You read right, a REGAL LANCER. This is not my car. If you are interested, contact Jim at miz7@comcast.net . I think he is asking $29,500 and I believe it is in the Detroit area on Craigslist. I don't think Jim is a member.
If you are a purist, don't look. I like the naked babe pinstriping motif.
Posted 2008-09-09 7:06 PM (#144241 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+
Location: .Norfolk..Mafia.. ,England UK
Mike,, That is HOT........I especially like the " Frenched Rear Antenna,s.. Pinstriping is neat as Well.. But Under the Hood needs Tidying for my liking,,
You are Brave Posting This AS i think Neil may have something to Say about it ... LOL
Posted 2008-09-09 10:07 PM (#144260 - in reply to #144242) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Mind you, I did post a warning! I asked Jim if he had any of the original interior parts - nope! all that's left is the steering wheel. This is such a rare car that I had to find out more about it. For the Frostbite (love the name), you have to pay for the customizer's tastes. It is not my cup o' tea, but it may be the right car at the right price for someone else.
MoPar Ivar! I have talked to him about his Regal, but I have never seen a picture. Gary, if you can get a picture from him, I would be eternally grateful! From me, that is not much because it is a status you already have, but nonetheless - I would really appreciate it.
Neil, of course you are welcome to run down the list on this one - it is too exhausting for me (perhaps too painful). It does appear to be the real deal. I asked Jim for the data tag numbers, but he did not respond to that request. I would expect a body code of 373 and a paint code of 5XSX or 5SXS less likely 5ASA or 5SAS - but who knows.
Posted 2008-09-09 10:50 PM (#144268 - in reply to #144260) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2244 Location: Yorba Linda, Ca
I will look and see if I have any pictures of the Regal Lancer, I know When Kent came over from Sweden, We took some pictures of it, If I don't have any, I will get ya some NP
PS aren't ya glad ya bought that Desoto?
Absolutely Gorgeous!!!
Posted 2008-09-09 10:59 PM (#144270 - in reply to #144260) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 148
i think this is one of the worst sacrileges i have ever seen done to a TRULY rare classic. i hope virgil and walter c. strike whoever did this deaf and dumb b/c they are already stupid. there are plenty of CRLs around to mutilate. by the way, i have an orginal ivory and bronze one in my garage and i am going out right now and give it a big hug and tell it how sorry i am about its cousin.
Is this fully loaded 1958 Dodge Regal Lancer Super D-500 nothing more than a trailer queen? Too d@mn beautiful to just sit and watch the air leak out the tires.....
Posted 2008-09-09 11:25 PM (#144277 - in reply to #144276) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2244 Location: Yorba Linda, Ca
It is a gorgeous car, I have never seen Aivar trailer one of his cars, on the other hand, I have never seen this one driven. It is fully loaded like you said, even 2 , 4 barrels. The car was used by Dodge at some Big Show, similar to Motorama , when it was new, Hence all the options----Dodge wanted to show what they could do in 58.
You could bet the farm that if that baby was mine, she'd be driven all over the place - the Regal Lancer is right at the top with the '59 Fury 2 door hardtop as my favorite car, FL or otherwise.
Posted 2008-09-09 11:49 PM (#144280 - in reply to #144277) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Holy Mamacita! THANK YOU GARY!!!! Aivar is allowed to do what ever he wants to with it. There are few better friends of Forward Look than he! Wowee - what a specimen. I noticed it has air conditioning too! That car is a total flabbergaster. It is a stark contrast to the Frostbite - oh, what could have been. However, you never know what the Frostbite may have looked like before it was customized - it could have been a total basket case. If it was, any save is a good save.
Pat, now you have to post a photo of yours!!! To me, these Regals are the cat's pajamas among all Forward Lookers. There is another Regal around these parts. Black body with copper roof, trunk, and spear. Super D500 too. It came out of Kansas and landed in the Denver area. I have seen photos, but I have never seen the car itself. Showing it's age, but not bad and quite original.
Posted 2008-09-10 12:00 AM (#144281 - in reply to #144280) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Pat is yours the same as Aivar's or the reverse? Nick Nichols in San Francisco has the reverse of Aivar's. With the photos of Aivar's (THANKS AGAIN GARY) I think I have now seen all the color combinations. Regals are flat-out just the BOMB!
I appreciate Regals so deeply that I can even see the beauty in the Frostbite. I yam who I yam and I cannot turn my back on a Regal. I don't care what condition it is in or what has been done to it - every single one of them is a very special car.
Posted 2008-09-10 8:00 PM (#144366 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Aivar's Regal is a very heavily optioned single-4-bbl D500 .
It was (correctly) re-upholstered and clear-seat-covered by my local auto upholstery shop, in Bishop.
Except for having non-original vinyl headliner (the "Accousti-Foam" stuff being long-not-available) , the additional
carb, and modern radial tires, it's pretty much in as-built condition, and righteously gorgeous.
Now, about that other car: LOVE its interior detail!
The car looks like it was molested back in the 70's, but most of the unique Regal-pieces appear to be present.
The door and quarter trim panels would be a bitch, to recreate; the unique bronze-tone cloth insert stuff is available at SMS.
Its door jambs are white, so it probably had the same motif, as Aivar's car.
About the only available options that Aivar's car didn't have were the Super D500, rear bumper
guards, and the license plate insert (which were part of the "Bumper Appearance Group" of
options). His car does have the optional front bumper guards, however.
Posted 2008-09-10 9:52 PM (#144373 - in reply to #144371) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
My car's pics are buried somewhere in/on the Members Rides board; I think that there are two threads of pics on it.
My car is not (presently) for sale.
Hate to brag, but, before I retired it from show-competition, it won Best in Class at three
national WPC meets---and almost got best-of-show/Dodge at Colorado Springs, in 1986,
losing out to a 70 Challenger RT convertible, in Panther Pink.
That's olde gnus, now; I'm driving and enjoying it, and its 2.76:1 rear end gearset, now....
And, oh yeah, you can also see it on the Tulsarama board pics....drove it there, ya'know;
1600+ miles; 6 days on the road. Had the OEM 3.36:1 installed for that trip, however;
got a little under 14MPG, at 65+ mph, and some around-town driving, for the trip.
Posted 2008-09-10 10:46 PM (#144378 - in reply to #144373) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2244 Location: Yorba Linda, Ca
boy loosing out to a pink Challenger, some of these shows have wierd classes, like the one Borje was just in.
The class ran all the way from the 50's to late 60's not quite as bad as the one you were in thou.
Speaking of "Pink Cars", I asked Aivar about the original color of the 58 New yorker, you were close.
I sure like the color of it now. Close to an original color, Spruce Green, as I recall, but with some Steroids added.
Posted 2008-09-10 10:47 PM (#144379 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2932 Location: Lemoore CA
This kind of stuff is just never gonna end is it? An expert who rubs people the wrong way, and people who are rubbed the wrong way firing back. Geez it's getting old on both sides. Wish I had that 58 regal, not blue freeze or what ever the name is, but the one that belongs to Avair. Very classy car.
Posted 2008-09-10 10:58 PM (#144385 - in reply to #144379) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2244 Location: Yorba Linda, Ca
not sure what ya means 5859, I think that was a bad call, a 57 Dodge lossing to a car that is still very common, challenger. So certainly not taking shots at Neil. He did say the 58
Chrysler was originally Coral, Aivar tells me, it was pink----so was "Close", cant recall what Dodge called the pink color, but I dont think they called it pink in 59---they may have in 55 or 56 when they made the "La Femme"
Posted 2008-09-10 11:02 PM (#144386 - in reply to #144383) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2244 Location: Yorba Linda, Ca
I kinda thought the Cadillac Wreath, tied it all together (The Interior)
I hafta agree with you-----hard to look at one like that, after seeing
"The Real Thing"
Posted 2008-09-10 11:04 PM (#144388 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2932 Location: Lemoore CA
Well, you call it how you see it Gary, fine by me. Your telling me you have never seen Neils car, all the time you have been on this site? Or maybe you were asking to see a picture of someone elses car? In that case I am wrong, but Neil certainly thought you meant his with his retort and brag about how his car won a couple of awards.
Posted 2008-09-10 11:14 PM (#144390 - in reply to #144388) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2244 Location: Yorba Linda, Ca
I was hoping to see pictures of the other regal Lancer, I thought I had responded to the Gentleman that said He had one. but always glad to see more pictures of Neil's car Yes I have seen pics of Neil's car.
I can't find the post now, but seems like somebody said they had , or they had seen a Black and Bronze 58 Regal Lancer, Like Lancer Mike, I would enjoy seeing pics of any of those cars---I had never seen one till Aivar's.
Gary
Posted 2008-09-10 11:24 PM (#144396 - in reply to #144394) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2244 Location: Yorba Linda, Ca
NP, probably my fault, meant to repond in the box where the guy said He had one, eyes are what they usta be, so probably grabbed Neils box instead
I think I forgot to hit the "Reply button" Oh well.
I have a lotta things to Thank Aivar for, His was the 1st 59 Dodge Convertible , I ever saw and ditto the Regal Lancer
Posted 2008-09-13 5:35 PM (#144670 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Chuckle-chuckle-sigh....
Where were we...oh, yeah; nothing important, but, the way that WPC meets are (or, WERE, anyway) judged is by the
members who have entered cars in that particular meet.
The number of 1st place votes, in each class, are compared against the number of 1st place votes in all the other
categories-classes, so, all the highest-placing car models are compared with each other.
My car won its class, as did that Challenger, so, the margin-of-victory was somehow compared between all the highest placing
Dodges, and that Challenger reportedly just beat out my car for Best in Show Dodge.
Posted 2008-09-13 11:35 PM (#144707 - in reply to #144670) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Pat Grant has a Regal in the same color scheme as Aivar's. Pat is in the mid-west and is an astute authority on the ultra-rare Regals, having a long history with that particular model. Although he aspired to own one since they were a new model, he bought his first right here on this site several years ago. That may tell you how hard these are to find! He is aware of a few others across the country and one in Canada. Pat sent me a few personal messages, perhaps we can see a picture of Pat's Regal in the near future. The Frostbite may yet be a good candidate for someone out there!
Posted 2008-09-14 12:21 AM (#144715 - in reply to #144707) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: Parts Unknown
Al's Auto Wrecking up Arlington way had a Regal sitting next to a pair of 57-58 2HTs. One was a mess, but the Regal (black and bronze) and a coral and white CRL really were spectacular cars that should have been saved. I wish I had had the foresight and place to have stuffed cars like these away for 30 years.
Posted 2008-09-14 1:22 AM (#144719 - in reply to #144715) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
For having produced 1163 (IIRC) of them, quite a few Regals gave survived.
Maybe they don't change hands very often; but, they ARE out there.
I have quite a few photos of various of them, in varying states of assembly.
I even have a Regal introductory Press Kit, complete with original jacket.
One day, if Darrell Davis lives long enough (he's the guy who is researching the H.S. files for Fury & D500 & D501, etc., build records---btw, he's found 92 of the purported 102 501's built, but, we know of at least two additional prototype Coronets (a HT and a sedan) which probably were converted by CHRY Engineering, and/or were privately converted (the sedan), but which did receive real-numbered D501 engines.
As the 57-58 D500's were produced in the multi-thousands, their research may be quite lengthy.
Maybe Darrell might be induced to find the Regals, in regards to the production of D500s in their series, but also to confirm the break-out between the 4 color combinations.
Posted 2008-09-14 8:04 AM (#144728 - in reply to #144383) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2679
chrycopsycho - 2008-09-10 10:57 PM
God that interior is awful!LOL
I agree.... I admit im a purist when it comes to the exterior and interior..... in my ride im haveing the
interior redone to factory specs, but might change the color scheme as I dont want white seats. I feel
when you ugrade the interior to a new era, like 80's, 90's .......excetra..... it takes the nostalgia feel
away from the car, thats just my opinion..... plus change the steering wheel back to stock also.....
Posted 2008-09-14 1:31 PM (#144754 - in reply to #144728) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Ok, I admit before a candid world: I would like to sit each of the seats of the Frostbite - just to see how comfortable those things are!
Neil 1163 sounds right to me. I remember we once had a thread about survival rates. It seems we decided the more expensive cars probably had higher survival rates than the plain Jane el Strippos. Even at the ridiculously high 20%, you would only expect 236 of them left. I suspect closer to the 5% to 10% range or 78 to 116 remaining. All just conjecture.
Of the very little known about '58 Dodge production with the Spring Specials et. cetera, the Regals are a known quantity. Which is fun stuff.
Posted 2008-09-16 4:55 PM (#144958 - in reply to #144754) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Pat sent me some pictures of his delightful eggshell and copper Regal along with the following message:
it has been parked in the garage since i got it back from the bodyshop. the relationship did not end well. still need to replace the front seats. easier to send the pics to you than figure out how to post on forward look.
Posted 2008-09-17 9:04 PM (#145075 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Notice that the 58 Regals DID have 1957 hood ornaments installed on it, and with the 57'ers located in the
1958's wider-spaced installation, on the hood.
Nice car; what kind of headliner does it have in it? Certainly not the OEM "Accousta-foam" stuff????
It would be neat to confirm the number of the D-5's, Supr-D's, and the color-combo break-outs
on the Regals.
Posted 2008-09-17 9:30 PM (#145077 - in reply to #145075) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 148
this one has a white textured vinyl in it with vinyl strips over the joints. it is original . i dont know exactly what the acoustifoam stuff is you are talking about. none of the pictures of the other RLs i have showed the headliner. pat
Posted 2008-09-18 10:06 AM (#145128 - in reply to #145112) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 214
I don't think it is a real D500. The emblem looks old but the engine is the 350. Somebody just put the emblem on there probably a long time ago. I've had the car about eight years and the seats were like that when I bought it. I actually like the black. The headliner is also a black vinyl. It is a fun car. Very enjoyable every time I take it out. The chrome is fair, body is good, basically a great driver but not super nice so I don't worry about it when I take it out.
Posted 2008-09-18 1:38 PM (#145139 - in reply to #145128) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
That is awesome, Nick! I have admired that car for a long time. Pat, the acoustafoam liner used to come standard in the Coronets. It is a soft foam application to the regular perforated hard-board headliner. I have also heard that the Regals came with a copper colored hard-board or acoustafoam headliner, but you have an original headliner white hard-board headliner! New things to be learned every day. Here is a picture of the Regal sold at barrett-jackson in January 2008. This was the one featured in Collectible Automobile and owned by a avid MoPar collector who died recently - I can't recall his name as I write this...
Posted 2008-09-18 2:22 PM (#145147 - in reply to #145075) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
d500neil - 2008-09-17 7:04 PM
Notice that the 58 Regals DID have 1957 hood ornaments installed on it, and with the 57'ers located in the
1958's wider-spaced installation, on the hood.
It would be neat to confirm the number of the D-5's, Supr-D's, and the color-combo break-outs
on the Regals.
And they are the '57 CRL hood ornaments with the big fins! If you have some contact with Mr. Davis, it would be really neat to confirm D's, Super-D's, and color-combo's! If you did a regression based on even distribution, you would expect about 75 Regals with the D-500 option (both D-500 and Super D-500). I have never seen a breakout of the '58 D-500's as to what percentage of the D-500's were Superized (as President Bush might say)!
Posted 2008-09-18 8:41 PM (#145198 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Pat, I'm gonna have to call you out, on your headliner being OEM.
The factory installed a bronze-ish open-cell foam finish headliner, that did NOT hold up well, at all.
The Accoustafoam(sp?) headliner was specifically mentioned in the factory literature.
I will go home tonite and send some pics to Cleeve, or someone, to post here, as evidence of that OEM finish detail.
Depending upon the environment (geographical, climatological, physical) the headliners had varying extents of service life
and they tended to look bad, once they got scratched or dirty; no practical way to clean or to repair them.
Posted 2008-09-18 10:03 PM (#145213 - in reply to #145198) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 148
10-4 on the headliner. it must have been replaced a very long time ago. vinyl has held up well. wish i could say the same for the the plastic strips. been thinking of trying to find some chrome ones. now that i know the headliner is not original may go ahead with the project.
Posted 2008-09-18 10:19 PM (#145215 - in reply to #145213) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 214
Nick here. It's hard to tell from the photos of my '58 but the fins on the hood ornaments are slanted as they should be. The photos aren't taken straight on which makes them seem as if they are straight up.
Posted 2008-09-18 10:20 PM (#145216 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Well, fudge; I'm back @ the office with the Press Kit.
Gonna send some pics to Clive, so, when he wakes up, he can send em here; even got the part numbers for the Accousti-Foam
(that's how it's spelled) headliners, if anyone wants to go order it from Your Friendly Dodge Dealer.....
Also, I've included the P/N's for the hood ornaments, and they show a late 1956 (i.e.: 1957 model year application) numbering.
Posted 2008-09-19 1:13 AM (#145234 - in reply to #145216) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
The other little detail about that copper and black car was that it had a flat crest on the grille.
I had thought that the Regals were supposed to come with the Custom Royal (red-and-gold) crest on the grille. Obviously, the bulk of the evidence shows that the black and silver (Royal) is more likely correct. All of this spring trim stuff is difficult to keep straight.
Interestingly, from what I have seen, the black combinations appear to be fewer surviving.
That might be a result of the black cars being more difficult to keep clean. After some time, the owner might say "to heck with it, I won't wash it anymore" and then the decline starts in earnest until the dump claims 'em. Of the ones I know of, four are the eggshell combinations and only one is black.
Posted 2008-09-19 1:27 AM (#145237 - in reply to #145236) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
This car is supposedly a Regal, but I have never seen another picture of it. Interesting, eh? Do you think a Regal was ever equipped with fin caps and the wide eschutcheon? I think it would look awesome!
(black back.jpg)
Attachments ---------------- black back.jpg (44KB - 719 downloads)
Posted 2008-09-19 1:39 AM (#145238 - in reply to #145237) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Two at a show somewhere on the east cost and another shot that may be one of the two. I talked to the fellow who owns the Regal in the foreground. He said it was a small show and he didn't plan it and he didn't know the other owner until they met that day. It just happened by coincidence!
Posted 2008-09-19 3:04 AM (#145242 - in reply to #145216) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+
Location: .Norfolk..Mafia.. ,England UK
d500neil - 2008-09-19 3:20 AM
Well, fudge; I'm back @ the office with the Press Kit.
Gonna send some pics to Clive, so, when he wakes up, he can send em here; even got the part numbers for the Accousti-Foam
(that's how it's spelled) headliners, if anyone wants to go order it from Your Friendly Dodge Dealer.....
Also, I've included the P/N's for the hood ornaments, and they show a late 1956 (i.e.: 1957 model year application) numbering.
Posted 2008-09-19 12:58 PM (#145274 - in reply to #145242) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Nifty! Somewhere I have an original Regal sales poster - but it is nowhere close to the depth of the press information kit! I wonder what they mean by the special mirrors - twin strut? - of course! I had never heard them called out like that.
Oh, and the grille medallion part number is just out of view! Nuts! I could check - I have both types in my garage!
Neil, that is a fantastic document! You should really scan that and make .pdf files and post them on the site (my opinion)!
Posted 2008-09-19 3:26 PM (#145283 - in reply to #145242) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Now I will also have to check the "quarter trim panel finish cap" 1830 794 and 795 - I am nearly certain that is the Spring Trim fin cap! If that is the case, it is interesting that you don't see the wide license plate eschutcheon, which was a 19XX XXX number (perhaps even a 20XX XXX number), if I recall correctly. The caps and the eschutcheon complement one another, but when separated, they cry out for the missing componentry.
Also, if the caps are supposed to be there, only a precious few actually made it out the door with them - as evidenced by photos of the survivors!
Posted 2008-09-19 7:24 PM (#145314 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
..."SAFETY" headliner, huh?
Thanx, Clive.
This is not really the forum for it, but, I can post complete views of the Regal's unique-dedicated
parts listings, if you want to see them.
The Spring Special license plate escutcheons and the triangular end-of-fin caps were not
a part of the Regal's equipment.
BTW, the 1958 small, stainless-steel "License Plate Insert" option-piece (which was included in the "Bumper Group of Accessories") is NOT the same item, as the Spring Special's tremendously-large chromed-potmetal license plate "escutcheon".
