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Expert
Posts: 2524
 
Location: Houston | I'm planning to list on Ebay my '58 Saratoga pretty soon but I thought I list it here first as a first pass. It's a great car that I'm just not getting any use out of, nor have I had time to spend on it.
This is the Holes movie car we've discussed on this site in the past. It spent its life in CA until I bought it and brought it to the Houston, Texas area. In the time I have owned it it has always been garaged.
I have a Word document that gives more detail I can send anyone who is interested. I can also send more pics.
As with any car I sell, I will not hide any bad parts or misrepresent anything. I also am willing to assist in an overseas sale. I will not work with any sales agents or brokers or consignment houses, nor will I release the car or title until I have payment in full.
1958 Chrysler Saratoga Spring Special 126" WB
354 Hemi
3 sp auto
3.23 SG 8-3/4" diff
Factory AutoPilot - 1st year for any car, ever
Approx 157K miles from new
Complete mechnical rebuild within last 1000 miles
99% rust free with no rust repairs ever, perfect floor pans and no headlight area rust, never
I am asking $26K which I feel is a fair price and, of course, far less than I have in it.
Please PM if interested!
 (58 Chrysler Holes.JPG)
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 58 Chrysler Holes.JPG (190KB - 333 downloads)
3544 low res.jpg (181KB - 327 downloads)
Cruise control 58.jpg (102KB - 315 downloads)
354.JPG (49KB - 314 downloads)
300 exhaust Fel-PRO 9269 gasket.JPG (140KB - 307 downloads)
IMG_5734 lr.JPG (42KB - 324 downloads)
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Location: Under the X in Texas | It has the 4-bolt truck exhaust manif with it?? or on it??
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Expert
Posts: 2524
Location: Houston | Yes. They are the repros that Hot Heads was selling...I think they ran out. Now that I think about it, I had them coated by PolyDyn which is why they look like that. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1107
Location: Arvada, Colorado (NW Denver Metro Area) | GregCon - 2018-12-05 6:04 PM Yes. They are the repros that Hot Heads was selling...I think they ran out. Now that I think about it, I had them coated by PolyDyn which is why they look like that. I will check with HOI HEADS to see if they are going to make another run of these 4 bolt Manifolds again. If they spent the money on Molds for these they might do another run of them. I will report back on what they say. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 6555
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | 2 sets of norms.... https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=hemi+%28Chrysler%2CDeSoto%2CDo...
cheaper: https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=hemi+%28Chrysler%2CDeSoto%2CDo...
Edited by mstrug 2018-12-05 7:36 PM
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Location: Under the X in Texas | Hot Heads didn't make them. John Forney had the molds made and cast. He is a machinist and did the final machine work on them. Then he had Hot Heads help him retail them out. Note they have no "bung" for the heat attachment line to go to the choke. Also, they will not clear the suspension and Power steering box of a torsion bar Chrysler. Chrysler cast new manifolds during 1957 with 4-bolt flanges that were "clearanced" to fit the new chassis.
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Expert
Posts: 2524
Location: Houston | Well...the choke part I couldn't care less about lol. As for clearance....I can assure you the car still has T-bars and power steering and most of all I am the absolute last person alive who runs stuff that doesn't clear. Because stuff that rubs is the first sign of shoddy workmanship. Do I have a 'secret'? Perhaps.... |
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Expert
Posts: 2206
Location: Muskego, WI | Greg,
Beautiful car, which is no surprise, if I had the cash it would be mine! I don't want to highjack your thread, so I sent you a PM about some of your engine accessory setup. Good luck with your sale. |
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Expert
Posts: 2524
Location: Houston | Thanks Jon! |
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Expert
Posts: 2524
Location: Houston | Here is a pic of most of the brackets
 (brackets 2.jpg)
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brackets 2.jpg (117KB - 299 downloads)
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Expert
Posts: 3156
Location: NY & VT | Seems reasonable for what it is. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 9893
Location: So. Cal | Do you have any interior shots Greg? I am much more interested in it than my pocketbook allows me to be. |
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Expert
Posts: 2524
Location: Houston | I know how that goes, lol.
Here are some interior shots. I have not done anything to the interior in the time I've owned it other than I had the speedo fully rebuilt. As you can see, the seat covers are non-stock. It looks like they left the originals underneath, I have no idea what they look like.
