin'
Well, I'm gonna chime in here...I've got JUNKYARD 11" rotors and brackets/GM calipers on my '58 Plymouth of my own makin' and they seem to work properly...

Granted, I'm not gonna try to salom race this thing or nothin', but they seem to stop OK...




Edited by dukeboy 2007-08-12 10:26 PM
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matador60
Posted 2007-11-19 10:49 PM (#103940 - in reply to #92930)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



Regular

Posts: 71
2525
Location: Kansas City, Missouri
I now have Wilwood brakes on my 60 dodge. I took off my (Fred Flintstone brakes aka AAJ brakes) and I can't
believe the difference. With my flintstone brakes the pedal was on the floor. Now the pedal is very high, goes
down about 1/2 to 3/4 in. and you are stopping hard. They are as good as my 930 Porsche.
You can get this kit with the adapters from Chenoweth Speed at 309 266 8084.
The following is some pictures of the installation.
I can't seem to get more than one picture at a time load. If I can get if figured out I will send them later.
I will post the brake pictures with my car in the albums.

Edited by matador60 2007-11-19 10:59 PM




(front-brake-1.jpg)



Attachments
----------------
Attachments front-brake-1.jpg (77KB - 356 downloads)
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Devioussquirrel
Posted 2007-11-20 3:40 PM (#104000 - in reply to #103940)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



Extreme Veteran

Posts: 354
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Location: Louisiana
Matador60,
Happy to hear about your satisfaction with the Wilwood parts. I had a couple questions:

1. What wheels did you end up going with?
2. What size rotors did you select?
3. When you received the parts from Chenoweth, what additional modifications were necessary?

Thanks!
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1960fury
Posted 2007-11-20 4:27 PM (#104009 - in reply to #104000)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



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and do you know if B body wilwood hubs are the same as FL wilwood hubs?
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matador60
Posted 2007-11-21 2:50 PM (#104116 - in reply to #104000)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



Regular

Posts: 71
2525
Location: Kansas City, Missouri
I had trouble with the original wheels so I had a set of 15x7 wire wheel made for the car.
I use the biggest rotors they had 12.19 in if I remember correctly.
For the front wheels it will be a bolt on operations. You don't have to use a space for the
front brgs as with the Flintstones, they fit without it. They are for the B body.

For the rear you will need to drill two holes in the housing flang, it uses a different bolt pattern.
Also you need later axles. You have to use green brgs with a circlip and the spacer. The brgs
will not fit the older axle. The reason you do this is to eliminate the end play in the rear end,
it will cause the brake pedal to go to the floor. The end play is 8 to 16 ths, then you double it
for both sides. Makes 32 ths and max is (.005 a side) to have a good brake pedal. So all your
pedal travel is not use to take up slack and aligning the pads to rotors.





(rear-brake-1.jpg)



Attachments
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Attachments rear-brake-1.jpg (78KB - 343 downloads)
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matador60
Posted 2007-11-21 3:00 PM (#104118 - in reply to #104116)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



Regular

Posts: 71
2525
Location: Kansas City, Missouri
I don't know how else to send more then one picture, so here goes. .
This is not hard once you figure it out.

Edited by matador60 2007-11-21 3:03 PM




(rear-brake-2.jpg)



(rear-brake3.jpg)



(front-brake-2.jpg)



(front-brake-4.jpg)



Attachments
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Attachments rear-brake-2.jpg (60KB - 315 downloads)
Attachments rear-brake3.jpg (61KB - 316 downloads)
Attachments front-brake-2.jpg (48KB - 338 downloads)
Attachments front-brake-4.jpg (57KB - 325 downloads)
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1960fury
Posted 2007-11-21 3:01 PM (#104119 - in reply to #104116)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



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matador60 - 2007-11-21 2:50 PM

I
I use the biggest rotors they had 12.19 in if I remember correctly.


For the rear you will need to drill two holes in the housing flang, it uses a different bolt pattern.
Also you need later axles. You have to use green brgs with a circlip and the spacer. The brgs
will not fit the older axle.


i use the 12.19 rotors too but they don't fit 15" stamped steel wheels.

no need to change the axle or use green bearings. the wilwood 12.19 rear kit works with very little mods WITH the original 57-61+ axle/bearings. just "sandwich" the center section of the original backing plate to use as bearing retainer only and 2 additional holes in the flange are needed and shortening of the wilwood alluminum spacers. almost a simple bolt on with regular home tools.
i think i drove 100+k miles with wilwood brakes original axle/bearings and correct end play. i never had any trouble. i can lock all tires anytime

Edited by 1960fury 2007-11-21 3:17 PM
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1960fury
Posted 2007-11-21 3:04 PM (#104120 - in reply to #104118)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



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looks great! i have the wilwood kit with external parking brake. how much are the front caliper brackets?
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matador60
Posted 2007-11-21 3:16 PM (#104122 - in reply to #104119)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



Regular

Posts: 71
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Location: Kansas City, Missouri
I understand you have done the rear with the original axles, but I'am not following you on how it was done.
I'am not sure what you mean by "sandwich" the center section.
You have the flange, for the wheel to bolt to, backing plate for shoes, outer seal, bearing, inter seal.
That bearing has to have end play to work. How are you holding it from moving and will it last.
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1960fury
Posted 2007-11-21 3:20 PM (#104123 - in reply to #104122)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



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matador60 - 2007-11-21 3:16 PM

I understand you have done the rear with the original axles, but I'am not following you on how it was done.
I'am not sure what you mean by "sandwich" the center section.
You have the flange, for the wheel to bolt to, backing plate for shoes, outer seal, bearing, inter seal.
That bearing has to have end play to work. How are you holding it from moving and will it last.


i cut the center section out of the backing plates to use as a bearing retainer only (the original backing plate is a backing plate AND bearing retainer) simply sandwich that piece between axle and wilwood bracket. the original bearing seal and shims stay just like original. but i don't know if this method works with the internal parking brake kit (it should) i have the external parking brake kit.

Edited by 1960fury 2007-11-21 3:39 PM
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matador60
Posted 2007-11-21 3:41 PM (#104130 - in reply to #104123)
Subject: Re: Wilwood Brakes



Regular

Posts: 71
2525
Location: Kansas City, Missouri
If I'am understanding this correctly, you still have end play in the axle. The object is to get rid of all the end play
in the axle so it will not move the pads back more than .005 ths. Anything more will cause your pedal to go
down to take up the pad clearance up. The backing plates from wilwood have a recess built in for the green bearing
circlip to fit into. I had so much trouble with the other that I was not taking a chance with these. I eliminated
all the travel in everything except the pads.

The other thing I DIDN'T try any other wheels on the car. I will do that soon. I know it will take a 15 wheel
to work with the big rotors.
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