Posted 2008-09-19 7:36 PM (#145315 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Something ELSE interesting about the Regals: if you recall that high-line advertisement for the 57 Dodge, featuring the
profile shot of the red/white CRL, with its series of backdrop-detail-illustrations , 'hanging-on-a-wall', behind a guy,
and IF you have the full 2-page spread of that ad: look closely at the illustration for its interior, and you will see
depicted a bolster-treatment precisely like that of the Regal lancer's pseudo-bucket seats, with their elevated bolster-
supports, and recessed upholstery.
The 57's and standard 58's upholstery was produced in a flat bench seating style, but the Regals' "contoured" seats were planned- for PRIOR to the 1957 models!
Posted 2008-09-19 8:04 PM (#145318 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I also bought some photos, on Evilpay, recently, of a disgruntled new-owner of a Regal (4/58) demonstrating his
displeasure about how the hood insulator pad was (not-)glued to the hood underside, and apparently showing
displeasure about a loose spring associated with the OEM lower A/C ducting (at the trannie-hump), and also poking
his finger into a seam on the driver's seat-bottom (can't really see his complaint, there, too well).
The car is white, with bronze trim, and the photos are BxW.
But, you guys wouldn't want to see THOSE photos, huh?
Posted 2008-09-19 10:08 PM (#145333 - in reply to #145317) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 148
yeah, i know. keep hoping he will get tired of sitting on 19 sets or whatever his listing says and have a discount sale. are you sure they will fit a regal or are they for a 59 sport fury --going from front to back instead of side to side??? actually need a set of both. pat
Posted 2008-09-20 1:27 AM (#145352 - in reply to #145333) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I thought MoPar Mel was doing the Belvy stuff, front to back. Maybe he is produding a side to side chrome set??? I went to a local junkyard and pulled a hard metal chrome set from a 1960 DeSoto - works perfect.
Neil - dang straight I am interested!!! Post it dad-gum! Any Regal business is my business (even though I don't own one).. I am going to look up those part #'s right now.
Posted 2008-09-20 1:33 AM (#145353 - in reply to #145352) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
NOPE! I am wrong again! The spring special caps are PN 1950078 and 1950079! I thought I recognized those 18 numbers but the synapses and dendrites failed me again. Nuts.
Posted 2008-09-20 1:39 AM (#145354 - in reply to #145353) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Chrome spears?!? Holy Toledo! You can clearly see 'em on Nick's Regal, but they are not right on the barret-jackson car! Man-o-man! I love learning something brand new. Silver annodized spears must be like hen's teeth. Easy to recreate, but dang tough to find NOS.
It seems as though we have wondered far afield from the Frostbite. What a wonderful trip it has been. Pat, Nick and the boys ought to form their own website and club. Maybe Neil and I can sneak in as wannabe members - well, maybe I can sneak on as a wannabe. Neil knows his stuff.
Posted 2008-09-20 6:46 PM (#145389 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I'm a serious wannabe; been studying them since the mid 80's.
I should go back and check Nick's car, et al, but Aivar's Regal has a coral-coloed grille emblem, IIRC, not a standard black one,
like all the other cars have.
Actually, the Regals are fairly easy to research, since they were a limited production mid-year model, with essentially no
exterior trim options besides ft and/or rear bumper guards, antennae, mirrors, and the 4 color schemes.
That B-J car, and as seen on prior-to-BJ-photos, has one-or-both shield emblems facing backwards, and, of course, it
has the 'gold' spears instead of the chromed ones---actually silver- anodized; not shiny-chrome.
NOPE! All of the cars on this post, except, maybe, one of those two 'show' cars, have grille emblems which are black; now THAT'S something to research: could any/all/some of the grille emblems be coral, or black ???
Unless a car is really wasted, ain't nobody gonna be expected to have to replace a grille emblem on
a car; so, most-all of the Regals 'should' have their OEM grille emblems still be installed on them.
Posted 2008-09-21 2:49 PM (#145442 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Ok; just sent some pics to Clive, to post, here.
First two will show Aivar Lejin's Regal, with its apparently OEM coral-colored grille badge.
That Regal, in the background of the 'Car Show' photo, might also have a coral-colored badge.
Aivar's car also shows its weathered hood pad-insulator.
Aivar's car is coded for having OEM undercoating, which brings us to the four vinatge photos:
Vintage shots are obviously the best measure of original equipment appearance and condition.
Here, we see Mr. new-car-disgruntled-owner demonstrating that there was little, if any apparent mastic applied to glue
the pad to the hood.
That OEM pad looks just like Aivar's hood pad (except for condition and glue-edness...)
This car has a black grille emblem, and an interesting massive-application of sealer around the top of the heater housing.
In the next photo we see that the factory installed the 1957-style air cleaner on an A/C equipped car, for room/space
considerations.
As Aivar's car was/is a single-4 B-block 361 D500, I wonder if it, too received this limited-flow air cleaner, or whether it received
the better-flowing 1957 single-four D500 air cleaner (identical to NY'er and IMP), with its large oval air-element (probably: yes).
In the next two images, Mr. happy-owner is picking a nit about how the lower A/C duct was apparently not-well connected to
the dashboard. That lower duct is really cheesy-looking, however.
Notice ho NICE that the new-bright-shiny trim is, and, the brand-new brake pedal, and the exposed wiring hanging down,
below the dash panel.
Then, we see him gesturing at some defect(?) in the driver's seat bottom upholstery.
He really shouldn't have worried about that seam defect; the cloth would shred, soon enough.
Also seen is the appearance of the OEM power seat housing, but, more importantly, the vinyl skirt
that was secured (somehow) to the seat bottom. In 1957, that skirt was stapled to the bottom of the large plastic
power seat housing assembly.
Posted 2008-09-22 11:30 AM (#145575 - in reply to #145442) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Great photos, Neil. The floor board well necessary for the power seat option is very interesting too in that it is so deep. The Richards family just sent me a few photos of the Kansas - Denver Regal, which completes photos of the various color schemes. Despite it's poor condition, it appears mostly complete and somewhat unmolested. Although I have never seen the car, I have been told that there is very little rust to be found.
The first shot shows the back end: it is missing the D-500 emblem. An engine photo (not included) shows that this car has the Super D-500 manifold, carbs, and linkage. The air cleaners are missing. Unfortunately, the original exhaust tips appear to be missing as well.
The second photo shows the original rear seat and a grille. If this is the original grille for the car, it came equipped with the Coronet grille emblem - that seems unlikely that a Regal would recieve a Coronet grille emblem, but you just never know.
The third photo is a good shot of original Accousti-Foam and original bow covers.
The fourth photo is a good shot of the original door panel and copper-and-black brocade cloth.
Posted 2008-09-22 5:06 PM (#145627 - in reply to #145580) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Hi, Clive:
That is Jess Ruffalo's car that was auctioned at Barrett-Jackson for $70,000 earlier this year. I even went for a ride in the back seat on the way up to the auction stage. Who owns this nifty Regal?
In the vintage photos, it looks like the car either has a rear speaker or a rear defogger! If you look at the headliner shot of Regal 3, you see the sun visors which are just like the CRL visors, but copper instead of ivory. That's what I expect in the Regals. The Accousti-Foam visors were in the base level Coronet interiors and it seems to me they wouldn't fit the fancy factor in the Regals.
Posted 2008-09-22 9:33 PM (#145683 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I take 'that' back: I'll bet that BLACK, with bronze-accent is the rarest color combo!!!
You can see, on this B-J car, that the restorer didn't know HOW to position the shield-emblems; there is/are dedicated
lt/rt side versions of it, and this car has both of them facing backwards.
Mike, your friend's Regal has a very unusual grille emblem; it resembles a Coro/Roy Spring Special emblem, and not that
"Full-Heraldry" emblem, which, altho appearing on certain 1957 Dodges, WAS adopted as the 'official' 1958 Dodge emblem.
That car's trunk IS drilled for a D500 emblem.
Yeah, that Accousti-Foam stuff was some-fun, when it started to go bad!
Posted 2008-09-22 11:36 PM (#145693 - in reply to #145683) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I would love to see a fully-restored black with bronze accent Regal. Somehow, I just don't think it would be as striking as the reverse - but you never know. A shiny black car is tough to beat - and tough to keep clean! My impression of those Spring Special grille emblems is that they have separate emblems for each model; Coronet, as shown in the back seat of the Kansas - Denver Regal; Royal, with black paint and chrome helmet; and Custom Royal, with red paint and gold helmet. A Regal was, I think, a special edition of the Custom Royal and should have had the Custom Royal emblem like Aivar's.
In practice, perhaps the different plants had varying supplies of each grille emblem and they may have used what they had at the time. With today's surviving representatives, you can't tell model by grille emblem and you can't tell grille emblem by model. That may have been the way it was in 1959 too.
Posted 2008-09-23 3:51 AM (#145708 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Oh, ok, that IS a spare (S.-S.) grille, sitting in the back of that car?
If the Richards family doesn't already have a copy of their "Super D500" IBM card, if someone can PM me with the car's VIN, I can forward the VIN to Darrell Davis, and he CAN confirm the car's D500 status, the next time that he goes to Detroit, to research the IBM records, at the H.S. .
A lot of the Regals seem to have a black grille emblem, rather than the Coral one.
Doesn't the Regal, in the distance of that 'show' photo, seem to have a 'colored' emblem, too? It's a long way away from the camera, but I think that I can see a slight reddish tint on iit.
Posted 2008-09-23 4:13 AM (#145709 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 468 Location: Cushing, Wisconsin
Not Mine. Here is a picture of a Regal Lancer from way up here in Northern Wisconsin. I believe the guy said it has 30,000 original miles but he needs a/c because his went out or something. I told him about this site. I don't think he has made it here yet.
Posted 2008-09-23 3:18 PM (#145743 - in reply to #145708) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Justin, I think it is neat that you even saw one of these at a local show and posted the picture in your region page! I still think they are a rare treat.
Neil - I guess that is a spare Spring Special grille on the back seat, but I don't know. To me, it does not seem beyond the realm of possibility that it could be the original grille for that Regal. The Richards family was negotiating to buy the car from someone, but the deal fell through. If I can ever get in contact with the owner, I will try to get the VIN.
Yes! That Regal in the far away background does look like it has the red emblem. That is one of the reasons I suspect it is the same Regal as the one in the photo below it (which also has the red emblem). Note the black wheel rims on both cars and the narrow white wall tires. The one in the lower picture has really odd spinner hubcaps. They look like they might be the chrome remanufactured jobs rather than the stainless stockers.
Posted 2008-09-23 5:10 PM (#145757 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Those do appear to be photos of the same car; note the general similarities, but also; the passenger's side windshield wiper is positioned considerably higher than the driver's side wiper, in both pics.
Mike, you wouldn't happen be able to score a pic of that 'Richards family' car's engine compartment?
A lot of times, there are tell-tales as to a Super D500 'conversion', based upon peculiar fuel lines and/or fuel filter appearances and applications; E.G: the stainless steel fuel line should not be-all-nicely formed and cut, there should not be any intermediate rubber fuel-line connections, there are incorrect ways to plumb into the two carbs, and of course, there have to be correct date-coded carburetors installed.
Given that it was a top-of-the-line model it should not be particularly surprising, but it appears that quite
a few Regals were OEM A/C equipped.
Posted 2008-09-23 9:47 PM (#145798 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Just got PM'ed by a friend (yeah, I got some of them!) who informs me that he had previously sent me the P/T
plate image, on the "Richards" car (it IS a small MoPar world), and that I found that it was a single-4 D500.
But, HEY; that means that several D500 Regals have survived!
Posted 2008-09-23 10:55 PM (#145808 - in reply to #145798) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
And speaking of Regal Lancers, (very interesting thread by the way, I've enjoyed it-these cars are fascinating) I know this has probably been asked many many times but is that bronze color available? Is there a code for it that is usable? I'd love to paint my '58 CRL in those colors.
Posted 2008-09-24 4:07 PM (#145866 - in reply to #145808) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
it is funny how my mind plays tricks on me! I could have sworn that the picture showed the carbs...but
Here is the note from Ivy Richards:
"Here is the only picture of the engine bay for the Regal that we have. It's a little dark and
Tony tells me the intake manifold was just resting on the engine and didn't belong to the
car. So, I don't know if the picture will be of any help, but here it is."
power steering / power brakes / windshield washer?
Posted 2008-09-24 4:14 PM (#145869 - in reply to #145866) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Oh, Jeff:
I think I can get that paint code. I have a paint chip chart from DuPont or Ditzler or Duco...it is paint code S for the 1958 Dodge. "Metallic Copper"??? I think I have it anyway. It doesn't appear with the spring special paint chips!
Well, there I go again - making up stuff I have never seen! My Duco sheets don't show it and my Acme sheets don't show it.
Posted 2008-09-24 11:16 PM (#145933 - in reply to #145869) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
That Kansas - Colorado Regal made it all the way out to Massachusetts (new home)! The owner does have a D-500 emblem for it and the exhaust tips, so that helps. I heard the block was cracked, so the new owner is looking for a low mileage 361 - either Dodge, DeSoto, or Chrysler. Hopefully, he might find it on the forums!
Posted 2008-09-25 5:36 AM (#145954 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Member
Posts: 11
Hey, I have a good 1958 361 engine, it was pulled from a running 58 Desoto. If anyone knows the owner of the car, please forward him my info. or have him PM me here
Posted 2008-09-25 2:21 PM (#145987 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Christopher, what is your car's stamping-number (on the flat-area, by the distributor), and, if your engine
is not installed, you should be able to check out its casting-date, at the upper rear of the block, behind the
intake manifold .
Posted 2008-10-13 4:42 PM (#147981 - in reply to #146360) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
No, Danny - Neil has a gorgeous '57 Custom Royal Lancer D500. Oh, and the Frostbite is on craigslist in the Detroit area. I do wonder what it would take to "restore" it back to an original interior and original paint colors.
I once saw a tribute car, I think it was a Coronet Lancer that was painted black and bronze in a traditional saddle without the color spears on the side. It had a neat Regal-looking copy interior. I wonder if a person could do that to the Frostbite without paying an arm and a leg? I'll see if I can post some pictures.
Posted 2008-10-13 8:52 PM (#148020 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
The hardest part of restoring "Frostbite" would be doing the interior, completely right.
SMS makes and sells (believe it or don't) the correct bronze upholstery cloth, and vinyls.
Re-popping the door trim panels would be tough, but not impossible, as SMS (eventually-lolol) can
re-make the heat embossments in the vinyl.
Fortunately, Frostbite's steering wheel looks to be in great condition.
Step-1, besides seeing what rational price could be had for the car is: confirming its OEM paint scheme, and finding
out how excited you might be, in replicating that color scheme.--Gold, with the white trim would be my personal
least-favorite, followed closely by gold, with black trim. Then: it's a toss-up between white, with gold, and black, with
gold--depends where you may live: out in the desert SoWest: white w/gold; back-anywhere-back-east: black, with gold
trim.
Black IS the nastiest/meanest/richest 'color', but, it's the hardest to maintain, and not fun, in 85+ degree cloudless weather.
Posted 2008-10-14 2:02 AM (#148045 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
SMS made-up my car's door panel sheet vinyl, with the Mylar ovoids, in seemingly record time: several months.
My local upholstery shop, then, mated the SMS vinyl to the car's existing OEM door insert-material, and then attached it to aftermarket heavy 'cardboard' backing board.
Guess that I was just lucky; we really need someone in the Portland area to start a side business where he could deal directly WITH SMS, and approve of and accept whatever material that they might produce.
It has been asserted that SMS advises that too much of their product needs to be purchased, and that the material that they DO provide is either (slightly) incorrect-style/appearance, or of sub-standard or defective quality.
My experiences with SMS have been positive; others' experiences may vary......and that's really unfort- unate, for all of us.
Posted 2008-10-16 12:41 AM (#148410 - in reply to #148045) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Here are the pictures of that tribute car. It was a Custom Royal (maybe), not a Coronet. This is the type of interior I was thinking of for the Frostbite. Granted, it is not picture perfect - but probably not as expensive as something from SMS or (gasp!) new old stock. I bet any local upholstery shop could duplicate it with some success. Repaint the exterior of the Frostbite and you have a decent driver Regal that would be miles ahead of this tribute car.
Posted 2008-10-16 1:16 AM (#148414 - in reply to #148410) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: Parts Unknown
That looks like GOLD and black rather than the COPPER and black of the Regals. The Copper color had a lot more red tone in it. I once owned a 58 Coronet 2HT painted in that color combo, but reversed. It was original paint and hardly something that could be construed a "tribute" car. One of the few I truly regret not hanging on to.
Posted 2008-10-16 3:59 PM (#148480 - in reply to #148414) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
That is an odd one - it is not quite gold and a far cry from bronze / copper. In 1958, Dodge did produce a paint called "sand metallic" and this might be it. As someone pointed out, finding a paint chip for the bronze / copper color is not easy. I called this a tribute because the interior obviously wants to be Regal, but the exterior just isn't. Nothing wrong with that. In fact, I posted these pictures as a possible inspiration for the Frostbite. It all may be moot - I looked on craig's list and I don't see the Frostbite anymore
Posted 2008-10-16 8:24 PM (#148504 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Mike, if someone is making a tribute/clone/hot-rod/etc car, then there are no limits as to originality or correctness.
Frostbite is/was a real Regal Lancer.
Some chrome-shop (IIRC) has/had a great credo: "The quality is remembered long after the price is forgotten."
SMS's materials costs won't be extravagant, as relatively very LITTLE upholstery cloth will be required---I don't think that
there is any upholstery, even, on the seat backs.
As the cloth is sold in 6'-wide swaths, only about 1-2 yards would be required for the entire car.
I don't know if SMS would try to hit you for a "Regal Tax", on the cloth and vinyl.
Your own upholstery shop will stitch it up, at their usual labor rate (same as for that 'tribute' car's work).
The largest cost would be the formation of the heat-embossed trim; again, your shop will assemble the 'loose'
material, and install the headliner (using the bronze vinyl).
It MIGHT be a waste of your time/money, but as I know that SMS has previously produced the Regal Lancer cloth and
vinyl, in your position, I would recommend that you get on a 'cheap' airline and personally visit SMS and attempt to buy the
material over the counter.
You might also have (by then) some actual measurements/data on the heat-embossed trim vinyl, so that you could personally
arrange and order that work to be done, and get an eyeball-to-eyeball deal on when the vinyl would be produced.
You also could know precisely how much vinyl and trim that you need to buy, so that SMS doesn't over-sell you on the
material.
This is how I think that I would deal with SMS on a new-large order, for material that they should have on-hand (you could
confirm their supply-availability, before getting on the airline; let em know that you're coming, for it).
HELL, you can call them right-now/tomorrow and confirm the availability and cost OF the Regal Lancer
cloth-and-vinyl!!!
Posted 2008-10-16 10:48 PM (#148523 - in reply to #148504) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 148
i got prices and samples for vinyl and cloth a couple of years ago from SMS. as i remember one was about $80 a yard , the other was $50. forget which was which. need 2-3 yards of each. the samples were right on. it really shouldnt be necessary to take any special steps to obtain the cloth and vinyl. door panels i really cant express an opinion. i didnt buy any b/c i have several yards of cloth and a new half of the front seat. any good upholsterer should be able to do the job if he has a pattern to go by. i was hoping to drive my regal to the shop but just never got it running and i didnt want to remove the seats again if i didnt have to.
Posted 2008-10-17 5:03 PM (#148606 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Pat, I FULLY agree that it SHOULDN'T be necessary to visit SMS in person, and, I personally have only had favorable
results in dealing with them, but, several/a-lot of others have experienced delays, mis-statements, incorrect materials
and/or over-selling from SMS on upholstery and vinyl.
When someone needs something, he NEEDS it, hopefully, as soon as possible, and in the correct style/color/quality/quantity.
As SMS apparently has a front desk, if I needed something relatively quickly, and was concerned about the above 4-criteria,
and if I had the time/money, I would personally visit SMS, eyeball their products, and try to buy their stuff over the counter.
And, if I had to order the material, I would really want to look at it in person, to correct any possible
discrepancies in the order, before I paid them for it.
Posted 2008-10-18 11:38 PM (#148717 - in reply to #148410) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 7207 Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada
Lancer Mike - 2008-10-15 9:41 PM Here are the pictures of that tribute car. It was a Custom Royal (maybe), not a Coronet. This is the type of interior I was thinking of for the Frostbite. Granted, it is not picture perfect - but probably not as expensive as something from SMS or (gasp!) new old stock. I bet any local upholstery shop could duplicate it with some success. Repaint the exterior of the Frostbite and you have a decent driver Regal that would be miles ahead of this tribute car.
How about a Tribute Model to a Tribute Car, I saw this on Ebay.