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seats lr.JPG (200KB - 308 downloads)
seats pass.JPG (204KB - 332 downloads)
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Posts: 2524
Location: Houston | more
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headliner.JPG (162KB - 309 downloads)
headliner.JPG (162KB - 295 downloads)
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Expert
Posts: 2524
Location: Houston | More photos. I will restate...the car has no floorpan rust whatsoever and never has had any, ever. There are two small rust areas (one in front of each rear wheel well) and no other rust anywhere on the car.
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floorpan 1.JPG (111KB - 334 downloads)
floorpan 2.JPG (125KB - 318 downloads)
floorpan 3.JPG (129KB - 318 downloads)
rear end 2.JPG (82KB - 295 downloads)
trunk lid.JPG (201KB - 319 downloads)
trunk floor.JPG (237KB - 298 downloads)
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Posts: 1728
Location: Fleetwood, Pa | Thanks for posting more photos... |
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Expert
Posts: 2524
Location: Houston | No problem, hope you received my email too.
Other parts that go with the car...the original Spitfire (Poly) heads, air cleaner, PS pump, driveshaft, rear end, exhaust manifolds, plus other 58 Chrysler bits and pieces. I have a set of front fenders and hood from a parts car I will also include, and...a swivel seat that I bought from a Desoto.
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swivel seat.JPG (130KB - 309 downloads)
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Expert
Posts: 2524
Location: Houston | I realized the engine photo has the temporary air cleaner I had on it while I was paining the proper one. Here is a (dusty) photo of it with the air cleaner it has now.
 (air cleaner 354.JPG)
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air cleaner 354.JPG (106KB - 306 downloads)
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Expert
Posts: 3967
Location: DFW, TX | StillOutThere - 2018-12-05 6:33 PM
Also, they will not clear the suspension and Power steering box of a torsion bar Chrysler. Chrysler cast new manifolds during 1957 with 4-bolt flanges that were "clearanced" to fit the new chassis.
GregCon - 2018-12-06 12:08 PM
As for clearance....I can assure you the car still has T-bars and power steering and most of all I am the absolute last person alive who runs stuff that doesn't clear. Because stuff that rubs is the first sign of shoddy workmanship. Do I have a 'secret'? Perhaps....
Probably not an issue since you're running a low-deck 354 versus a tall-deck 392. Here is my '57 Chrysler with '57 392 and power steering running the 'clearanced' version of the 4-bolt manifolds. I put in a couple of shims to increase the clearance from what you see here, but it's still very tight. No rubbing. 
Good luck with your sale, Greg. I called the previous owner right after you had bought it. Great car.
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20171216_175547.jpg (229KB - 295 downloads)
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Location: Under the X in Texas | A pair of the '57-58 4-bolt manifolds
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2008_07270012.JPG (40KB - 299 downloads)
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Expert
Posts: 2524
Location: Houston | Lol that's my secret! The low deck. Well, imagine the car when you called on it with a lot more money and time spent on it, and that's it. |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 404
Location: upstate new york | Very nice ride...good luck with the sale...hey Greg...are those 14 or 15" tires on there? How wide is the whitewall? where did the wheels come from? Alot of questions i know, but i'm looking at replacing tires and wheels on my car...
billy
Edited by billy 2018-12-13 11:56 AM
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Expert
Posts: 2524
Location: Houston | Thanks Billy. They are Diamondbacks which are essentially BF Goodrich tires that they add the whitewalls to. I think they are 3" but I can measure them tomorrow. The wheels are steel rims from Wheel Vintiques. I think they are 15x7 but possibly could be 8"...I've forgotten. The tires are 235/75's. I've been very happy with them.
I will add that if anyone from the FL family buys the car I will throw in a bunch of extra 58 (and a few 57) Chrysler parts. Taillight lenses, front fenders, bumpers, and even a full set of side glasses with nice chrome surrounds. These are all parts I bought 'just in case' I ever needed them; they are not from my car but I'll include them. I also have a very nice frame with rear end, from suspension, and steering gear that can be included at no charge if you want them. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1177
Location: D-70199 Heslach | Hi Greg,
I wonder if you give up your whole fwd-look hobby because you give all the parts with the vehicle......
even the frame ....... |
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Expert
Posts: 2524
Location: Houston | Well, I'm at least putting it on hold as I have too many projects including that I'm planning to re-model the inside of my house. As for the frame, I've had that up for grabs a long time...no one wants it! |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 9893
Location: So. Cal | A lot of people want it, including me, but no one is willing to pay the $1200 to ship it. That's the real problem. |
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Expert
Posts: 3967
Location: DFW, TX | It looks like someone was willing to pay for a nice one.