Posted 2008-10-19 12:21 AM (#148719 - in reply to #148717) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Wow! That is fantastic!!! I wonder how they made that model? I didn't know AMT or any of the others were making a '58 Dodge. I have to find one of those beauties. That is a stunning model: look how the paint shines. Look how the chrome shines. It looks a little like the JoHan promotional cars, but they usually don't have an interior and they usually do have side windows. I have to get on eBay and check this out!
Posted 2008-10-19 8:29 PM (#148777 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 7207 Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada
This may be one of those new Resin jobs from Modelhaus, but they are pricey even to buy - around $100.00 a kit. Or it could be an old Jo-Han Kit. I bought some Jo-Han re-issues back in the eighties, entitled " USA Oldies" which included a 60 DeSoto and 62 Chrysler 300 2 door Hardtops that came complete with interiors and engines. This is the first 58 Dodge I've seen, so it's probably a Modelhaus, I can't remember what it said on the auction, it was a coupe of weeks ago. The Modelhaus kits don't come with opening hoods or engines. <br />
Posted 2008-10-19 10:59 PM (#148789 - in reply to #148777) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Ian, I searched in vain on eBay. Do you remember for how much money it sold? I will do some searches on modelhaus. It seems to me that the JoHan cars did not have interiors, otherwise this looks like the JoHan promotional model with the very large "Custom Royal" script. However, the finish work on this model is astounding!
Posted 2008-10-20 1:00 PM (#148857 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 7207 Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada
I didn't keep the link to the auction, and don't know if it sold or if so, how much it sold for etc. JoHan made both promos, without interiors, and complete kits with opening hoods, engines and interiors. I have a couple of them, the 60 DeSoto kit and 62 Chrysler 300 kit. These kits are often on Ebay. THey were re-issued in the early 80s. I'll post a pic of my DeSoto later.
Posted 2008-10-20 5:30 PM (#148899 - in reply to #148857) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Hi, Ian:
You did a thread on models a while back, correct? I remember that was a really neat thread. I posted pictures of my '58 Plymouth model that I made to look like the Plymouth I used to own.
Posted 2008-10-20 8:19 PM (#148918 - in reply to #148899) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 7207 Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada
Lancer Mike - 2008-10-20 2:30 PM Hi, Ian: You did a thread on models a while back, correct? I remember that was a really neat thread. I posted pictures of my '58 Plymouth model that I made to look like the Plymouth I used to own.
I found my old thread on the models, and it has a couple of the JoHan models with interiors, the 60 DeSoto and the 62 300.
Posted 2008-10-21 2:25 PM (#149009 - in reply to #148918) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Neil, I don't think whoever built this particular model was trying to build a Regal. It does appear that they were trying to build a car exactly like the "tribute" car shown below the model pictures. Yes, the red or coral shields are peculiar - otherwise it seems to be a match.
Posted 2008-11-09 8:27 AM (#151240 - in reply to #149009) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
In yesterday's Hemming's -
"Dodge 1958 Custom Royal Regal Lancer, super rare, 1 year only, production 1,163, less than 12 known to exist, bronze over white body, original b/b 350 w/push-button Torqueflite transmission, beautiful interior reproduced to original, older amateur restoration that shows well, runs/drives very well, asking $65,000 508-317-7092, MA."
That could be one of the two bronze and white Regals in the show photo - because I think that was around the Massachusetts area. Very interesting that this Regal owner says that there are less than 12 known to exist - I would estimate a bit higher based on this thread, but that's probably right in the ball park. I remember that Barrett Jackson Regal auctioned for $70,000 a year ago - it was an excellent restoration.
I thought this was an interesting advertisement for it's discussion about value and survival rates.
Posted 2008-11-09 9:13 PM (#151313 - in reply to #151271) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I was trying to count the number we have talked about just in this thread:
the Frostbite - customized
MoPar Aivar's - eggshell and copper - Super D500
Pat Grant's - eggshell and copper
Nick Nichol's - copper and eggshell - D500 badge
East Coast Car 1 - eggshell and copper
East Coast Car 2 - eggshell and copper
Richard's - black and copper - D500
Jess Ruffalo's - copper and black (was eggshell and copper)
Balsam Lake Car - eggshell and copper
That is nine - Neil I bet you are right - there must be at least twice that number. 25 is a good Scientific Wild @ss Guess! Like the advertisement says, these are rare birds. I think that the advertised car is one of the East Coast cars. I have heard that a famous Canadian restorer owns one, but I am not sure if he still has it or has sold it to someone mentioned above...so I can't get us into double digits.
The think that is most surprising to me is that most of these Regals are eggshell and copper. Before this thread, the most photographed one I ever saw was Jess Ruffalo's and I thought most were copper and black!!! Of course, after seeing it in person - I now know that it too started out as eggshell and copper. It makes me really appreciate seeing all the others out there. I bet Pat Grant knows of more.
Posted 2008-11-10 6:10 PM (#151415 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Yeah, Greg Leggatt owns at least one Regal; that puts us at 10 cars.
Funny thing : I know of at least 6 D501's (including two convertibles) that still exist; that number represents about 6% of
the total production (there apparently were at least two prototypes, which may or may not be part of the official 102 501's
produced).
Six percent of 1163 Regals built happens to be about 70 cars still remaining. You have to believe that a higher
percentage of high-end Regals would have survived, than did the real throw-away (all were:) manual-steering-and-transmissioned
Coronet 501 sedans and ( about 25, too) convertibles .
Posted 2008-11-10 6:27 PM (#151423 - in reply to #151415) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I wondered if the Balsam Lake car might be Leggatt's. I don't know. That is interesting, Neil - you would think that more of these cars survived. Maybe the high-end trim option on a Dodge worked against it. Unlike a very low production Chrysler 300, these were less well-known, a bit gaudier, and did not necessarily have the hot rod engine.
I remember one of Leggatt's cars was recently for sale and they had a similar claim in the advertisement. It was a Canadian Custom Royal spring special and was advertised as one of 12 made, blah, blah, blah... Suspiciously alike, now that I think about it. Could this be Leggatt's?
Posted 2008-11-10 7:52 PM (#151456 - in reply to #151313) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
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Posts: 148
there is a fellow in connecticut by the name of joe macaluso that has a eggshell and copper car that may be one of your east coast cars. i didnt want to have to go back thru all 100 posts to see if i had mentioned him . the last time i had contact with him he was working on it after 23 years. it was pretty badly rusted. greg leggatt does reproduction wiring harnesses and he brought his regal to a 300 meet in maine a few years back. by the pictures it is a truly beautiful car. wayne graefen who lives in texas and is a walking encylcopedia on old mopars probably knows where everyone still in existence is. i will have to ask him . pat
Posted 2008-11-10 10:17 PM (#151476 - in reply to #151456) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2932 Location: Lemoore CA
grant4405 - 2008-11-10 7:52 PM
there is a fellow in connecticut by the name of joe macaluso that has a eggshell and copper car that may be one of your east coast cars. i didnt want to have to go back thru all 100 posts to see if i had mentioned him . the last time i had contact with him he was working on it after 23 years. it was pretty badly rusted. greg leggatt does reproduction wiring harnesses and he brought his regal to a 300 meet in maine a few years back. by the pictures it is a truly beautiful car. wayne graefen who lives in texas and is a walking encylcopedia on old mopars probably knows where everyone still in existence is. i will have to ask him . pat
I think he posts here from time to time with the user name joemac.
Posted 2008-11-11 12:01 AM (#151480 - in reply to #151476) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I think Joe might be the one whose friend purchased the black and copper car. Out of all the foward look cars there are lots of very interesting little subsets: D501's, Pace Setters, Blue Herons, Dash Ones, Green Falcons, Spring Specials, Letter Cars, Silver Specials, Ghia Limousines, etc. The Regal subset is particulary interesting to me. Every time I see one, I think it is such a treat.
There is not much to them: a different color, a little different paint scheme, slightly different trim and badges, and a different interior - a very casual observer might say they are about the same as any other '58 Dodge. But they are so very appealing when you look at them! My impression is that awareness of them was or perhaps still is pretty low on the radar. I don't think the owner of the Frostbite even advertised his as a Regal!
I think Joe might be the one whose friend purchased the black and copper car. Out of all the foward look cars there are lots of very interesting little subsets: D501's, Pace Setters, Blue Herons, Dash Ones, Green Falcons, Spring Specials, Letter Cars, Silver Specials, Ghia Limousines, etc. The Regal subset is particulary interesting to me. Every time I see one, I think it is such a treat.
There is not much to them: a different color, a little different paint scheme, slightly different trim and badges, and a different interior - a very casual observer might say they are about the same as any other '58 Dodge. But they are so very appealing when you look at them! My impression is that awareness of them was or perhaps still is pretty low on the radar. I don't think the owner of the Frostbite even advertised his as a Regal!
Same thing with my namesake here: The 1955 DeSoto Fireflite Coronado.
Strictly a 4 door sedan affair that year whose trim is identical to any "run-of-the-mill" Fireflite, but was the only DeSoto available with a factory tri-tone paint job of turquoise/black/white in whatever desired combination (most common I've seen is the one John's been saving for me, more or less - turquoise body/white sweep/black roof - but I've seen 'em with white body/turquoise sweep/black roof and one person over at Duricy's "DeSotoland" has one with black body/white sweep/turquoise roof).
Other Coronado-specific accoutrements include standard power steering, standard power brakes, standard 4-way power seat and turquoise cloth/white leather upholstery. Here's a few exterior/interior pics of the Coronado at John's yard - oh, and it's 1 of 487 built :
Posted 2008-11-11 2:54 PM (#151527 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Mark, your car, when restored (by you) will be stunning.
Mike, I gotta disagree with you, about the Regals "having not much to them".
Except for the sheetmetal, almost all of the interior and exterior finishings were unique to that car model.
From the steering wheel, to the interior and headliner, to the exterior stainless and trim, to the paint work: they're all
unique to that car.
It's amazing that any parts-cars ever survived---Greg found at least one of them; I've got a photo of it, in my archives.
Maybe I'll go find it, today.
Posted 2008-11-11 5:10 PM (#151545 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Ok; found my Regal collection, and sent Clive some pics to post of unrestored Regals (do these count against the "12"???)
There will be two shots of the black-over-bronze, that Greg Leggatt either restored, or used as his parts car---I THINK that this is the
car that he restored; he wrote once to say that he'd found a 'stripper' Regal---that may have been his parts-donor.
There will be 2 shots of a white-over-bronze, a bronze-over white (this one is accounted-for, here, I believe, an all-bronze
#4 car, and a white-over-bronze which has had its fins be painted black.
Finally, I sent a pic of a phot that Greg had sent years ago, showing how his car's Lance emblems were silver, not gold.
Posted 2008-11-11 5:12 PM (#151546 - in reply to #151545) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+
Location: .Norfolk..Mafia.. ,England UK
d500neil - 2008-11-11 10:10 PM
Ok; found my Regal collection, and sent Clive some pics to post of unrestored Regals (do these count against the "12"???)
There will be two shots of the car that Greg Leggatt either restored, or used as his parts car---I THINK that this is the
car that he restored; he wrote once to say that he'd found a 'stripper' Regal---that may have been his parts-donor.
There will be 2 shots of a white-over-bronze, a bronze-over white (this one is accounted-for, here, I believe, an all-bronze
#4 car, and a white-over-bronze which has had its fins be painted black.
Finally, I sent a pic of a phot that Greg had sent years ago, showing how his car's Lance emblems were silver, not gold.
Posted 2008-11-11 5:45 PM (#151552 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Hmmm...I now think that that second black-over-bronze may have been Greg's stripper-parts-car, as it has no rear antennae,
like the 'first' car has, and it might have a white wall tire still on it; the 'first' car has a blackwall, on the rt/rr side.
Posted 2008-11-11 7:34 PM (#151570 - in reply to #151552) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Wow! Another treasure trove Neil! Yes, I would certainly count these among existing cars (at least at the time the photos were taken)! Something you said about the steering wheel: yes, it was a unique bronze color with the ivory two-tone treatment, but otherwise exactly like every other '58 Dodge two-tone steering wheel, right?
Posted 2008-11-11 8:27 PM (#151581 - in reply to #151546) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 148
your picture #32 is my car sitting in a driveway in kansas city . i picked it up near there in 2003, i believe. it looks a little better now-same color scheme and same tires. do you mind if i ask where you got your pictures? some of these cars have lead fascinating lives-more so than a lot of people.
Posted 2008-11-11 8:54 PM (#151588 - in reply to #151581) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Pat, my photos go back to the 1980's, from various sources.
At least, I did not take this photo. You don't recognize the background in that photo, huh?
BTW, the car which I believe to be Greg Leggatt's car (#28, above) appears to have a coral-colored grille emblem.
Pat, I have at least four more photos of your car (other side/rear-view; two interior, and a right/front) ; please PM me your
address & I'll send you their images. You can decide if you want to post them on this site, or not; nothing wrong with the photos;
the photo paper looks to be identical, so I'm pretty sure that these views are of your car.
Mark, your car, when restored (by you) will be stunning.
Thanks, Neil. I'm as devout a hardtop guy as there is, but when John first posted pictures of this baby back last November (1 of the 5 DeSotos he rescued at that time), I was absolutely spellbound (and still am) - and not by something so definable as its rareness. She just oozes class, IMO.
The question now is when?
Unfortunately, the way things are here at present, it's utterly out of the question - my job hours have been scaled back such since July that I doubt I'll make my own d@mn car insurance payment this February without a lend.....
Posted 2008-11-12 2:42 PM (#151659 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Olde Car restoration is not exactly a mandatory-priority, at any time, unless you do that work to try to turn a profit
on it.
The temperature, this week, in the Eastern Sierra region is in the historically-high record range (like, 80 degrees, today)
and that's NOT good for the local tourist industry (skiing, right now).
Fortunately, for those of us in the insurance-claims profession, when economic times get tough, people tend to MAKE claims,
where they might not, otherwise, so we are somewhat insulated (unless insurance companies go bankrupt, and we don't
get paid---I got NOTHING to do with AIG, btw) ...from serious downturns in the economy.
The definition of having monetary wealth is to have it during economic recessions/depressions, NOT (just) when the economy is rising and 'everybody' is spending it as fast as they can earn it.
What 'good' does cheap gas 'do', if no one can afford to go out and drive their cars?
Posted 2008-11-12 3:46 PM (#151670 - in reply to #151659) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 907 Location: Magra, Sweden
There is at leat one Regal Lancer in Sweden, a beautiful unrestored bronze over eggshell. Enjoy the pics I took at the Nasco Yankees meeting in Falköping Sweden last summer. I run across the car this spring and still in the same condition even though the owner spoke about restoring last summer.
Posted 2008-11-12 6:12 PM (#151687 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2932 Location: Lemoore CA
I really have enjoyed this thread, and especially all of the pictures. I have a question, is a "base" regal lancer overall a nicer car than a base custom royal? They almost look nicer picture after picture.
Posted 2008-11-12 6:47 PM (#151694 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
James, the Regal Lancers were a mid-year top-of-the-line submodel which was created to compete with the upscale
Poncho Bonnevilles, and maybe, the Buick Limiteds (altho they were available in convertibles.)
There really was no reason not to make a Regal convertible, beyond the quarter panel and rear seat upholstery-size
differences--everything else would have been the same (except for the LACK of the Accousti-Foam headliners--lolol).
A Regal Lancer would be considerably more desirable, and valuable, than a similar-model Custom Royal.
I know, from having sat in a front seat, that the RL's form-fitted suedo-bucket-style seats are more comfortable than the other models' standard-shaped bench seats.
The mostly-white one would be the easiest to maintain, but, IMHO, the most impressive color style might be the mostly black one, with the bronze accents.
Posted 2008-11-12 11:14 PM (#151724 - in reply to #151694) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
That is an interesting Regal, Thord! One thing I noticed is that it does not have the shield and lance on the glove-box door, which was a standard feature of the Custom Royal line and I would assume so on the Regal as well. Also interesting are the gold-painted valve covers. I had heard that some valve covers were painted either bronze or gold, but I had not seen very many. It seems most were painted argent silver as was the block.
I personally think that the Regals are perhaps the most desireable '58 Dodges. It is difficult to compare them that way though. You might see a very appealing Texan club sedan with rare options like a Super D-500 and power windows and seats. Convertibles have great appeal too. It probably comes down to a comparison of each individual car. By and large, though, the Regals have a leg up on the competition.
Posted 2008-12-09 2:29 PM (#154864 - in reply to #152039) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
This was an interesting video on youtube. If you have a spare 6+ minutes, it is a fun ride. Do not attempt to view with a dial up connection unless you have time to spare!
Posted 2008-12-09 11:03 PM (#154945 - in reply to #154887) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I haven't seen Gary post in awhile. I hope everything is alright. Those look like the Spring Special fin caps on Aivar's Regal - I think that is a very good look on the Regals!
Posted 2008-12-10 9:22 PM (#155043 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
That's Aivar's car, all right. It has virtually every OEM option on it except for the Super D500, and "Bumper Group"
option package (that would include the rear bumper guards).
Funny, but I never noticed its Spring Special fin trim, before. It's probably OEM to the car, but only the IBM card-copy
would confirm its being original to the car.
Posted 2008-12-10 9:40 PM (#155046 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2932 Location: Lemoore CA
I think my tastes are shifting. At one time, I hated 57 Dodges because of their big funny parking lights and plain grill/bumper, and my feelings toward 58's were lukewarm at best. Now I think 58's in general are becoming my favorite year Dodge. Kind of like the 57's now too, as long as they have custom royal teeth in the bumper to offset the plainness.
Posted 2008-12-11 9:37 AM (#155079 - in reply to #154945) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2244 Location: Yorba Linda, Ca
I'm Great, thanks everybody. Nice job of posting the video up on this post. I did post a video, a shorter one, where you will be riding "Shotgun" and Aivar puts the pedal to the metal and kicks in all * barrels---just the thing to warm you guys up on a long winter's day. Maybe you can post that one here, Mike?
You can also go cruising in Aivar's 58 New Yorker Convertible "The Emerald Queen"
Glad you guys are enjoying the Videos. And Yep that is my 59 with the "Popout" DVD player that you hear, playing in the background!!
Posted 2008-12-11 2:43 PM (#155103 - in reply to #155101) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I like that Dave has enabled us to post links to YouTube here. You can watch the video and then have some discussion about what is shown. It is pretty amazing, really. So, Aivar's car is a Super D-500 and you show a great shot of the rear defogger option later in the video. The sound of the turn signal blinker is oh so familiar! What a fun ride!
Posted 2008-12-19 6:27 PM (#156127 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Frostbite is BACK......
Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+
Location: .Norfolk..Mafia.. ,England UK
Lancer Mike - 2008-09-09 11:57 PM
You read right, a REGAL LANCER. This is not my car. If you are interested, contact Jim at miz7@comcast.net . I think he is asking $29,500 and I believe it is in the Detroit area on Craigslist. I don't think Jim is a member.
If you are a purist, don't look. I like the naked babe pinstriping motif.
OK,, Lets take this thread back 6 pages to the Original Posting........
Posted 2008-12-23 6:29 PM (#156533 - in reply to #156142) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
This is a pretty difficult sale. I imagine a lot of time and effort went in to the customization of the car. I am sure the seller looks at all this time and effort as value added to the car. Any potential buyer will have to overcome that and then face significant expenses to get the car back to normal again. It should be a big gap to bridge.
Posted 2008-12-26 4:52 PM (#156813 - in reply to #156533) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Bidding ended at just over $12,000 with the reserve not met. That is probably within the range I would offer if I wanted to own the car. $10,000 - $15,000? I would be very heisitant to go north of $15,000 on the Frostbite - just because I feel I would have to replace the interior and wheels/tires to enjoy driving it.
Posted 2008-12-27 8:49 PM (#156991 - in reply to #156818) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 210 Location: San Diego, CA
This car, in the $15k range would sure be tempting. I mean, how many can there be?? I have my doubts on a Michigan car with no rust. Of course, it may have spent most of its life in Phoenix so who knows. Anyway, I hope it goes to a good home. Heaven knows, it has been used and abused something fierce!