Get ready for a surprise... https://www.instagram.com/p/Cf-yEB-qycj/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y= |
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Expert
Posts: 3490
Location: Montreal, Canada |
What a freaking monstrosity!
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 9893
Location: So. Cal | He should be congratulated. Most people wouldn't know how to spend lots of money, hard work, & dedication to turn a beautiful $30K original movie car into a $10K monstrosity. He could have done this with a basket case Windsor and ended up with the same result, but no, he had to destroy something beautiful and awesome with history behind it instead. Just wouldn't be the same otherwise. RIP poor "Holes" spring special Saratoga.
 (1958-chrysler-saratoga-spring-special-2dr-ht-354-hemi-disney-039holes039-movie-car-3.jpg)
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1958-chrysler-saratoga-spring-special-2dr-ht-354-hemi-disney-039holes039-movie-car-3.jpg (26KB - 171 downloads)
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 9893
Location: So. Cal | He should have stuck with the Cadillacs. They didn't look too bad.
"Custom Car builder Tom Black who created two stunning 41 Cadillac Customs in the past couple of years has been working on a new project Custom, and something quite different from his 40's style customs he created previously.? @tom.black2 had the help of @eblackdesign to visualize his new dream custom based on a 1957 Chrysler 300 Ghia! A design inspired by the Factory prototypes from the late 50's mixed with the Custom Cars from the same era. Since Spring 2019 Tom has been working on this project, and yesterday it was the first day the car was out in the sunlight. What an absolute beautiful  Custom with so many subtile and not so subtile restyling going on. A few, more obvious modifications are the 8 inches shortened body and lowered fins... Stunning." 
 (Holes Saratoga DeStoryed 1.jpg)
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Holes Saratoga DeStoryed 1.jpg (138KB - 171 downloads)
Holes Saratoga DeStoryed 2.jpg (149KB - 157 downloads)
Holes Saratoga DeStoryed 3.jpg (136KB - 158 downloads)
Holes Saratoga DeStoryed 4.jpg (167KB - 163 downloads)
Holes Saratoga DeStoryed 5.jpg (174KB - 156 downloads)
Holes Saratoga DeStoryed 6.jpg (171KB - 149 downloads)
Holes Saratoga DeStoryed 7.jpg (184KB - 147 downloads)
Holes Saratoga DeStoryed 8.jpg (170KB - 159 downloads)
Holes Saratoga DeStoryed 9.jpg (147KB - 177 downloads)
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 5054
| nope... he actually made the 300c uglier... |
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Expert
Posts: 2029
| .
Oh, it’s a Los Angeles-built Spring Special Saratoga (the data plate located near right hood hinge)…
A single sweep side molding and Auto Pilot options…
I understand this is old thread, but…
Could someone post the cowl tag picture, please?
It’s would be very interesting to see the digits stamped on it…
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data tag.jpg (87KB - 144 downloads)
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 7501
Location: northern germany | wtf i wish i had never seen this. one of my favorite cars. a rust free car turned into a turd. this guy must be sick. |
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Expert
Posts: 3967
Location: DFW, TX | Ha, the car is awesome. Exner would have loved it.
I agree that he could have started with a less-than-stellar example instead of that beautiful Saratoga. But, it's his car and we all had a chance to buy it before he did. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 5054
| we can all have opinions... and imho it sucks...
Exner made the right call on 57-58-59-60 cars.. then... |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1177
Location: D-70199 Heslach | The DeStoryed Saratoga is an ugly creation. I've seen much better "kustoms" |
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Expert
Posts: 2206
Location: Muskego, WI | I like the look of the final car with two glaring exceptions. One, the front end below the grill looks enormous and bulky. Two, the gas fill cap up behind the windshield looks clunky and awkward too.
I will also agree that Greg's car was wasted on this project. If you're already going to be cutting up a car, why not find a parts car to start with instead of a beautiful, well preserved rare care? |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 7501
Location: northern germany | mikes2nd - 2022-07-24 2:24 AM
we can all have opinions... and imho it sucks...
Exner made the right call on 57-58-59-60 cars.. then...
Actually NOT on a FL site  This car looks so anti FL and the front end so high end italian anti americana.... The way it gapes into the camera like a frog.... This car is UGLY, if you are into late 50s american cars. Period. |
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Expert
Posts: 3967
Location: DFW, TX | It's almost like you guys have never seen Exner's styling concepts during his time at Chrysler.  This car fits right in with them.
Even your description, "high end italian anti americana" describes them - all of them - quite accurately. Maybe you just don't like Exner's taste, and prefer the corporate late '50s styling of the cars that left the factory. Nothing wrong with that, but the changes this owner made definitely made the car much more like an actual Exner design, which was his intention.
Edited by 57burb 2022-07-25 12:28 PM
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5d8536d642df2.image.jpg (51KB - 160 downloads)
116291_Front_3-4_Web.jpg (147KB - 148 downloads)
Virgil-Exner.jpg (118KB - 186 downloads)
1955 Chrysler Flight Sweep II brochure spread.jpg (218KB - 148 downloads)
restyled_saratoga2.jpg (170KB - 143 downloads)
restyled_saratoga1.jpg (184KB - 140 downloads)
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Expert
Posts: 2112
Location: Idaho - where men are men and spuds are spuds | Hmmmmmm, don't see any similarities. I'll take that '55 Chrysler Flightsweep any day. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 9893
Location: So. Cal | The only one I like is the first one. It's pretty obvious that Exner didn't design the production models by himself. In fact, he likely didn't design them at all - he just oversaw the design process. There's a big difference there. Find out who actually designed the '56 Plymouth, '57 DeSoto, Plymouth, Dodge & '60 Chrysler, Polara etc and give them credit instead. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 5054
| I see he tried copying the flightsweep2... but went half way... I mean even Exner was like put some bumpers there to fix the giant overbite... And the Chrysler execs even went "thats nice... but no..."... All 4 of those cars are better than that horror... Yes the flattened fins look great until you look at the front... blech...
Edited by mikes2nd 2022-07-26 1:02 AM
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 7501
Location: northern germany | 57burb - 2022-07-25 12:20 PM
It's almost like you guys have never seen Exner's styling concepts during his time at Chrysler. This car fits right in with them.
Indeed it does and that is another proof, that this isn't FL. Exner wasn't responsible for the typical late 50s look. This cars looked good DESPITE of Exner.
I guess you like that car too, just because Exner designed it? Sorry dude, you don't understand FL design:
http://forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=77420&post...
Edited by 1960fury 2022-07-26 10:30 AM
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Expert
Posts: 3967
Location: DFW, TX | eh - decided to delete my comment.  Have a great day.
Edited by 57burb 2022-07-26 3:23 PM
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Location: The Mile High City | It looks aghast at what's happend to it!
Edited by Lancer Mike 2022-07-26 11:41 PM
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What the Car is Thinking.jpg (221KB - 141 downloads)
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 7501
Location: northern germany | 57burb - 2022-07-26 12:15 PM
eh - decided to delete my comment. Have a great day.
I didn't read it, but it was probably a good thing to do. Have great day too |
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Expert
Posts: 3967
Location: DFW, TX | It was absolutely a good thing to do. Proverbs 26:4-5 |
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Member
Posts: 17
Location: South Australia | OMbloodyG!! What the F.rog happened here? Sorry to say that this mutant tadpole is a far cry from the previously great looking vehicle it once was. Each to their own, but what a waste. |
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Exner Expert 10K+
Posts: 10182
Location: Lower Mainland BC | .
I know this is all about opinions but I think that it is beautiful and the Exner would approve. It reminds me of 1955 Ferrari 250 GT
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 701
Location: Finland | I see the same as you Dave...it is not too bad....better than the factory concept creations imho. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 5054
| you can see the balance and real design work that went into the front end of the Ferrari..
Its bad even if we all didn't know it was just a hacked 300C front grill...
Ferrari nor Exner would never make a front end that bad.
I really like the back because that is basically a Exner design...
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 8445
Location: Perth Australia | All I see is the Studebaker designs. I know Exner came from there. I think the chrysler execs
probably knocked a lot of Exners designes on the head because they didnt want to build studibakers |
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