Posted 2008-12-28 1:12 PM (#157046 - in reply to #156991) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
A quick word in defense of the current owner, Jim - who I don't know from Adam - I am going to submit that this car is not abused. Looking at the pictures, it appears to be very well maintained, cared for, and quite operable. Of course, I would much rather see this type of customization done to a garden variety V-8 Coronet, but I don't believe this car has been abused. I am far more guilty of "cruelty to Dodge" than whomever created the Frostbite. I have taken cars apart (with the best of intentions) and let them languish, which is much more abusive than keeping a Dodge on the road. Of the twenty or so Regals we have seen on this thread, a few have been left out in the elements to suffer the full ravages of time - which, in my opinion, is a bit worse than customizing a rarity. Ok, that said, I stand ready to have my knuckles rapped!
Posted 2008-12-28 1:36 PM (#157047 - in reply to #157046) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 210 Location: San Diego, CA
Lol! Point taken. Still, some shots of the floorpan would be nice. But yes, there appears to be nothing that was done that some paint will not fix and that is a good thing.
Posted 2009-01-01 9:33 PM (#157522 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
I can't believe a thread has been going on for 3 months on Regal Lancers and I didn't know about it! I guess I've been spending too much time working on the car to read this forum. I have a lot of information that I can add to the data base on Regal Lancers. I'll post on different topics so this doesn't get too long. Below are some pictures of the original interior that I recently removed. These seats used the bolster type asembly which I'm told is similar to Adventurer seats. My interior set is being used by Gary Goers as a pattern to do a run of interior sets for a number of owners. Although my interior was worn it was intact and was in dry inside storage for the past 28 years. If you read this and need an interior please contact Gary as these are in production as I write this. The materials are being sourced from SMS and others to get the best possible match. You'll note that the piping is copper not black. On the back of the fabric is a date of 12/17/57 and a signature by "Tony". I think he was proud of his work. These are very complex interiors to create.
Posted 2009-01-03 3:44 PM (#157687 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
With the correct/proper material (from SMS) ANY local-competent auto upholstery shop should be able to
stitch together these seats.
My own shop, here, custom created a set of Regal Lancer seats, using the OEM remnants as patterns.
As there IS some measure of careful work involved in creating these seats, it would be nice if Gary, once he gets all
geared-up to sew these seats, would continue to make a few extra ones, instead of having to waste time/energy in
re-learning the construction details involved in creating these seats' detail-patterns.
Posted 2009-01-03 4:52 PM (#157693 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Neil, You're right. Any good upholstery shop can do this work. For me the timing was right. A few other owners that were looking for an intact pattern set because theirs were so badly deteriorated asked me to send mine to Gary. I know there are orders for 5 sets right now which include mine, the KS/CO black Regal, The Ruffalo/BJ Regal, another Regal on the left coast and one guy that wants to put them in his Custom Royal convertible. It would be a good idea to have a couple sets on the shelf. I'll suggest this to Gary but it's a business decision in the end. I'm sure he will keep the patterns and a stock of materials in any case. He is also arranging for door panels to be redone through an arrangement he has with SMS where he gets better turn-around as a vendor. I'm not getting my door panels done but I hear the quality is very good. I have a lot of other Regal Lancer info and pictures I'd like to post. It will clarify a lot of the questions that have been posted in this thread. Should I continue here (we've totally hijacked this thread) or start a new thread elsewhere?
Posted 2009-01-03 6:12 PM (#157710 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Here's some pictures of the sales brochure that show the Acousti-Foam headliner and generally hype the uniqueness of this model. Note that despite that color code being copper poly they refer to the color as bronze. I guess that sounded classier. Also notice the white car appears to have gold Regal Lancer script and spear.
Posted 2009-01-03 8:04 PM (#157715 - in reply to #157710) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Hi, Joe:
That's fantastic! I am glad you found the thread - I would continue posting here - since this thread has become "all things" Regal. Yours is perhaps one of the most exciting Regals, being a D-500 in a otherwise unseen color combination. I know Tony Richards was lobbying hard to get that Regal. I would have been too, but for the fact that I did not know the owner and nobody who knew about the car would reveal the owner's identity to me! I do wish I could have seen that car in person. However, knowing that you have it and are on this site is wonderful. I am glad to hear that Goers is reproducing the interior. His name is synonymous with top-quality.
I am also surprised to hear that the Ruffalo/BJ car is one of the customers for a new interior. I sat in the car an it seemed very, very nice. I suppose it is always good to have a spare! I have a Coronet convertible (under restoration) and I've often wondered what that interior would look like in a convertible.
Posted 2009-01-05 6:29 PM (#157916 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Oh, definitely, THIS should remain as the Regal Lancer Thread/board!
It's very-nice to know that Gary is going to re-pop the door panels, too.
That only pretty-much leaves the headliner as being Unobtanium, and it/they can be reasonably-facsimilied by installing
bronze vinyl material, with MoPar Mel's chromed roof rail bows.
The sun visors would be tough to re-do, with their Mylar trim, on padded bronze-vinyl material.
Frostbite is looking to become MORE interesting, now, and, the seller will probably be getting very anxious to sell it, as he's
been advertising it for quite some time.
Joe, did you check-out my Regal lancer PRESS KIT, earlier-on, in this thread?
Posted 2009-01-05 6:59 PM (#157921 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
BTW, on the 3rd page of this thread, on the "Regal 3.jpg" photo, there is a good view of the padded-bronze sunvisor
with Mylar trim, AND, the remains of an OEM Accouti-Foam headliner--lolol....
Posted 2009-01-05 7:11 PM (#157923 - in reply to #157921) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+
Location: .Norfolk..Mafia.. ,England UK
d500neil - 2009-01-05 11:59 PM
BTW, on the 3rd page of this thread, on the "Regal 3.jpg" photo, there is a good view of the padded-bronze sunvisor
with Mylar trim, AND, the remains of an OEM Accouti-Foam headliner--lolol....
I saw it on page 2 Better...
My Question is, What Model and Years ( 57.58.59 ) did they fit the Mylar Trim / Padded Sun-Visor ???? I have them fitted on my 59 as mine had the Cardboard type ( still have them ) .. I bought some from Ebay 2 years back, they where listed as 58, So i pulled the Bar out and fitted the Chrome 59 Bar to it, Mine are a Cream colour with the Mylar Trim to match my " Custom " Interior ( also has Mylar on door panels ) ..???????????
Posted 2009-01-05 7:28 PM (#157926 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Clive, as far as I know, the padded sun visors were a 1958 Dodge item, only----not certain about a 1959 carry-over,
though.
I had a set of padded sunvisors that I took off of a 1958 PLY Sport Suburban (IIRC) which were ivory, with the Mylar trim.
I sold them (too cheaply, now!) to Ed Erickson, back east, to put on his 58Fury.
Another interesting point/detail: the factory literature will show bronze-colored dash panel inserts, for the driver's gauges and on the glove box.
In production, there appears to be only(?) the standard silver-andodized aluminum dash inserts having been used (check the
photos of cars' dashes, in this thread).
If I can remember to do this, I think I'll go check my Regal Press Kit, to see if the dash inserts have unique
part numbers being listed for them.
If they do have a unique P/N shown, then, at least SOME Regals must have got the bronze anodized
dash inserts!!!----and, if no dash insert P/N's are shown, then, none of the production Regals got
bronze anodized dash inserts.
Posted 2009-01-05 9:33 PM (#157942 - in reply to #157715) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Lancer Mike - 2009-01-03 8:04 PM
Hi, Joe:
That's fantastic! I am glad you found the thread - I would continue posting here - since this thread has become "all things" Regal. Yours is perhaps one of the most exciting Regals, being a D-500 in a otherwise unseen color combination. I know Tony Richards was lobbying hard to get that Regal. I would have been too, but for the fact that I did not know the owner and nobody who knew about the car would reveal the owner's identity to me! I do wish I could have seen that car in person. However, knowing that you have it and are on this site is wonderful. I am glad to hear that Goers is reproducing the interior. His name is synonymous with top-quality.
I am also surprised to hear that the Ruffalo/BJ car is one of the customers for a new interior. I sat in the car an it seemed very, very nice. I suppose it is always good to have a spare! I have a Coronet convertible (under restoration) and I've often wondered what that interior would look like in a convertible.
Mike
Mike, I think the way I worded that post was misleading. I don't own the black D500 Regal (however I know the new owner and have seen the car). That black is exceptionally solid as someone else mentioned. I have a picture of the floors below.
Posted 2009-01-05 9:44 PM (#157943 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Here's a better shot of the dash in the brochure. Mine wasn't actually bronze tone but in the steering wheel horn rim there was copper color between the chrome stripes. It's not unusual for the prototype cars used for promotion to be different from the production as we all know. For instance the glove box door in the brochure has no lance and sheild, where mine does. I've seen many Regals that have the plain door. Notice the print date on the brochure of 1-58. My car's schedule date is 12-26-57 and is an early build and may be a little different than the others.
Posted 2009-01-05 10:00 PM (#157947 - in reply to #157942) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Boy-oh-boy! That must have been a western Kansas car from the high plains! Great photos, Joe. I probably read something into your message that I shouldn't have. At any rate, that Regal could use the Frostbite's (old) steering wheel! That point about the copper colored dash inserts is a good one. If they didn't do it they should have - I think that would really complement the dash board and interior.
Clive, there was a 1959 Custom Royal here in Denver that had those padded visors. We ran a thread about it in the Rocky Mountain Region and I think you had a few posts there. I remember when I sat inside the car noting that those visors were exactly like my 1958 Custom Royal visors. I would think that you could probably stain or color a set of those bronze to fit into a Regal, but like Neil said - slim pickins they are!
Posted 2009-01-05 10:09 PM (#157950 - in reply to #157947) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Maybe the bunch of us on this thread should chip in and buy the Frostbite We each pay a $1,000 and you get to keep it for 365 days before you have to drive it to the next guy. Only condition is you have to convert something back to original before you send it on. Last one alive keeps it!
Posted 2009-01-05 10:20 PM (#157951 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Here's a shot of my car at the shop just before a new Metalcrafters quarter panel was welded in and floors made by R/Car. I found something interesting on the firewall. Apparently the colors were written in yellow crayon under the heater area as it came down the production line. Mine says White-White-Bronze. I never knew it was there until I stripped the engine bay. Just for laughs I checked the black D500 car and I could make out enough letters to determine it was similarly marked Bronze-Black.
Posted 2009-01-06 7:00 PM (#158046 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I don't get-it; the "white white bronze" was written AFTER the car was painted????
I wonder what the additional "19" confirms?
Not real-straight masking-off , for the side-painting, too, huh?
The interesting thing about some of the glove boxes not having lance-and-shield emblems is the fact that those "non'-"
cars must have had glove box lids, and aluminum cover-plates, from a CRL SEDAN, which did not have any pre-cut holes in the
lids and plates, to accept the 'emblems', because the sedans were not "Lancers" (and would not have had any 'emblems' ON
their glove box lids).
Posted 2009-01-06 10:49 PM (#158069 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
The white-white bronze was written after the "body" was painted but before the roof and side spear were painted. The overspray you see is from when the side spear paint that blew through the gap between the door and fender. I think the line under the first white means white top. Something else you'll notice in that picture is that the antenna cable hole is used. I think I had the only Regal with a fender mount antenna. Sorry for the purists out there but I'm putting dual rears on this car. It just doesn't look right to me otherwise.
Posted 2009-01-07 12:25 AM (#158073 - in reply to #158069) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
No apologies necessary, Joe - it is your car. I even defended the Frostbite! I think the dual deck antennae are going to look very sharp. If you take a car down to that level, you deserve to add a few of your own touches! One of the photos you took of the bronze/bronze/black Richards / Massachusetts car you took on page 7 brings up another question.
The photo of the trunk clearly shows the 1957 trim piece on the inside edge of the fin. I did not recall this piece on the Ruffalo/BJ Regal. It looks like the piece would be unnecessary for the Regal paint job, did Regals come with that piece of trim or not? Neil, does your parts list show those pieces and the 1957 fin caps (Coronet or Royal, but not Custom Royal) necessary to fit those on to a 1958? Something seems amiss with that.
If I were lucky enough to snag a Regal Lancer, I'd deck her out with every conceivable period option I could get my mits on, including making her a Super D-500 and painting her with a copper body/black roof and sweep whether she rolled of the line like that or not.
I certainly wouldn't support a "Frostbite" like effort, but if/when I get mine, the slate gets wiped clean as if I'd walked into the dealership and "custom" ordered her myself - 100% stock, but with all the bells and whistles that were available at the time.
Posted 2009-01-07 12:31 PM (#158103 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Mike,
I've never seen a Regal with that stainless strip. The fin and trunk are the same color making it unecessary as a cover to a color separation. The strip above the tailight that runs from the fin end is there unless you have the potmetal inserts as mine does. Many people will tell you that these insets are incorrect for Regals but I know mine was delivered this way from the factory because there are no holes for strip. Actually I've never seen 2 Regals that are done the same. Despite the limited number of options there was a lot of subtle differences some of which I attribute to Chrysler's reputation for production line ad-libbing. That being said I will add some things that shouldn't be there also because as 55 Coro noteed these cars look good decked out.
Posted 2009-01-07 2:48 PM (#158117 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Joe/Mike : "Never-say-never", but, WOW!
The 1957 and 1958 (except for the "Saddle-trim" painted '58's ) had completely different end-of-fin chrome "caps".
The 1957-style had mounting-tabs/ears, on the inboard side, to accept the attachment of the thin stainless steel molding
that was necessary to separate the painted fin; in 1958, the fin was painted the same color as the trunk, so, that extra
labor/parts expense was saved, without having to include the cost to install that trim piece.
The 1958 end-of-fin cap just terminates at the level of the quarter panel, 'straight-down', kinda.
Joe, you shouild carefully document the installation of that '1957' quarter panel thin-trim, and THEN, do NOT (probably!)
re-install that trim, but, fill in the mounting holes, and then go-install "correct" 1958 end-of-fin caps, if ONLY
to avoid 'questions' about the legitimacy OF your restoration----the potential hassles are just not 'worth' having those 1957
trim pieces remain installed!!!
BESIDES: yer gonna go install dual antennae, anyway.
Posted 2009-01-07 3:21 PM (#158119 - in reply to #158117) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Interesting! We talked about those Spring Special fin caps before. I think MoPar Aivar's Regal has those. Interesting to note that yours came from the factory. Are you going to install the wide license plat eschutcheon too? I think the caps and eschutcheon go very well together. To me, one without the other looks like something is missing. Here is a picture of my Royal. It had the fin caps (from the dealer), but no eschutcheon. I bought an eschutcheon and put it on. As far as I am concerned, those items could be installed by the factory, dealer, or restorer.
Posted 2009-01-07 8:29 PM (#158165 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Each of the Spring Special trim pieces was officially available (per factory advertising) as dealership-installed items (hell, the factory
didn't CARE, if some owner used those factory-pieces to customize his car!)
Mike, your car has the gold-anodized "Dodge" trunk emblem. I've seen CRL's wearing either the silver, or the gold, 'plated'
nameplates, but, I can't recall the last Royal or Coro that I've seen, having the gold-colored nameplate on it.
Mike's photo clearly shows the appearance of the 1958 end-of-fin cap, which has its inboard leg just terminate at the point
where it meets the upper quarter panel; the 1957 piece has a small tab/ear/sprag connected to the inboard leg, to fit into
the thin fin-molding, as seen on Joe's photo "Trunk.jpeg" , on thread-page #7 .
Posted 2009-01-07 11:09 PM (#158183 - in reply to #158165) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: Under the X in Texas
Has anyone ever inquired of the seller of Frostbite as to what the reserve is? You know some sellers will reveal their reserve and some won't. I was curious so I asked today. Got a reply from Sal Misuraca: "The reserve is $23,000.00. If you are interested in the Lancer we would be glad to let one of your friends view the car. The car is located in Sterling Heights. Please let me know.
Posted 2009-01-08 10:52 PM (#158288 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
True. it won't be cheap to put that Regal back to the way most of us would want to see - that is either original or spruced up with factory goodies. even the paint is expensive. My buddy researched the paint extensively and we finally bought it from TCP Global in san Diego. We thought two gallons would easily do our two cars. Surprise the eggshell doesn't cover well and required several coats. But when finished the Frostbite car might look as good my buddy's. The body man that did this work is also doing my car. You'll also note in the rear shot that his car had the license plate escutcheon but not the stainless insert. I have only the stainless insert. Enjoy the pix.
Posted 2009-01-12 1:21 PM (#158651 - in reply to #158288) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Great photos, Joe. I wonder how the paint company matched that copper metallic spot on? In one of the earlier posts, we talked about the pait codes for copper metallic - but they are hard to find. None of the paint chip charts even show it. It is good to know that someone still knows how to make it - it looks like you have to pay a pretty penny for it though!
So that one belongs to another friend? You know all the right people! How many Regals can you account for?
Posted 2009-01-12 6:41 PM (#158694 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
This company was the only one that said they formulated their paint from original manufacturer's codes, no paint chip needed and they guaranteed satisfaction. Noe of the major paint manufacturers would do that. Many wanted to substitute a modern color that they had the formula for, saying it was close enough. Close wasn't good enough for my buddy. I probably would have settled for something more readily available. I don't know if I know the "right" people but I seem to know a bunch infected with the same love of Regal Lancers. With the pictures of other current owners on this thread that I didn't know about (thanks everyone for posting those and growing the list that I keep) I can account for 16. I knew of others years past but don't want to count those or the ones that were located in salvage yards. Those may be the same as ones in current owners hands or they may be gone (shudder). For instance, Moper Mel sold a restored one back in the early 90's. That car (colors ASA) may be already counted. Based on the way they keep popping up, I'd say there are 3 or 4 times as many as we think there are.
Posted 2009-01-12 7:07 PM (#158701 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I agree, Joe; there's probably another 8 or so Regals out-there, in this country, that haven't been publically revealed.
Recall that original/unrestored 1960 NY'er convertible, which someone recently posted, on one of these here boards.
If the owner of that Regal, up-above here, wants to restore the car, properly, he should remove the front suspension
componentry and have the pieces be powder-coated in "bare-metal" finish.
The floor pans (if this car is NOT factory-undercoated) should have OEM over-spray appear/applied at right-angles to the
chassis, as the gray primer/sealer was not masked-off when the body color(s) was/were applied.
If the car was OEM undercoated, the undercoating was applied over the over-spray, hiding its appearance.
Looks like there's undercoating showing, on the fender wells.
Posted 2009-01-13 3:15 PM (#158805 - in reply to #158694) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
SXS = eggshell car with bronze fins, roof, and stripe
XSX = bronze car with eggshell fins, roof, and stripe
SAS = black car with bronze fins, roof, and stripe
ASA = bronze car with black fins, roof, and stripe
On this thread, most of the cars seen are SXS - including the Ruffalo/BJ car, where I shot a picture of the data trim plate. XSX are Joe's and Nick's. True SAS are rare, but Mel restored one (Joe's last thread). ASA is rare too: Richards/Massachusetts Regal. By rare, I mean surviving examples - I could only assume an even distribution of colors among the 1,163 produced - about 290 of each scheme.
Posted 2009-01-14 2:49 PM (#158949 - in reply to #158855) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I can't imagine how the side trim would fit on a four-door Sierra - it might have to be a REGAL SUBURBAN! Maybe some one out there can photoshop one for us?
Posted 2009-01-15 11:06 AM (#159044 - in reply to #158992) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Of all the things done to the Frostbite, that would be the straw that broke the camel's back! Unfortunately, the Suburbans are equally rare. It would be a tragedy on both ends.
The more I look at the Frostbite, the more I like it. I know folks have been very critical of it, but it grows on me. I think my initial estimation of a sale price at $15K might have been too harsh. I think it might be a good deal at $18K. I would still un-pimp the interior and put some proper white shoes on it.
Posted 2009-01-16 6:04 PM (#159228 - in reply to #159209) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
The problem with "clones" is not so much with the car, while still owned by the 'creator', but with its claimed provenance
by subsquent owners, and/or from it becoming a "legitimate" fake, and/or from its diminishing the value of real car models.
Strangely, the creators of the varying-extents-of-clones take a different viewpoint regarding the legitimacy of what they are
doing, and whether their car is "now" a D500, a V800 Plymouth, Super D500, or Fury, or 300, or fuel-injected whatever....merely
because of what THEY have done to their car.
Of course, there are no laws proscribing what you/I can do with our cars, but, there ARE laws concerning the mis-representation
of an object as being "legitimate", in order to increase its sale-value.
Hmmm: CLONED artwork!
ACTUALLY, there is such a thing; the copying-artist merely signs his OWN name to the canvass, or to the 'piece'.
Posted 2009-01-28 12:08 AM (#160726 - in reply to #160686) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Thanks, Matt! The Frostbite deserves to be watched. Is it growing on anyone else? I think Jim could do a much better sales pitch with this car and probably get pretty close to what he wants. And, my goodness, it was 1,163 - no need to round it down or round it at all. Alas, Jim would have been better to point them here - wikipedia got us this time!
Posted 2009-02-02 8:29 PM (#161501 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Ok; I just sent Clive some "Dodge Reporter" (in-house factory-dealership glossy monthly newspaper-) photos, which show
Regal Lancers on display.
BUMMERLY, I could not find the official Regal Lancer release-date in them; even the R.L. PRESS KIT that I have does not mention any Release Date.
A clue, however, will be the photo caption that says : "...This Custom Royal (not correctly identified, even, in-house !) has been on display in the Utica NY railroad station since the first of the year. ..."
Another Release-Date clue is found on the Regal Lancer "Announcement" fold-out brochure, which has
an issue date of 1/58.
It, and the other Regals appearing in the Dodge Reporter, are the gold-body, with white trim----apparently this scheme may have been the preferred scheme (or not; maybe they just happened to be on-hand, then, or, they were the first colors produced).
Unfortunately, there is no mention of any display of a Regal Lancer in the Florida area, in the Dodge Reporters.
But, their introduction appears to have been on or around 1/1/58 .
Another interesting factoid, from the Press Kit, is that "officially" (when the Press Kit's information was
being printed-up), the Fuel Injection D500 engine may still have been technically available, or else, the
factory just wanted to add on a few more words, about the optional performance engines.
If you'll recall, at least one 1960 4-speed 300 was built, due to the factory's advertising that it WAS
available, and the unhappy prospective buyer threatened to sue, if he was not permitted to BUY one !!
Too bad such a dedicated Fuelie-loving 58 Dodge owner didn't exist.
Posted 2009-02-03 5:31 PM (#161610 - in reply to #161578) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
In that last pic, above here: the rear seat confirms that this car is a Regal; the second color is white, so, the
main body color must be bronze (again).
I think that these are different cars, but 'they' are all bronze, with white trim.
Dodge may have thought that this scheme was the most colorful, and/or dramatic.
Also, note the Press Kit's referral to the availability of the Fuelie engine (in very-late 1957).
And, for documentary-purposes; with 2 hours left to go, Frostbite has received a high-bid
of $11,000.00 (Reserve not Met).
Posted 2009-02-03 10:58 PM (#161677 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Neil,
Interesting that many of the early Regals and those used in promotion were painted XSX. The original owner of my car was from the Albany NY area. I wonder if it's possible that my car was used for showroom or display purposes?
Posted 2009-02-04 2:39 PM (#161743 - in reply to #161677) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Great photos, Neil! I have often heard the Regal referred to as a sub-set of the Custom Royal model. The Collectible Automobile article referred to it that way.
You're right, Joe. As I looked at those photos, I wondered "where are they now?" Most likely, they have perished, but you never know...
Posted 2009-02-04 5:09 PM (#161770 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
JOE: lol: how far is Utica from Albany?
You never know; that might be your car; it's got clear glass, though, and it may have dual rear antennae on it.
It also looks to have OEM (probably) undercoating on it.
A lot (vast majority) of the Regals have passed on, but there statistically seems to have be a large number which
have survived----how many "Frostbites" are still out-there????
LOL: notice the typo, in the description of the Regal's "Ram Fire" D500 engine?
Posted 2009-02-05 7:41 PM (#161959 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I just sent Clive some interesting mini-articles, from the 3/58 MoTor Trend.
In the "Bucket Seats, Bronze Tone" article, it states that the ONLY color combinations was/were the BRONZE body
with either white, or black, trim.
I gotta go back and re-read the Press Release, to see if it mentions the FOUR color combinations.
If so, then the MT articles were apparently written prior to the issuance of the Press Kit.
If the earliest models WERE only bronze-bodies, that would explain the absense of the white and the black bodied models,
until sometime after early-January, 1958---and maybe until as late as March, 1958?
Posted 2009-02-06 4:05 PM (#162040 - in reply to #161959) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+
Location: .Norfolk..Mafia.. ,England UK
d500neil - 2009-02-06 12:41 AM
I just sent Clive some interesting mini-articles, from the 3/58 MoTor Trend.
In the "Bucket Seats, Bronze Tone" article, it states that the ONLY color combinations was/were the BRONZE body
with either white, or black, trim.
I gotta go back and re-read the Press Release, to see if it mentions the FOUR color combinations.
If so, then the MT articles were apparently written prior to the issuance of the Press Kit.
If the earliest models WERE only bronze-bodies, that would explain the absense of the white and the black bodied models,
until sometime after early-January, 1958---and maybe until as late as March, 1958?
Posted 2009-02-06 4:15 PM (#162043 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I just sent Clive a pic of a page from the Regal's Press Kit's Press Release (undated, drat) , which confirms the existence of four exterior color schemes.
A CAREFUL reading of the Press Release confirms that, Apparently, MT may have written its mini-articles BEFORE the Press kit was produced, because MT only specifically mentions the bronze-body motifs, and not the white & the black body motifs.
You can't get a "four-way" color combination using just the bronze-body motif.
There WERE four separate paint schemes involved. I wonder if MT mis-read the Press Release, or, whether
the Regal lancers were, indeed, originally designed to have only the BRONZE body schemes, so that MT
merely 'correctly' quoted the initial production information which had been given to them.
Neat, huh?
The white & black bodies might have been after-thoughts/additions to the original marketing plan.....
Dammn, that was QUICK, Clive!
So, the Press Release states that the Regals were introduced at the 1958 Chicago Automobile Show.
I've just written to the Chicago Sun Times archives, asking for those dates.....
Posted 2009-02-06 10:29 PM (#162094 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Found some info on the 1958 Chicago Auto Show. From the photos it was Jan 4-12 and Dodge had a central display location. Does the Dodge display show a Regal Lancer? I can't tell.
Posted 2009-02-10 12:46 AM (#162409 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 7207 Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada
It's too bad they didn't actually make those true bucket seats in the Regals, but I guess they were already engineering the 1959 type swivel seats. In retrospect, those swivel seats could have been made a whole lot more bucket like, with contoured bolsters etc. The first true Mopar bucket seats were on the 1960 300-F. Also I've always wondered, why the 1959 Custom Royal upholstery was not near as nice as the upholstery on the 1957 & 1958 Custom Royals, never mind the Regals. The 59's didn't have the plush looking horizontal pleats in the cloth sections that both 57's and 58s had.
Posted 2009-02-10 1:25 AM (#162417 - in reply to #162409) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: Parts Unknown
imopar380 - 2009-02-10 9:46 PM
I've always wondered, why the 1959 Custom Royal upholstery was not near as nice as the upholstery on the 1957 & 1958 Custom Royals, never mind the Regals. The 59's didn't have the plush looking horizontal pleats in the cloth sections that both 57's and 58s had.
********************************
To match all the other great things they screwed up for 59 !
Posted 2009-02-10 3:47 PM (#162479 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I think that the 59 Doggies had flattie upholstery, to allow for easy ingress/egress, and, maybe, to avoid
the wear and tear that the tucked/rolled upholstery received.
BTW, the 58 Regal Lancer semi-bucket bench seat was actually depicted in the early 1957 advertising, which showed
the long-low profile shot of that red/white CRL 2-dr HT, with 4-5 "detail" illustrations, which appeared to be
'hanging' on a wall, above and behind the car .
$45,000 for a fully restored example seems like a reasonable price to get into the game!
For sale is a 1958 Dodge Custom Royal Regal Lancer two door hardtop. (508-317-7092) This car was restored about 4 years ago by a previous owner. It has a white body with bronze roof, trunk, and side trim. The engine is a 350 cu. in. big block with 4 bbl. carburetor. The transmission is a 3 speed pushbutton torqueflite automatic. The car sports a beautiful reproduction interior just like the original. Runs and drives very nicely. This is a one year only model with very low production (1,163 units). Asking $45,000 possible partial MoPar trades. Call 508-317-7092
Posted 2009-03-25 7:31 PM (#168361 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Yeah, the seat vinyl can be replaced.
Depending on the physical condition of the car, $45K might be a reasonable auction value for it, so, the seller
might be amenable to negotiating a 10% price deduction on it, to reflect the net-come that he might receive for
the car, at an auction.
And, yeah, the prospective auction buyer would 'save' his own buyer's commission, too, on this private sale.
Posted 2009-03-26 12:11 AM (#168379 - in reply to #168361) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
If you compare this car to the Frostbite, you could easily spend $30,000 on the Frostbite to get it close to this condition, but it would also cost you potentially years of effort and having the car off the road. With this one, sure you spend the $30,000 up front, but you are ready to enjoy right away. Sometimes, it makes sense to buy the restored car!
Posted 2009-03-26 12:14 AM (#168380 - in reply to #168379) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
of the two east coast cars that I remember, this appears to be the better of the two. The other had the front bumper spuds, but it also had some after-market looking chrome wheel covers that made me very suspicious.
Posted 2009-03-26 4:23 PM (#168445 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I agree with you, Mike; the current question is: WHO has $30K+ , today, to spend on buying this car, outside of
an auction venue?
Wow....talking about the state of the Economy: over on the GEN DISC Board, on that Las Vegas MoPar show
photos-thread, there's a sweet looking 300K that has an ASKING price of $13.9K .
Posted 2009-03-27 4:15 PM (#168542 - in reply to #168528) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Are you sure that isn't 300,000 miles? They did have some solid looking deals in Las Vegas...A K for that price in that conditions seems like a very good deal indeed.
Posted 2009-04-22 1:46 PM (#171434 - in reply to #168561) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I friend of mine just sent me some very interesting pictures from the Richard Carpenter collection...
I don't know Richard Carpenter nor have I ever met him. I just know of him as a singer and a car collector. From what I know of him as a car collector, he is perhaps one of the best friends that the Forward Look era has ever had. It would be nice if he was a member of the website.
I don't think that I have ever seen this particular car before. If it is a true black over copper, it is the only one that I know of - and a D-500 to boot???
Posted 2009-04-22 5:16 PM (#171462 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
THIS is the first black-over-copper Regal we've accounted for????
NAH; just went back and checked this thread's photos.
However, IF... this car is a real D500, it would appear to be ANOTHER car which we can add to the list
of known (semi-)surviving Regals. How many are we 'up' to, so far?
Wish I had a good contact at the Yesterday Once More place; would love to have a look at the car's P/T plate,
and a peek at the engine compartment.
Looks like the car has a tinted-only windshield; bet that it's aftermarket, and that the car originally had all-clear
glass in it.
Looks like Y-O-M painted the wheels PLY(?-) silver, instead of Dodge eggshell.
I don't have a clue about how/why those fender-top moldings got to be installed, on this car--not Dodge items!
This car has the silver-plated trunk "Dodge" nameplate; some CRL's had 'this' nameplate, and others have the gold-
anodized nameplate. There does not appear to be any pattern/reason for a car to have one, or the other, colored
"Dodge" nameplate on it.
Also note that this is one of those "coral" grille emblem cars, too, and, that this car has the "Bumper Group" option
(which happens to be the only-available [besides-Super-D] option which Aivar Lejin's Regal does NOT have on it).
Posted 2009-04-22 6:48 PM (#171473 - in reply to #171462) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
We would have to see the cowl tag, but this may be the only one we know of that actually came that way from the factory(?). I verified that the Ruffalo / BJ car was originally copper over white. I think the two east coast cars were copper over white originally too(?) - don't know of any other black over coppers out there.
Those are '57 DeSoto fender ornaments. Nice looking, but too busy on this car. I had a fender for a '58 Dodge Spring Special that had one of those things mounted on it.
Posted 2009-04-22 6:53 PM (#171475 - in reply to #171473) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I don't know if it is a trick of the light, but the front hood letters appear to be chrome plated pot metal too. No silver annodized spears on this one! This may have gone through a pretty extensive restoration. I would love to get a look at the headliner / interior / engine bay.
Posted 2009-04-22 8:12 PM (#171503 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
OK; but: there 'is' (hopefully-still-existing) that black-over-copper car, sitting in the field, in one of my earlier-
posted photos.
57 Soto ornaments, huh?---looks like those guys might already have been retro-fitted onto the car, when Y-O-M bought it?
Y-O-M didn't (bother to) research the wheel color, either-----if so, this implies that this car may have been in fairly good
physical condition when Y-O-M got it, as they might just have restored it, "as-purchased-by-them", without really having to do
any serious research on its finishing.
To avoid future embarrassment, if anyone has a personal reference there, he might tell them about the DeSoto fender trim on
it, so that Y-O-M might consider removing them, filling the holes, and touching-up the paintwork, before the side trim is installed.
Posted 2009-04-22 11:57 PM (#171534 - in reply to #171503) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
We may be looking at your field car...I recall that it had a chrome plated pot metal Dodge script on the trunk. I don't know if the "Regal Lancer" script came in either chrome plated pot metal or gold-annodized aluminum, but I would think that you would want all of the script and block letters to match (as opposed to mismatch).
YOM would do well to read this thread top to bottom and make fast friends with Aivar, Pat, Tom, Joe, and you too - Neil! We may be the only ones still reading this thread!
Posted 2009-04-23 12:22 AM (#171536 - in reply to #171534) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: Parts Unknown
The Regal once residing at Al's Auto Wrecking was black over bronze like this. I *think* I took the data tag and have it in my "pile"(?).
It only seems right that if a whole line of DeSotos got a Dodge nose stuck on them, that a Dodge got at least some DeSoto nose chrome stuck on its snoot too, don'tcha think ?
Posted 2009-04-23 12:13 PM (#171591 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 3155 Location: NY & VT
Neil - if you're referring to the "eyebrow" fender moldings, they are not '57 as mentioned, but found only on '58 FireSweep and '58 Chrysler Windsor - I just got a nice AZ pair for my 'Sweep from Don Petty, and they came off a '58 Windsor, have the same part # on them and also in my 55-59 factory parts book.
Apparently they fit on '58 Dodge too in place of the narrower ones that were standard. Makes sense since the Sweep and I guess the Windsor also were made in the LA or Detroit Dodge plants.
Posted 2009-04-23 4:06 PM (#171609 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 3155 Location: NY & VT
Gotcha, yep I do believe those are '57... we used to call them "aimers" back in the day! lotsa chrome on that YOM car - I'd hate to pay for all that re-plating!!
Posted 2009-04-23 9:12 PM (#171656 - in reply to #171609) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 322
Beautiful car. Originally from Massachusetts. Belonged to a friend of mine. Original colors and paint scheme. Mint original interior. Fender ornaments were on car when it was new. Saw photo from that time to confirm that. Holes on fender tops appeared to be factory made and not hand drilled. Car has a speedminder on the speedometer which was released in late 58. Only time I ever saw one on a 58. Often seen on 59 Dodges. Saw some factory literature advertising it once. Looks like they are freshening it up, since it was restored 15 yrs ago.
Jim
Posted 2009-04-23 9:48 PM (#171658 - in reply to #171656) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Hey, Jim; I don't know from-where the Dodge Main would have got those Soto ornaments, since they are 1957-items
and, of course, this car might be of late-58 production.
It also seems unlikely that Chubbie would add-on Fart-parts, which is kind-of what a putting-on-of-year-old-different-brand
parts would have been like, back then.
I know: never-say-never, but, this provenance, of 1957 Soto trim, "OEM-installed" on a top-of-the-line 1958 Dodge stretches
my credulity.
At least, the Speedminder APPEARED on factory literature....
I suppose that this car also came with its silver wheels, OEM, too ?
So, is this a car 'we' haven't previously accounted-for????
Love-ya, man, but "show me da MONEY", on this car's ornamentation.
Posted 2009-04-24 7:11 AM (#171689 - in reply to #171658) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 322
I know what you mean.... When Brian was restoring the car, he decided to leave them because of the factory appearing holes in the top of the fenders,and an old picture from the early 60's that showed them. The original owner owned a restaraunt/bar and worked 6 days/wk 12 hr days. He was Not mechanically inclined as I understand. No aftermarket items were on the car. The car was sold at a Dodge dealer that didn't sell Desoto. The car only had 32000 miles on it. The orig owner lived only 1/2 mile from his business and never used it much. So based on those facts Brian just decided to leave them on. Car was taken apart for restoration when he discovered it. Unfortunately build sheet was not in the car.
I'll check with with Brian on the wheel color. I don't remember.....
I don't think this one was ever counted.
Posted 2009-04-24 4:34 PM (#171739 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
..YEAHBUTT; I initially typed "credibility" !----had to go change that wording, pronto!!---as Sigmund's daughter once
said : "is my Freudian slip showing"?
Jim: does your friend have any vintage photos of this car, with its 1957 DeSoto fender trim installed on it?
Even so, the best 'explanation' for their appearance on the car may be related to a dealership add-on (unless the
Broadcast Sheet &/or the IBM card might have some explanation for their OEM existence.....)
You've heard of the Stockholm Syndrome, or Munchausen by Proxy, Imperial Russian family-survivors, and/or other associative
mental disorders? Unfortunately we (or EYE, anyway!) have a NEW automotive-related term, for a completely unique auto
provenance which is being claimed, but which is not, can not, or, has-not-YET been necessarily proven to be Original Equipment Manufacturer :
A GARLICK-mobile, or a GARLICK-option, or, just simply a "Garlick".....for a (Car-)Body Dysmorphic Disorder.
Posted 2009-04-24 5:54 PM (#171748 - in reply to #171689) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
CustomRoyal - 2009-04-24 5:11 AM
When Brian was restoring the car, he decided to leave them because of the factory appearing holes in the top of the fenders,and an old picture from the early 60's that showed them.
There is something to that. I was thinking of the "Frostbite" - the Regal that started this thread - and how the customization is part of the car in some way. I don't know about the seats, but the paint job - well, maybe it is part of the history of the particular car.
Curious that I have a '58 Dodge fender with the same ornament!
Posted 2009-04-24 8:59 PM (#171755 - in reply to #171754) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 322
I'll tell you, I remember looking at those holes in the top fenders. They looked punched at the factory. They were all lined up perfectly, no burrs on either side. Really looked factory made..... Weren't 57-58 Desoto firesweeps assembled at the Dodge plant? I think they were.
Posted 2009-04-24 11:27 PM (#171763 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
For what it's worth. I spent some up close and personal time with this car right after it was restored and took a bunch of pictures to use as reference when I got around to doing my car. Brian went to great lengths to make this car as correct as possible. Many cars don't look as good in person as they do in pictures. This one looks better. This car is probably the finest restored Regal in existence which is why it resides in Carpenter's collection now. I have to agree with Jim that as improbable as it might seem to have the Desoto trim on the fenders they seem to have been delivered that way. Remember that when it comes to Regal Lancer fenders they didn't use Coronet or Royal fenders that have the prepunched holes for the side trim because the trim was mounted higher and was double strips. Blank Dodge fenders without any script or trim holes are needed. The trim holes were hand drilled all the way down the side of the car. Could it be that when this car car came down the line no blank Dodge fenders were left due to the late production? Were Desoto fenders sourced and the top trim mounted to fill the prepunched holes on top? Stranger things have happened at Ma Mopar. This is probably the same car shown in another picture earlier in this thread with a second Regal with the same colors. There are 3 or 4 other Regals with the same ASA colors but I can't say if those are correct or a repaint like the Ruffalo car. I have it counted already in my list of 18 known.
Posted 2009-04-24 11:37 PM (#171764 - in reply to #171755) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Correct you are, Jim. I'll get the fender down from the rafters tomorrow and post a picture. The fender is unmistakeably a '58 Dodge fender. It still had the Spring Special trim on it! Dual head lights and Dodge eyebrow moulding. It also had the saddle two-tone and the tell-tale Dodge bumper and grille clips.
Recognizing the emblem as a '57 DeSoto, I sold it on eBay to a fellow in Florida. I think I wrote down the part number in my eBay description - I'll see if I can look that up - but that was several years ago now.
Perhaps they had a few '57 DeSoto fender ornaments sitting around at the factory and gussied up a few Dodges to help move them off the lots? It is a very strange coincidence! Until I saw this Regal, I thought nothing of it - just that somebody put a DeSoto ornament on that particular Dodge.
Posted 2009-04-25 12:37 AM (#171771 - in reply to #168542) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: Parts Unknown
Let's review ....
The 57 DeSoto fender ornaments were are referring to are big body only ..... standard equipment on Fireflite and Adventurer, ... extra cost optional on Firedome. My saleman's lit says "N/A" for these on Firesweep. The part was radically changed for 58 and again was not available on Firesweep.
The Firesweep was built alongside Dodges, but the big body DeSotos were built miles away at the DeSoto plant.
These ornaments, IF they were put on Dodges of any sort, were very deliberately procured and installed. They were year-old parts that should not have been at a Dodge plant. Two real strong reasons to suggest this was not some mistake or coincidence.
Posted 2009-04-25 12:47 AM (#171772 - in reply to #171771) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 4042 Location: Connecticut
A couple of additional facts about this car:
Yes, the scheme is correct.
No, the car is not a factory D500. That was added recently. The power windows were also added recently.
This was a really nice restoration that Richard recently had repainted. The original dealer plate, which was on the trunk, was removed and the holes were filled. Apparently, he's not into these.
I'm of the opinion that the Desoto mouldings were added later. I can create factory looking holes by removing the burrs with a wire wheel on a high speed grinder.
Posted 2009-04-25 7:52 PM (#171831 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Well....not REALLY, Mike; let's see whatcha GOT, anyway!
The molding's installation shadow-impression should be of some interest, too, along with the appearance of the mounting holes.
Don't fink out on us, now; git er down, from your rafters.
....the real-story about how/when/why the 57 Fireflite fender moldings got installed on this 58 Regal would be neat to know.
I'd sure like to see the car's P/T plate, even tho it's not an OEM D500, or had power windows. Does it have a power seat?
Now, I gotta go back and try to see the Y-O-M car, back-earlier in this thread, as has just now been mentioned.
And, Joe, the "Stranger-things-have-happened" arguments have been made regarding Mr. Garlick's creations,
and Hemi engines having been installed in Plymouths, and Hemi engines having been installed in 1958 Dodges.
The proof is in the Corporate 'pudding' (build records), and we are all very much better-off for those
records still being available.
Since someone has 'created' a ("Super", probably) D500, with power windows, out of this car, Mr. Carpenter
would probably not be concerned about removing the 57 DeSoto moldings from it, or, obtaining its Build
Record.
But, I would be willing to bet that those fender moldings will get to be 'Garlicked' into the alleged OEM
build history/story on this car!!!
Posted 2009-04-25 8:12 PM (#171835 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
..And there's 'our' car, at the bottom of page 2 of this thread .
And, Ron; I personally regret that Y-O-M removed the Dealer-nameplate from this car's trunk.
Right after I bought my car, and was finally getting to drive it, around Toledo in 6/81, where it had been
stored, for my eventual pick- up, for 7 months(!) in a private garage near my parents' house, an old
family friend told me :"The first thing that I'd do with 'it' is get rid of THAT thing" (The Ben Medow
South Bend, IN dealership-potmetal nameplate).
In fact, I repaired the slightly-pitted nameplate, and painted it gold.
To me, that nameplate serves as a sort of 'family name' to the car, and I'm rather proud of the fact that that
car SURVIVED a rust-belt Indiana OEM-existence.
To bad Mr. Carpenter doesn't appreciate the car's history.
Posted 2009-04-26 2:20 AM (#171867 - in reply to #171835) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: Parts Unknown
I think dealer tags are one of the coolest details one can be lucky enough to have on their car. Our wagon wears its original tag for Eddie's Garage, Deadwood, South Dakota.
Posted 2009-04-30 4:53 PM (#172350 - in reply to #172030) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I wonder if he made it a Super D-500? That is a strange thing to add the power windows, but it probably makes it easier to enjoy. The car looked mighty nice to start off with!
Posted 2009-05-01 4:16 AM (#172420 - in reply to #171822) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2932 Location: Lemoore CA
Lancer Mike - 2009-04-25 5:17 PM
Ok! You guys convinced me. I didn't really want to get that fender down from the rafters anyway. Just a coincidence - case closed.
You know? If they put 57 Dodge hood ornaments on them, and there have been two examples of Desoto birds on the fenders, yours and the carpenter car, I don't think it is all that far fetched that they may have come that way, I would really like to see your fender.
Posted 2009-05-01 5:01 PM (#172499 - in reply to #172494) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Ok! Ok! I may have the chutzpah to get that dang thing down this weekend. I have a hood up in the rafters too - there is no way I would get that dang hood down - I remember when I put that thing up there - it seemed as though it was twice as heavy as the fenders!
If I get that fender down - I want some good to come of it...after some long and painful discussion and plenty of name calling, we need to hereineverafter agree that '57 De Soto fender ornaments were a legitimate factory option for Spring edition 1958 Dodges!
Posted 2009-05-01 7:02 PM (#172516 - in reply to #172503) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I always considered the Regal to be a variant of the spring special. Even though it is not an element of the official spring special literature, its purpose and timing was the same. The Regal is never identified as its own model, rather it is a late-model (i.e. spring) trim option for the Custom Royal; specifically designed to pick up sales after a winter's discontent.
You are right though, let us not kick the barn door open too wide lest all the horses run out.
Posted 2009-05-01 7:30 PM (#172518 - in reply to #172516) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Mike, the Regal was introduced at the Chicago Auto Show, around 1/58 , remember, from an earlier posting somewhere
around/above here?
That AIN'T a late-model intro, which, obviously preceded the "Spring Special" models.
Let's see what ol' Dogeroo had to say about this 'late-model Spring Special offshoot', in its Press Kit introduction :
" Newest addition to the Dodge Division's 1958 Line is the 'Regal Lancer', a limited production two-door hardtop introduced
at the Chicago Auto Show..."
The Press Release goes on to document all of the unique features, colors and trim on the car, NONE of which were shared by
the later-introduced Spring Specials, except, for the (Custom Royal's) grille emblem.
Posted 2009-05-01 11:59 PM (#172537 - in reply to #172518) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Dang it, now the horses are out of the barn! Ok, I remember the January intro - when was the first spring special produced? They must have been near the same time, especially since they share that front badge. Like I said, I know they are not one-in-the-same, but they did share the same purpose - and I think the timing of the two was pretty close?
Posted 2009-05-02 8:42 PM (#172602 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I'm pretty sure that the S.-S.'s were introduced around March.
That 'grille' emblem dates back to the 1957 CR 4-dr sedans, and CS wagons, where it was installed on the fins.
The design of that emblem became the 1958 logo, for Dodge, and was liberally installed on various Custom Royal/Sierra
models.
it didn't 'just' appear, for the first time, on the Regals, altho they were painted in coral-color for the first time (on some, but
not all Regals).
I suppose that's our NEXT question: why did some Regals get coral-colored grille emblems, and the majority(?--seemingly)
get the typical black-painted emblems?
Posted 2009-05-03 5:27 PM (#172713 - in reply to #172492) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+
Location: .Norfolk..Mafia.. ,England UK
d500neil - 2009-05-01 9:08 PM
[sigh...] I gotta do all the work around here.
The Clivester's off-line, right now, but "all" shall be revealed, in the near future (bowing-and-scraping will be
much appreciated...).
And, NO; y'all just gonna have to wait, for the pics to appear.
Anybody see # 1624 955 on it ? .....Buehler ?
SORRY,, Been Away for a few Nights..
OK: the first pic shows the Bible (55-58 Parts book) with the
illustration of the 1957 Soto's trim, with the upper molding
identified as being found in Section 12-15-21.
Sec. 12-15-21 is quite large, but the 1957 Soto fender upper-molding is
identified as being 1624 955 , for the big-dog
Adventurer - Fireflite (S26) , and the Firedome (S25) models.
The next photo (love to show it!) is my Regal Lancer Press Kit ,
with additional photos of one of its enclosures which
confirms ALL of the unique Regal parts(numbers).....
Posted 2009-05-03 9:13 PM (#172742 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
And, as Clive so eloquently posted, above, in case anyone overlooked it : "Anyone see P/N 1624 955 on the Regal's listed
unique parts, above"?
Anyone, Buehler?
So, Mr. Carpenter removed the OE-dealership trunk nameplate, but kept the (almost-certainly; why would the dealership bother
to do it? ) "post-factory" 1957 DeSoto fender ornaments, and added-on the D500 emblem/carb(s), and added on power windows, to a car which is only going to reside in his museum.
The car was last registered to drive, in CA, when the green-colored license plate sticker was in effect.
Altho the year-date of that sticker is printed on it, neither my local CHP nor DMV office could tell me, definitively, when a
green-sticker was last utilized for registration purposes.
And, OBTW, note that the 1957 Dodge hood ornaments are listed as OEM for use on the 1958 Regals.
However, those ornaments are installed on the 1958 hood, which has much-wider-spaced ornament
drillings, than the "1957" hood (which is otherwize identical to the 58 hood).
Everybody knows that the 1957 & the 1958 trunks are also clearly differentiated, right?
Posted 2009-05-04 8:43 PM (#172919 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Actually (duh); I just figured out why Mr. Carpenter removed the trunk's dealership nameplate: in 1958, the "Dodge"
name-script appeared on the passenger's side, leaving only the driver's side, for the dealer's nameplate, OR, for the
D500 emblem to be installed.
Carpenter really had no choice, but to lose the dealership, when he 'created' the D500 model.
In 1957, the 'Dodge' letters appeared spaced-out above the license plate, so that the D500 emblem could be put on the
passenger's side, and the dealership-nameplate could be installed on the driver's side of the trunk.
Posted 2009-05-05 5:59 PM (#173095 - in reply to #173056) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Here it is, Neil. You can see little white dots where the dealer plate went. Now that I installed the spring special license plate escutcheon, it is really crowded! I have to find a new location for the dealer plate, but I think it will all fit! Perhaps I can center it between the escutcheon and the D-500 emblem or go below the D-500 emblem.
Posted 2009-05-05 8:57 PM (#173127 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Next winter you could send out your D500 emblem, so that someone could apply 24K gold plating to its Knight's head,
to approximate the appearance of the translucent gold lacquer which was OEM-applied to the 'head'.
Doesn't cost very much money, to do, and really brightens-up the emblem.
Where you put the dealer nameplate pretty much depends upon the size and shape of the nameplate.
Down-low, at about the 4:00-5:00 position, relative to the 500 emblem, might look nice, but,
underneath the escutcheon is probably the best place for it.
Posted 2009-07-15 5:33 PM (#181469 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
....What a STRANGE website to find, regarding "American" automobiles!
It was nice to see a posting from Bo Malefors, there. He does, indeed, have the remains-of a 58 CRL Super D500
convertible, with dealer-installed(apparently) "Texan" emblems on it.
He also had/has the remains-of another 58 CRL 2-dr HT Super D500, which he doesn't mention, in his post, on that thread.
...getting a little off-thread, discussing Super D500s, here, though.
Posted 2009-07-16 1:27 AM (#181527 - in reply to #181469) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Interesting story he had about that Regal getting crushed. Unfortunately, that was probably a more-common-than-not story for the Regal breed! When reading that web page, it occurred to me that there are probably several more Regals out there than the 20+ we counted. I saw an advertisement in Hemming's for one of the Regals recently that claimed there are 12 known survivors. I think we have found more than that without looking too hard.
It was also interesting to see a post from the person who bought the Barrett-Jackson Regal. It seems as though he is interested in finding out more about the car. I wonder if he knows his car is the one featured in the Collectible Automobile article? He must!
Posted 2009-07-20 11:41 AM (#181988 - in reply to #181987) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Good eyes, James:
Up for sale is a 1958 Dodge Custom Royal Regal Lancer. This is a two door hardtop model with approximately 102,000 original miles. This is a rare model in that it was only built in 1958 with a total production of only 1,163 units. I have owned three Regal Lancer's in the past and currently have two. I have a black and bronze model that I will be keeping and I have this white and bronze model that I am offering for sale.
I purchased this car last year from Indiana and had it transported back to Massachusetts. I believe it was restored about 4 or 5 years ago. The car has a new interior with factory correct seat upholstery and a reproduction padded vinyl dash. The door panels have been redone as well as the headliner. It looks like the car had replacement rocker panels installed and the trunk floor had areas repaired. The paint on the body shows nicely but there are flaws in the bronze color. I was told that a good buffing would make a great improvement. The tires are new wide whitewalls by B.F. Goodrich. The lancer spinner hubcaps are original and not reproduction. Most of chrome has been replated except parts of the front bumper and the vent window frames. All the glass is in very nice condition. The steering wheel is special to the Regal Lancer and shows some stress lines in the ivory section. The engine appears to be all original with no modifications. The engine is a 350 big block with 4 barrel carburation. The engine runs very well and doesn't smoke. The transmission is the 3 speed torqueflite and it shifts flawlessly. The dual exhaust is relatively new and sounds great. This particular Regal Lancer does't have many options outside the Regal trim package. It has power steering but no power brakes. I do have a power brake setup that can be sold separately. I also have the correct exhaust tips but they not installed on the car.
Here is info on the Regal Lancer model:
Trying to boost sales the Regal Lancer model was added in February of 1958 and was only available as a 2-door hardtop with special exterior colors and full surround side trim. Four color combinations where available; bronze with white trim, bronze with black trim, black with bronze trim, or white with bronze trim. It featured special nameplates (Regal Lancer) on the front fenders and heavy eyebrow trim. Inside, Regal Lancers got their own interior with unique bucket seat styling and door panels featuring molded armrests. A special Acousti-Foam headliner with chrome bows and chrome roof rails was a Regal Lancer exclusive, as was the bronze instrument panel with textured aluminum inserts. The standard engine offered for Regal Lancers was the 350 cubic inch displacement "Super Red Ram" V8. Optional engine choices were the 361 cubic inch displacement "D-500" and "Super D-500" iterations. Only 1,163 were produced during the model run in 1958 and making this one rare automobile. It has been discussed that maybe only 20 - 30 Regal Lancers exist today! A fine example of a bronze and black model sold last year at a Barrett-Jackson auction for $70,000.
If anyone would like to contact me regarding more information on this automobile I can be reached at this phone number: 508-867-3888
Auction info: Please do not bid on this automobile if you have no intentions of owning this car. Ebay bidders with less than 10 feedbacks or negative feedback should email me before placing any bids. I reserve the right to end this auction early since I have also placed an ad in Hemmings Motor News.
The high bidder is requested to send a $2,000 deposit within 48 hours of the end of auction. The car can be stored for a short period as agreed upon by new owner.
Good Luck and please email me if have any questions!
Posted 2009-07-20 12:00 PM (#181990 - in reply to #181988) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
It has some obvious kinks like the headliner and white seat (which might still be right), but this one is very nice! I have no idea what the reserve is. I would guess this is worth quite a bit. It looks as though he has a second one based on the photographs of the literature.
Posted 2009-07-20 12:09 PM (#181993 - in reply to #181990) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I wonder if this is the same one that was in Hemmings and on Craigslist recently...
Is it unusual to have the rear bumper guards without the front spuds?
Wow! This fellow owns three Regals! I think the black and bronze is the Richard's Regal discussed earlier.
Posted 2009-07-20 5:18 PM (#182016 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
The front, and/or the rear bumper guards ("vertical bars") were individual optional items on all 58 Dodges---you could get it/
them on a stripper 6-cylinder Club Coupe.
The front and the rear guards were both available as part of the "Bumper Appearance Group", which also included
an aluminum license plate 'insert'.
This car does NOT have that license plate insert, or, the front guards, so, it looks like it merely has the 'individual' option for the rear "vertical bars".
I am 'missing' something, here, though: how does it appear that this seller might own three Regals?
When I saw the pic of the advertising-stuff, above, I assumed (bad) that that pic might have been taken before "THIS" car
got RE-painted.
You're saying that the 'grody' car is another Regal, he owns?
Posted 2009-07-20 5:59 PM (#182018 - in reply to #182016) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Ah, you are correct - the description states "I have owned three Regals in the past and currently own two..." I assumed the one in the literature photo was the other.
I believe this is the person who bought the Kansas / Richards Regal D-500 (the only Bronze roof and fins over a Black body shown in this thread) from Colorado and transported it to the east coast.
I put in a bid of $5,000 - but I believe he is looking for $40,000 more to go with it.
Posted 2009-07-20 6:49 PM (#182026 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
The Regals get chromed headliner bows, right?
If so, then this car's eggshell headliner bows could be sold to some deserving soul, and the car's new owner could then buy
MoPar Mel's (proper-) chromed headliner bows, and install them, along with some sort of reasonable-facsimile bronze-
colored vinyl headliner material.
The black vinyl seat middle sections can be installed via any good local auto-upholstery shop.
Posted 2009-07-20 7:01 PM (#182028 - in reply to #182026) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
the piece-de-resistance would be the correct trunk mat! That is all stuff that I could easily live with - unlike a few of the modifications on the Frostbite.
Posted 2009-07-20 11:28 PM (#182065 - in reply to #182048) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Be careful, Steve. I saw a De Soto advertised locally and I figured - "well, I might as well go out and take a look - I'll never see another" - now I own it!
Catch me up to speed - what are the Branson festivities???
Posted 2009-07-21 5:42 PM (#182149 - in reply to #182066) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 4042 Location: Connecticut
The car being sold on ebay is Brian Huard's car. He also owns the black-over-copper factory D500 Regal mentioned earlier in the thread. He sold his first Regal a couple of years ago to Richard Carpenter.
Posted 2009-07-22 2:32 AM (#182212 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1155 Location: somerville mass
brian HUARD!?!?!? THAT WAS MY MOM'S MAIDEN NAME!!!! THERE ARENT THAT MANY HUARDS AROUND! PATRICIA LEA ROSE (CARR) FRANK RONALD
RING A BELL? darn this car is a fwd look lovers dream dripping with 50's
cool!!! i drool every time i see it on here..... ill cruise until the tires fall off
with a cigarette pack in my t shirt sleeve with my arm out the window!!!!
if its im the family.... well...... my moms family grew up in nh manchester and claremont
Posted 2009-07-22 11:35 PM (#182323 - in reply to #182308) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Placing an on-line auction on eBay sure generates a lot more "buzz" than a Hemmings ad or Craigslist. I don't know if this will sell Mr. Huard's car, but it sure seems to have gained some attention on this site. Maybe their fees are worth it after all? I think Clive and I are trading high (uh, well still pretty low) bids on this one. Just so you know, Clive - my latest lame bid was $16,019.58!
I would imagine the reserve is somewhere around $30,000...
Posted 2009-07-23 7:02 PM (#182404 - in reply to #182402) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Just a bit! Neil, have you seen any literature on whether that seat center section could be either black or white? I always thought black was the appropriate color, but I continue to learn.
Posted 2009-07-23 7:49 PM (#182410 - in reply to #182404) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
The middle area is "always" black, and "never" white......on OEM interiors.
I know: never-say-always, but, it only makes sense that a very-limited, unique sub-contracted upholsery set
would be made up in only one style-pattern, especially involving a car model that has only four versions of a particular
2-tone color scheme.
Here's something, too: beyond antenna(e), mirror(s), and D500 emblem, the Regals had NO other exterior trim options
available on their bodies, right?????
Posted 2009-07-23 11:26 PM (#182448 - in reply to #182410) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
There was a NOS driver seat back on eBay a while ago...
I don't know if you might consider the bumper guards "trim", but I think those were still optional on the Regals and whether or not they are there makes a difference in how the car looks. Other than what you mentioned, I can't think of anything else. I think the twin strut mirrors were standard on the Regals. Did Regals always come with spinners?
Posted 2009-07-24 4:54 PM (#182536 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Now, there's a couple/three good questions.
The bumper guards aren't on the body (my disclaimer), but, as far as having DUAL (dual-strut, at that) mirrors (and spinners)
as standard equipment.....I guess that we have to go back and look at all the factory (and this thread's) photos.
The spinners can be missing or replaced; their presence proves nothing, but it seems like the attractive 'vaned' wheel covers ought to have been standard on the Regals ( too), but maybe not.
I don't recall ever reading anything in the literature about the mirrors and/or the spinners being standard equipment on the Regals.
I didn't see that complete Regal NOS seat back, on Flea-pay.
It's my general belief that the seat upholstery was assembled inside the factory.
Think I'll ask about that, on one of the other message boards.
Posted 2009-07-24 6:46 PM (#182547 - in reply to #145242) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
It appears that your press release does show the dual dual-strut mirrors as standard for the Regals. The hubcaps, I don't know. Also, we ran into Aivar's car which may have had the spring special fin ornaments, perhapse even the license escutcheon as trim options???
Posted 2009-07-30 10:48 AM (#183232 - in reply to #182547) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I think Clive outbid me, but we were nowhere near the reserve, I'll bet. Either the market has really softned, or the auction just did not find the right eyes. I hope he will list it again! I think it is worth much more than $16,119.58!!!
Posted 2009-07-30 7:07 PM (#183288 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Well, I DO know one other body-item that would be optionally available on the Regals (in addition to the antennae,
and assuming that both rear view mirrors were STANDARD equipment) : the optional "Bumper Group" included
a stainless steel license plate insert.
The front and rear bumper 'Vertical Guards' were technically not a part of the cars' bodies, but, that license plate
insert certainly was!
BTW, Aivar's Regal is equipped with every option except that Bumper Group, and, the Super D500 engine option .
I thought that I had a copy of his Regal's IBM card, but, I'm not finding it, as far as that Spring Special fin-ornament
is concerned.
What do you suppose that the "Sweep Moldings" were? According to the Broadcast Sheets and IBM card copies, there
were supposedly MORE than just one style/type to them....I wonder if they referred to the "Saddle Trim" long-molding?
The length of the moldings would vary, with the 2 door and 4 door models, but, I've never yet seen that option recorded
on a B.-S., or IBM card copy.----that may be 'it', though. Gotta go find and check a "Saddle" car's IBM card copy...
BTW, I've never seen a B.-S., or IBM card, on a real S.-S. car, to see how their trim options are recorded on them, either.
There must be some 'special' coding for them, as the B.-S., and IBM-guy have no standard-coding for them.
The Regals all got a standard body-trim, so, the only coding to identify THEM is their unique Paint & Trim codes.
Posted 2009-07-31 12:45 AM (#183330 - in reply to #183288) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Neil, I always thought the sweep moulding was the last piece of stainless "check mark" just before the fin's upsweep. If that were the sweep moulding, no Regal would be equipped with it since the lower paint and trim area does not allow for it. I think the sweep moulding was optional on Coronets in 1958, but standard on Royals and Custom Royals.
Posted 2009-07-31 6:49 PM (#183404 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
That dippity-doo molding-guy was not an optional piece of trim, but a dedicated part of the CR model line
(just like the fluted quarter panel molding was, in 1957).
I agree, though, that 'Sweep Molding' is a good name for that piece of trim.
BTW, it's been a while since I got a nice piece of trim.
Posted 2009-08-01 2:05 PM (#183470 - in reply to #183404) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 322
I just spoke to Brian the guy that owns that Regal. He's looking for $22K for it. Not a perfect car but priced in the ballpark. His cell # is 508-317-7092
Jim
Posted 2009-09-09 12:20 AM (#188146 - in reply to #184156) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 148
has anyone ever seen a 59 regal lancer?? this thread sort of went dead and this has been on my mind the whole time . i ran across of picture of one years ago on an obscure website but i dont know if it is real or not.
Posted 2009-09-09 2:16 PM (#188203 - in reply to #188146) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 4042 Location: Connecticut
grant4405 - 2009-09-09 12:20 AM has anyone ever seen a 59 regal lancer?? this thread sort of went dead and this has been on my mind the whole time . i ran across of picture of one years ago on an obscure website but i dont know if it is real or not.
There were no Regal Lancers built in '59. The pics you saw were of a prototype, but that's as far as it got.
Posted 2009-09-09 3:22 PM (#188212 - in reply to #188203) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
...I was just thinking, about this car's having white vinyl center-seat areas be installed on it; that white-detail would
probably look good on the mostly-bronze, with white-accent, models, as it would carry over the white-accent into
the interior motif.
That's probably why this car's restorer decided to install the white panels, too: no real reason to have the black
OEM seat sections, in a white/bronze car .
Posted 2009-09-09 11:36 PM (#188265 - in reply to #188244) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
The Godshall article in Collectible Automobile (Vol. 10, No. 2 8/93) showed a picture of the '59 Regal concept.
"Although a Regal Lancer was designed and okayed for 1959, it was canceled in April 1958 when Chrysler began writing in red ink. It would have looked like the car seen here, with a unique bodyside molding and insert, decklid molding, roof trim, rear deck medallion, roof and deck windsplit molding, and hood and decklid paint break molding, plus assorted nameplates. It was also slated to get the swivel seats."
In the pictures, it looked like a tri-tone light blue, dark blue, and white. It had a very unusual paint break with the main body in light blue, the roof and outside part of the fins in white, and the inboard side of the fins in dark blue. Also, the picture had the standard wheelcovers, not the spinners! If a person had unlimited resources, it would be a lot of fun to recreate that one! I didn't see any pictures of the interior.
Posted 2009-09-10 12:27 AM (#188271 - in reply to #188267) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Heck Doc, join the fun! This is EASILY the best thread on the forums! Neil has a little teaser of that parts list way back on page 402! We are all just waiting for the next Regal to show up. I am really hoping that we get to see a picture of Brian's black Regal when it gets restored. Unfortunately, I don't think Brian posts on the forwardlook site On the other hand, Pat posts here and we may get to see the progress on his eggshell Regal again one day.
Doc, if you can give us the complete parts list - you can one-up our man in Bishop.
Posted 2009-09-10 12:56 AM (#188273 - in reply to #188271) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Got a question -
We know the fin spears on a Regal are supposed to be silver. We know the shield on the spear is supposed to have a black background. What color are the shield and the knight's head supposed to be? I couldn't get a clear answer by looking back through the pictures! Aivar's look all silver. Others are gold annodized.
Posted 2009-09-10 1:16 AM (#188276 - in reply to #188273) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: Parts Unknown
This $#@! book is a bugger to copy stuff out of. Big and cumbersome, it really doesn't sit open nicely on my lap so I can read and type .... aaaarrgghhh !
So, ... It is Dodge bulletin No. 144. Issue date: 11 April, 1958
"Parts peculiar to 1958 Dodge "Regal Lancer""
Four pages of stuff.
Says here the "ash receiver" was special to RL's !
List is too long to rewrite the whole thing, but I can answer questions ....
Also have the Dodge Taxi special parts bulletin and the same for the Silver Special Plymouth. All three say they include photos, but I do not have these.
Posted 2009-09-10 3:03 PM (#188336 - in reply to #188276) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Mike, the outer edge of the shield emblem's border is the usual/typical bright silver anodization; the
face area is black, and the knight's head is the usual/typical gold anodization.
I gotta go look up the ash-receiver's being a unique part----
YEP; over on pg-6 of this thread I had posted the complete listing of the unique Regal
Lancer parts, and there it is : "ash receiver, # 1830 242".
In/on various pics on this thread the front and/or the rear ash receiver(s) is/are seen.
The rear ashtray is identical to all the other 57/58 guys.
The front ashtray differs only in its COLOR (bronze).
As the front ashtray is removable, a pre-painted piece must have been available, which kind-of
makes sense, in that a customer needing (how/why???) a replacement front ash receiver
could get one all ready to install in his car, because the special bronze paint was probably a special
short-production-item, which only required 1-run of the bronze painting work, on the dash panels/pieces.
However, I'm certain (but haven't verified) that any OTHER front ash receiver would have to be
painted, in order to match the color of the dash-middle (i.e.: ivory/black/blue/green/gold), and that the
parts warehouse could not(???) have maintained a 'similar' supply of pre-painted ash receivers, in stock???
I mean, what % of all 57-58 Dodges ever required the replacement of the front ashtray?
Posted 2009-09-10 4:39 PM (#188348 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Steve, in THIS economy, $20Large might just be too much money for a lot of people to want to pay for this car.
If you were interested in buying this/any car, wouldn't you want to know how well and correctly it was 'restored' ?
In my car's case (10/80), it took a couple years for the lower area bondo-coverup to begin having the underlying rust-out
begin to leach into/thru the 'body-work'.
I would have appreciated someone's having advised me on the car's visible red-flags (like a horrible undercarriage, but XLNT-
looking body) that I wasn't consciously aware-of, when I bought the car sight-unseen (kind of like: Evilpay, today) out
of the Chi-Town/Gary IN area (another red-flag!)
Posted 2009-09-11 3:32 PM (#188509 - in reply to #188429) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Here is another Regal I saw on a Cadillac forum. With the Regal (unknown on these pages, I think) there were several photographs of other neat forwardlookers.
Posted 2009-09-11 4:17 PM (#188513 - in reply to #188336) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
d500neil - 2009-09-10 1:03 PM
Mike, the outer edge of the shield emblem's border is the usual/typical bright silver anodization; the
face area is black, and the knight's head is the usual/typical gold anodization.
Thanks Neil. In looking at various examples shown in these pages, I have noted that some have
silver border / silver head
silver border / gold head
gold border / gold head (most common)
I have not seen a gold border / silver head combination. Also, and I think we have discussed this, the block and script Dodge letters are typically chrome pot metal, which is unusual for a variation of the Custom Royal model. The Custom Royals came with gold annodized aluminum block & script.
Posted 2009-09-11 11:11 PM (#188550 - in reply to #188514) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
d500neil - 2009-09-11 4:30 PM
And, you know? I'm starting to favor the bronze-with-white-trim scheme!
Thanks, Neil! That is a very good picture of that combo. The most interesting thing is that is has the front fender antenna like mine. This is definitely a previously unknown (or at least unposted) to this forum Regal Lancer. Keep those pictures coming, the list is growing.
Posted 2009-09-12 12:50 AM (#188561 - in reply to #188550) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Jeez! Vedder gets credit for everything around here! Pat, those are the only pictures he posted of Regals. At a casual glance, I thought he took two pictures of one Regal. The spuds and the black paint on that first picture set me straight though!
I have yet to see a picture of a fully restored 5ASA. I will reserve my pick for favorite color scheme until then.
Posted 2009-09-13 12:09 AM (#188664 - in reply to #188601) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: Parts Unknown
Neil ~
Kick my cage about a year after the new shop is built and I should have the mountain of boxes in storage resorted and organized in the new place. I have shoeboxes of vin and data tag sets from many of the cars I parted and interesting ones doomed to wrecking yards I frequented. Right now, I could not find it if I wanted to !
Posted 2009-09-14 2:12 PM (#188837 - in reply to #188664) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
That "bronze regal 1" photograph must be of Randy Guyer's Regal (formerly Ruffalo's - and the same as shown in Collectible Automobile).
It looks different from the one restored by MoPar Mel as shown on his website (no spuds, for starters). I wonder if these are one and the same or if the one restored by Mel went to Massachusetts?
Posted 2009-10-02 6:19 PM (#190989 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
This latest piece of trivia will be of no interest, except to far-distant FWDLK researchers, and present day Regal-nerds,
but, as part of some research into the Regal Lancers, today, I have developed the following theory, about some options-coding
on the Regal Lancers, to wit:
NO Regal Lancers will have Paint/Trim plate codings for the following Option Groups: Safety, Appearance, and/or Deluxe Appearance,
because the UNIQUE Regal-specific padded sun-visors (which are otherwise included within the Safety Group) and the 2-tone steering
wheel (which is/are otherwise included within the two 'Appearance' Groups) are STANDARD equipment on the Regals, and are not,
otherwise optionally-available on any 'lesser' Dodge model.
Any of the other individual "Safety", "Appearance" and/or "Deluxe Appearance" group-items will have to be individually accounted for,
on the Broadcast Sheets and/or on the IBM Build Card copies.
Now, where to FIND those option codings, on the P/T plates, is still a State Secret, but, the above information confirms why some
Regal Lancer's P/T plates might appear to indicate that 'the' car might be less-than-heavily optioned. The B.-Sheets and IBM cards
WILL/can confirm, to the contrary.
Posted 2010-03-16 4:21 PM (#214183 - in reply to #190989) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I found this in Hemmings Motor News this month and it referenced the website. I believe the price was listed at $45,000 - which doesn't seem bad if this is a real Super D-500 car. It looks quite a bit like the Ruffalo car, but obviously different.
Posted 2010-03-16 4:59 PM (#214193 - in reply to #214183) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
it appears from the picture that the rear package shelf cover is missing and one of the headliner bow covers is down. Although difficult to see, some of the hardboard headliner may be missing. From those clues, I am guessing that the interior is not as nice as the exterior.
Posted 2010-03-16 6:16 PM (#214204 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Sean Machado has previously confirmed that the blue 1960 Polara is not a real D500, as is listed on the seller's
website.
The Regal's P/T plate will confirm its D500 status.
It's got a replaced fuel line on it; too bad we can't see its passengers side exhaust manifold. The heater doesn't appear to
be working, but, those carbs have been installed on it for a while.
$45K seems to be a bit pricey, although the car might be a real single-4 D500.
Posted 2010-03-17 11:35 PM (#214462 - in reply to #214204) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
So is this one we have seen before in this thread, or a new one to this thread? I think it might be new. This would bring the total up to almost 30 cars accounted for recently. Amazing! To me, it seems that most of these have been bronze with black accents as this one is. It would be great to see the data plate for this one. Neil, are you going to send them a request?
Posted 2010-03-18 11:51 PM (#214618 - in reply to #145237) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 211 Location: Iowa
Wow, what I car! I can't say I recall ever having seen a Regal Lancer. They are both beautiful, the stock one as well as the customized one, each in their own way. I am with the one poster who said it is his favorite FL car.....mine too, now!
Posted 2010-04-23 11:21 PM (#219947 - in reply to #219746) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I noticed that the current owner, who I think is a site member, is not asking for a profit. This is a spectacular car - but you are right Neil, not only not original (which doesn't bother me too much) but not fully correct either. I had an opportunity to switch those shields when I rode up on stage in the car at Barrett-Jackson in 2008, but alas - modesty forbid it! Ah, but for a pair of needle-nose pliers and a small tin snip - the job would have been done!
I really should call this the Hallaran / Alexander car, since they owned it when it appeared in Collectible Automobile (cover car, no less)
Posted 2010-04-25 12:03 AM (#220124 - in reply to #219953) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Yeah, I noticed that too Oh, well - we have seen a lot worse in these for sale photos - remember that Imperial convertible? Pop cans, dirty diapers, chewing gum wrapers, 1979 Sears catalog, cassette tapes... $150,000 to start. Just out of respect for how much money that is, I would have shampoo'd the carpets and armor-all'd all the interior surfaces! A few pine needles I can handle.
Posted 2010-06-10 8:17 PM (#227346 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 194 Location: Utah
I found one of these, although I haven't actually seen it yet. Supposedly it has under 70k miles but some rust. What is a reasonable price to pay for a fixer-upper. It is running.
Posted 2010-06-11 7:40 AM (#227407 - in reply to #227346) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 3480 Location: Montreal, Canada
circlerounder - 2010-06-10 8:17 PM
I found one of these, although I haven't actually seen it yet. Supposedly it has under 70k miles but some rust. What is a reasonable price to pay for a fixer-upper. It is running.
I have no idea about what it could be worth, but I sure hope for you that this can work out. These Regal Lancer are extraordinary cars!
Posted 2010-06-12 5:28 PM (#227577 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Mark, what you pay for the car, in addition to its physical condition, depends upon what the seller THINKS that he has.
"Some" rust means a LOT of rust, and Regals are not cheap to restore.
Also, what you pay for the car depends upon how well you want to restore it, and what you want to DO with the
car, once you're done with it.
If you intend to keep and enjoy its ownership over many years, its purchase price is almost irrelevant, because the
car's value will continue to appreciate over the years.
If you want to do a quickie, or a Hot Rod job and/or to turn the car, to try to realize a profit on your investment, that's
a business decision that only you can make.
Posted 2010-06-13 2:41 PM (#227682 - in reply to #227577) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 194 Location: Utah
d500neil - 2010-06-12 3:28 PM
Mark, what you pay for the car, in addition to its physical condition, depends upon what the seller THINKS that he has.
"Some" rust means a LOT of rust, and Regals are not cheap to restore.
Also, what you pay for the car depends upon how well you want to restore it, and what you want to DO with the
car, once you're done with it.
If you intend to keep and enjoy its ownership over many years, its purchase price is almost irrelevant, because the
car's value will continue to appreciate over the years.
If you want to do a quickie, or a Hot Rod job and/or to turn the car, to try to realize a profit on your investment, that's
a business decision that only you can make.
Good luck on getting it, though!
Neil, thanks for your help. I fell in love with the Ruffalo car and especially the colors. Unfortunately the one I've found has the other color scheme cream and copper. As for value, I agree and disagree. For years one could pick up a decent 67 chevelle for around $3500. Now the same car runs $15k and up. So in this scenario the price is dictated by the market. I am looking for information on what the market says it is worth, and especially what you-all think it is worth since there really isn't much information out there.... at least that I can find. Most likely I won't pick it up since I have too many projects already, however I wouldn't want to overpay should I decide to make the leap. Thanks! Mark
Posted 2010-06-13 5:47 PM (#227710 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Well, Mark, the restoration-purchase market is soft, compared to the 90's, when there was a feeding frenzy
regarding a nice quick turn-around on a so-so condition resto job, that happened to look nice as it was pushed
across the auction block, where a lot of times there were eager foreign buyers for 50's Mopes.
Remember the Japanese buyers, who have completely disappeared, along with their commercial real estate
purchases, and, their country's economy?
Posted 2010-06-15 2:58 PM (#227973 - in reply to #227710) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Hi, Mark -
I would love to see pictures, if you can get them. I would guess that you would pay anywhere from $5,000 to $15,000 for a running, driving Regal in need of "restoration."
Posted 2010-08-11 2:06 PM (#236496 - in reply to #236443) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
It is amazing all that has happened since the thread started with Frostbite: he started out asking $29,500 for that car and now you can get a very decent Super D-500 Regal for about the same price! How the mighty have fallen!
I thought the Frostbite might have sold - for less than that first asking price went. However, I never heard who bought it or what happened to it.
Posted 2010-08-12 4:28 AM (#236594 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
New User
Posts: 1
Neil, I don't think whoever built this particular model was trying to build a Regal. It does appear that they were trying to build a car exactly like the "tribute" car. Yes, the red or coral shields are peculiar - otherwise it seems to be a match.
Posted 2010-08-12 11:22 AM (#236618 - in reply to #236594) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
filerecovery - 2010-08-12 2:28 AM
Neil, I don't think whoever built this particular model was trying to build a Regal. It does appear that they were trying to build a car exactly like the "tribute" car. Yes, the red or coral shields are peculiar - otherwise it seems to be a match.
I haven't really examined all the photos yet, but the radio delete plate is very interesting as well as the lack of a shield and lance on the glove box door (same as Ruffalo's - heck, maybe they all came that way). That is a signature element of the Custom Royal series - I wonder what the Regals didn't get them? It is just the plain old Royal glove box door. Maybe they drew the line at a lil' tiny black shield and silver lance.
Interesting - standard wheelcovers on his too. This is very interesting. This example certainly looks "lived in". I love it!
Posted 2010-08-26 3:00 PM (#238459 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I should know this, but too lazy to look 'it' up, but shouldn't the dash bezels be 'copper' colored???
Mike, there's no evidence of a filled-in fender-antenna hole, but, this car is supposed to have a radio.
An eccentric original owner---didn't like the OEM 2-tone; that's eccentric, and he didn't care for having a radio
be installed in the car, either, in CA, where there were a lot of radio stations (I think).
Posted 2010-09-02 12:29 AM (#239358 - in reply to #238914) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
very interesting Regal! Some of the sales literature said they were supposed to have bronze colored inserts where the textured aluminum inserts go around the dash and in the glove box door, but I don't think that ever made it into production. Aivar's does not have the bronze colored inserts and his is one of the earliest. I have not seen them on any car. The dash and glove box are just like the Royal.
Posted 2010-09-13 4:02 PM (#241256 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Got a PM from a man who is contemplating buying a D500 (as confirmed from the P/T plate info he sent to me)
black/copper Regal; dunno if it's one that we've seen here, before, but, it might be a new addition to the 'family'!
Not too many black/copper D500's still known to exist.
Posted 2010-09-15 11:17 PM (#241622 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1207 Location: Ponder, TX
I was considering purchasing the Missouri car for my wife, as her first car was a black/bronze single 4-bbl Regal Lancer that her dad bought for her about 1967.
We decided not to buy it because in my opinion it needed too many things to bring it back to stock. The car was built as a single 4-bbl, with A/C, but it's been converted to duals, and the A/C has been removed. The photos suggest that the paint job is not restoration quality, and a unique piece of stainless trim is missing.
Unless I did most of the work, the restoration bill would have put the investment too far beyond the value of the car, and most of my time is already committed to my '56 Belvedere project.
Posted 2010-09-16 3:02 PM (#241664 - in reply to #241622) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Aha! And if I would have made myself more conspicuous at the Colorado MoPar show, I could have got the inside scoop! Gary, do you mind me asking what the asking price for this car was?
Posted 2010-09-16 7:55 PM (#241689 - in reply to #241664) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1207 Location: Ponder, TX
Lancer Mike - 2010-09-16 2:02 PM
Aha! And if I would have made myself more conspicuous at the Colorado MoPar show, I could have got the inside scoop! Gary, do you mind me asking what the asking price for this car was?
Posted 2011-02-08 12:41 PM (#260160 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
would a regal lancer come without any options, such as pw, ps, bumper teeth, exhaust tips, license plate insert,glovebox emblem, also does anyone know what is the rarest colour scheme? the one ive seen is copper over black,
Posted 2011-02-15 7:04 PM (#261164 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
on the front and rear seat there are rectangle pieces that look chrome, does anyone know if they are seperate to the seat cover or embossed on the cover?
Posted 2011-02-15 7:57 PM (#261172 - in reply to #260160) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Hi, Paul:
This thread has been going for awhile. I think we discussed some of the Regal options once. I think Regals may have had optional bumper spuds, rear guards, power seat, power windows, and license plate insert. Probably power steering, power brakes, radio, and heater were options too - but gosh, that would be rare. Exhaust tips should be standard and no glove box emblem (strange).
It seems the rarest surviving color scheme would be a black car with copper fins.
Posted 2011-02-15 8:26 PM (#261174 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Yes, those rectangular seat 'buttons' are separate pieces; over on page-4 of this thread you'll see a good view of a seat
showing how those 'buttons' were attached to it.
Posted 2011-02-16 3:00 PM (#261276 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
ok thanks,bit reluctant to buy this one at first as not got correct headliner or seats, but neil checked out data tag for me and came back ok, looks like it has power steering and brakes, rear speaker and dual antennas, tinted glass including windsheild, will know more when i get it back to uk, gary goers replied back to me he can do the seat covers but not till later in year, door panels may tidy up yet with a bit of material? dont know about seat foam yet?
as for headliner need a 58 for pattern, it has a 57 in a moment with cream division bars
350 motor out of car at moment, looks like it needs a rebuild.
Posted 2011-02-16 4:07 PM (#261281 - in reply to #261276) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Paul, MoPar Mel sells the correct chrome-style headliner bows for your car ( I believe--not cheap, but the only correct like-new
ones that are available).
As I mentioned, you can approximate the "Accousta-Foam" headliner by having your local upholstery shop custom install
a large piece(s) of the seat vinyl material (available from SMS) into the 'roof'.
You can have your shop stitch together the sheet vinyl so that the seams are hidden by the headliner bows, and, there should be
some sort of thin padding, like fiberglass, installed between the roof and the headliner vinyl.
BTW, those 57-58 cream-colored headliner bows ARE valuable, so protect them.
Gary Goers may well be an excellent option for the creation of the Regal Lancer seats, as long as Gary knows precisely how they
should be constructed, and, I think that he has made-up those seats, before.
Otherwise, I am a firm believer in a local auto upholstery shop's ability to follow the existing patterns of a car's upholstery, so
that they can be allowed to custom-fit the(ir) upholstery to your seat frames and to the(ir) seat foam padding.
The Regals DO have a very slight raising-up of their seat bolsters (vinyl) so as to approximate the look and feel of bucket
seats.
I've personally known Gary since the early 80's and have a lot of respect for his work and his products, and, he is a no-
brainer about creating Chrysler 300 interiors, but, I'd sure feel better about having a local upholstery shop make up MY Regal
Lancer's seats, or, at least, would want to see some examples of Gary's Regal lancer seat work.
You'll need to contact SMS, at any rate, regarding obtaining the fluted upper door trim vinyl material, and, maybe-probably,
having SMS create the custom-fluted white door/trim panel material---which your upholstery shop can, then, stitch together for you,
along with the black tufted cut-pile carpeting.
Your upholstery shop can procure that 'rough' carpeting in the UK, and then custom stitch-it-together in their shop.
The carpeting is not 'molded', but, rather, is merely cut-and-stitched, and I have a complete carpet remnant at home, and can
show anyone what the carpeting looks like and how it is cut-and-sewn together, to fit over the transmission hump.
Posted 2011-02-16 5:28 PM (#261292 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
hi neil,
dont think there is anyone in the uk that is interested in upholstery work like this, if there was it would be around $4000 plus material, i had this problem with the last one i did and ended up selling without seats done even though i had bought all the material from sms, could not find anyone to do it without patterns,found a guy who said he would do it for $2000 from photos i had, then kept changing the date so gave up on him in end, i did try myself on the rear seat but was not happy with the outcome.
i bought the headliner from mel for that the bows were just covered in gold tape which i removed and painted same colour as headliner surround, dont know if they are any better now though?
gary said he had done 4 sets upto now?
heres the link to my last one said i would never do another
Posted 2011-02-16 6:06 PM (#261298 - in reply to #261292) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Unfortunately, that result is what can happen if a shop tries to install a pre-made upholstery set.
If Gary's done four previous sets, that's an excellent recommendation.
See if he can provide you with the foam padding, too, as well as the side trim panels(??).
You can send out your headliner bows for 'chrome'-flash plating, I think.
At any rate, the headliner bows are supposed to be in chrome finish.
Also, when you are done installing your new, very-expensive, interior you might think about having
your shop custom-install clear plastic covers over it.
It's very easy to say to yourself : "self, I'm gonna be real careful about letting anyone get into/outa
this car", but, once someone gets into it, with anything sticking out of his rear pocket, or having Levi's
rivets (been there; done that), gouging the plastic, only, you'll be real glad that that plastic is there!
And, then, there's the unavoidable wear-and-tear/soiling of the unprotected upholstery...
Posted 2011-05-27 5:15 PM (#274242 - in reply to #273345) Subject: RE: arrived in uk
Location: The Mile High City
Fantastic, Paul! Congratulations! In all the photographs of surviving Regals I have ever seen, your car's color pattern is unique. If I had a Regal to restore, this is the combination I would choose.
Kansas - Colorado - Massachusetts - Blackpool!
Now it appears that we will have to get the exhaust deflector project going. Of any suviving '58 Dodge out there, this one deserves a set! Did it come with the engine included?
Posted 2011-05-27 5:31 PM (#274245 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I've decided; THIS is the rarest color combination for the Regal Lancers.
Mad dogs & Englishmen restore Regal Lancers X-000 miles from 'home' !
But, at least all of the hard-parts are included.
Be aware that the 'Shield' emblems on the fins do have black face panels, and that the 'Spear' emblems
are finished in Chrome. The Regals were the only models to have these finishes on them.
Also, the 1958 spinner wheel covers are painted with black semi-gloss/satin finish around the middle area of their stainless
steel outer 'pieces'.
You can have 24K gold plating be applied to the chromed spinner Knight's heads to replicate the OEM gold lacquer
finish that was applied to them. The gold plating is 'permanent' and looks really good.
AND, good news here: you can buy any-olde left fender side molding and have it be custom cut/fitted to
mate with the front-molding-end-piece.
I say any-olde because you'll have to have that molding be de-dinged and polished, along with the other
stainless trim moldings on the car, so, no use in paying big-Quid for a perfect/NOS side molding.
Posted 2011-05-27 5:49 PM (#274247 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Now that we've recorded your car's final-current destination, on this board, you should start you own Member's Rides thread
and we can cross-reference the resto-thread of your car TO this message board, and vice versa.
Posted 2011-06-03 3:21 PM (#275266 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
car now in garage (in a christine pose) i will start stripping it in next couple of months so will start a restoration thread,previous owner removed engine to rebuild, heads etc are in trunk, the engine block is still sat in kansas as transport company would not take it, should be getting collected today and on its way to docks in florida, as previosly said headliner and most of interior is shot, the trim thats missing is inside car, dual anntenas only one made it here?owner said both in trunk but only one here when it arrived?
car been on sale since sept 2010, saw it in hemmings in febuary and took a chance it was still for sale, neil checked out the data plate for me and i bought it over the phone off the pictures
Posted 2011-06-29 2:30 PM (#278500 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I just 'found' another Regal, in IL.
It's white/bronze and is about a year from being fully frame-off restored.
The restorer is a semi-commercial gentlemen; I've asked him to join the website and to post up pics/info on his cars,
which include the 58 Coronet D500, over on the Craigslist board, now, and a 57 Fireflite(?) with twin carbs.
Posted 2012-03-07 12:14 PM (#311134 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
talking of D500 would it be wrong to install a dual carb setup on a car that was a single 4 barrel originaly, reason is i have this setup but in 2 minds whether or not to install it,the only thing i have not got is the right hand exhaust manifold?
Posted 2012-03-07 12:25 PM (#311141 - in reply to #311134) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
It's your decision; technically, the 58-59 dual carb models have unique passenger's side exhaust manifolds which have cast-in heat-riser tube bosses
on them, so, that is one thing that most clones don't have on them.
And, the P/T plates confirm whether a car is a real/Super D500 or not.
Posted 2012-03-11 10:56 PM (#311745 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
I don''t think its wrong. My Regal isn't even a D500 and if I ever locate all the pieces to install the dual quad I'm going for it. Not because I want to misrepresent the car but because I think it looks so darn good when you raise the hood (bonnet). Here's a shot of the port side of the Super D500 pass side manifold. the heat riser tube passes right through in front of the exhaust port. I've heard that a standard manifold can be modified with a welded on boss drilled to accept the tube, but I've never seen one done. If anyone out there has done this, please chime in. The genuine manifolds are very rare and pricey.
Posted 2012-04-02 6:28 PM (#315055 - in reply to #311951) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer and a 60 polara d500 conv too!!!!
Location: The Mile High City
I think Mopar Doc's Regal has been for sale for a while now. It looks nice.
As far as converting a Regal from a Ram Fire or a D-500 to a Golden Commando 350 or a Super?
It is all up to what the owner enjoys. The data tag and engine stamps tell all anyway.
Posted 2012-04-24 11:56 PM (#318287 - in reply to #318285) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer and a 60 polara d500 conv too!!!!
Location: The Mile High City
Nick, if you are still watching this thread, you should call up the Wollenweber fellow and buy some prints! You could hang any one of these in the living room! That guy knows how to take a photograph!
Posted 2012-05-04 5:04 PM (#319635 - in reply to #318285) Subject: RE: More Regal Pictures
Location: The Mile High City
Geez! No comments on those cool Wollenweber photos? Well, I did receive this photograph earlier this week. I think Neil has an older photograph of this car. I sent a bit of correspondence to the owner and he sent me this photo. I tried to get him to join the thread, but I don't think he is into computers. It is fun to see all three colors on one car.
Posted 2012-05-04 6:54 PM (#319654 - in reply to #319653) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Good question----looks like a simple mask-off, there; fairly clear image in the 2nd photo.
That front-of-fin trim ornament must be different, in 1958, from 1957, since the 57 version
would have a tab on it for the insertion of the thin, inboard, stainless steel fin molding (which
tab the 58 would not need to have on it, since the 58 does not have that inboard molding on
it).
Posted 2012-05-04 8:24 PM (#319672 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
Neil,
the mouldings will interchange 58 model has a short trim that goes to rear window, to break up the 2 tone on the rear, 57 moulding does have a extra locating pin but can be broken of to use on a 58,
Posted 2012-05-04 10:45 PM (#319707 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I just scanned thru 9 thread pages, and the only pic I could find that shows the inboard shortie-molding is this one.
It would also be used on the 'Deluxe' 2-tone models (where the roof, fins & deck lid got the second color), but I wonder if
this guy was used on the single color, or the Saddle 2-tone schemes, where this molding would not be needed???
can someone post up a couple good views of this molding, and how it connects the fin area to the back glass area?
Posted 2012-05-05 12:10 PM (#319751 - in reply to #319707) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2996 Location: Sept. 1958
d500neil - 2012-05-04 10:45 PM
I just scanned thru 9 thread pages, and the only pic I could find that shows the inboard shortie-molding is this one.
It would also be used on the 'Deluxe' 2-tone models (where the roof, fins & deck lid got the second color), but I wonder if
this guy was used on the single color, or the Saddle 2-tone schemes, where this molding would not be needed???
can someone post up a couple good views of this molding, and how it connects the fin area to the back glass area?
They all had one. My convt has one a bit shorter there.
Posted 2012-05-05 10:46 PM (#319821 - in reply to #319751) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Yep, I agree - that shortie was universal on the '58 Dodge, with variants for the different body styles.
It just ends at the stainless bottom-of-rear-window molding.
Posted 2012-06-20 8:59 AM (#326309 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
Does anyone know if the bronze dash inserts made it into production, i have just taken apart the dash and the where the inserts have been covered with the chrome surround and also the glove box latch, the aluminium trim is bronze colour?
Posted 2012-06-20 9:08 PM (#326409 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Paul,
As far as I know the anodizing was silver and there was a light bronze or copper color in the dimples. The same coloring was done in the valleys in the center of the chrome horn ring. If you clean it gently it might come back to life. I was too aggressive and rubbed it off. Now I have to figure out how to restore it. Spray on color and wipe off?
Posted 2012-06-25 10:30 PM (#327149 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Very interesting Paul. I've never seen a dash insert done that way. Surely the color under the chrome trim surround indicates it was born with that color. Your build date is slightly over a month into production so I don't think the build date affects this feature. I've seen earlier and later that are only silver. Maybe the original buyer insisted that the dash match the brochure? Special order?
Posted 2012-08-17 1:23 PM (#334998 - in reply to #327149) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Fantastic, Paul:
Whatever finish they used on the aluminum must have been very delicate.
If every Regal had it, a rag and cleaner must have taken it right off!
It is rarely seen on any restored Regals today!
Posted 2012-08-17 1:28 PM (#334999 - in reply to #326443) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
d500neil - 2012-06-20 10:54 PM
Mike, what do you mean by "variants" in that shortie molding?
There were different types/styles of the shortie moldings????
"variants" in length. 2 door Lancers with shorties, 4-door Lancers with a shortie to get to the end of the door and a micro mini for the remainder, etc.
Posted 2012-09-07 1:54 PM (#337905 - in reply to #334999) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Since the Chrysler 300 Nationals will be in Golden, Colorado this month, I was thumbing through some of the pictorals from previous meets and found this image, which confirms a earlier photo as a Regal. This is the only one I have ever seen with the Spring Special fin caps and escutcheon, which is a good looking combo for any 1958 Dodge!
Posted 2012-09-07 4:15 PM (#337916 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Going back up a couple postings, it certainly looks like Paul's dash inserts received some sort of Bronze
paint-like finishing, around its perimeter.
Looking at the 'bronze' paint effect, it looks like the dash insert may have been masked-off, to prevent
that Bronze from getting onto its main body.
Note the faded over-spray on the side of it, and the sharp/heavy masking-tape outline on its lower
area.
The over-spray is the most compelling evidence that the entire surface had not been OEM painted in Bronze;
there is no sign that the Bronze has been worn away, or otherwise removed from the body of the insert(s).
So, it appears that the inserts may have been masked off, but, the question becomes: WHY were/did they
have to be masked off?
The only(?) logical reason for their having been masked off was due to the inserts having been installed
into the dash, when it was painted----but, what about the bezels? The bezels would have had to have been
installed after the dash was painted.
Why would it have been necessary to "pre-install" the Standard-1958-Model inserts when the dash was painted?
One answer might be that their installation was some kind of assembly-procedural mistake, but, somebody went
to the trouble to PARTIALLY mask it/them off, rather than to remove one/both of them, right before the dash
was painted?
PAUL: is/are the areas of the dash, behind-where the inserts are installed, painted, or not?
If those areas are painted Bronze, then the inserts would have been masked off (and over-sprayed!),
separately from the dash----and, the mystery continues.
On Page-6 of this thread is a factory listing of all of the unique Regal Lancer parts; the dash inserts (in "Bronze")
are NOT included in the listing, so, as far as production models are concerned, the Regals got the standard
1958 Dodge 'silver' anodized dash inserts on them.
Posted 2012-09-07 4:28 PM (#337917 - in reply to #154864) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Interesting! The only images of the rear end of Aivar's car I have seen are those Gary shot in his video.
As I remember, Aivar's car was one of the initial Regals produced - for the "show car" circuit - sometime in January?
I am not sure when the first Spring Specials were produced, but it must have been shortly thereafter.
I wonder if Joe has this "Newport" Regal in his registery?
Posted 2012-09-07 4:51 PM (#337920 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
OK; this is from Page-5 of this thread:
BUMMERLY, I could not find the official Regal Lancer release-date in them; even the R.L. PRESS KIT that I have
does not mention any Release Date.
A clue, however, will be the photo caption that says : "...This Custom Royal (not correctly identified, even,
in-house !) has been on display in the Utica NY railroad station since the first of the year. ..."
Another Release-Date clue is found on the Regal Lancer "Announcement" fold-out brochure, which has
an issue date of 1/58.
It, and the other Regals appearing in the Dodge Reporter, are the gold-body, with white trim----apparently
this scheme may have been the preferred scheme (or not; maybe they just happened to be on-hand, then,
or, they were the first colors produced).
Unfortunately, there is no mention of any display of a Regal Lancer in the Florida area, in the Dodge Reporters.
But, their introduction appears to have been on or around 1/1/58 .
Another interesting factoid, from the Press Kit, is that "officially" (when the Press Kit's information was
being printed-up), the Fuel Injection D500 engine may still have been technically available, or else, the
factory just wanted to add on a few more words, about the optional performance engines.
If you'll recall, at least one 1960 4-speed 300 was built, due to the factory's advertising that it WAS
available, and the unhappy prospective buyer threatened to sue, if he was not permitted to BUY one !!
Too bad such a dedicated Fuelie-loving 58 Dodge owner didn't exist.
Posted 2012-09-07 5:22 PM (#337925 - in reply to #337916) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
d500neil - 2012-09-07 9:15 PM
Going back up a couple postings, it certainly looks like Paul's dash inserts received some sort of Bronze
paint-like finishing, around its perimeter.
Looking at the 'bronze' paint effect, it looks like the dash insert may have been masked-off, to prevent
that Bronze from getting onto its main body.
Note the faded over-spray on the side of it, and the sharp/heavy masking-tape outline on its lower
area.
The over-spray is the most compelling evidence that the entire surface had not been OEM painted in Bronze;
there is no sign that the Bronze has been worn away, or otherwise removed from the body of the insert(s).
So, it appears that the inserts may have been masked off, but, the question becomes: WHY were/did they
have to be masked off?
The only(?) logical reason for their having been masked off was due to the inserts having been installed
into the dash, when it was painted----but, what about the bezels? The bezels would have had to have been
installed after the dash was painted.
Why would it have been necessary to "pre-install" the Standard-1958-Model inserts when the dash was painted?
One answer might be that their installation was some kind of assembly-procedural mistake, but, somebody went
to the trouble to PARTIALLY mask it/them off, rather than to remove one/both of them, right before the dash
was painted?
PAUL: is/are the areas of the dash, behind-where the inserts are installed, painted, or not?
If those areas are painted Bronze, then the inserts would have been masked off (and over-sprayed!),
separately from the dash----and, the mystery continues.
On Page-6 of this thread is a factory listing of all of the unique Regal Lancer parts; the dash inserts (in "Bronze")
are NOT included in the listing, so, as far as production models are concerned, the Regals got the standard
1958 Dodge 'silver' anodized dash inserts on them.
Neil,
the full dash is painted , when i first removed the insert the gold colour was all the way around it does look like a masked line but that is just where the chrome finisher covers the insert i started to clean it off at first thinking it was tarnished, that now makes it look like overspray as it fades in places, also when i removed the lock from the glovebox there was gold colour under it, it looks to be painted rather than plated, possible it came off easy and owners polished the rest off down to the silver?
i will try to get some better pictures without flash
Posted 2012-09-07 5:58 PM (#337928 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
If the inserts were polished-out, there should be some residual dried-out polish material lying around the edge(s) of the
bronze paint....like a sort of over-spay effect.
Do you still have that Bronze painted area, beneath/behind the glove box lock, that you can show us?
That hidden/covered-up painted area pretty well proves that that insert was painted.
No polishing agent residue anywhere around the border of the remaining bronze paint?
Posted 2012-09-14 10:09 PM (#338875 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
The "Newport" Regal Lancer is/was Greg Leggatt's car. I remember him saying that he ad-libbed a bit during the restoration to build the car to his own taste. Not all of what you see is original. I wanted to get full info on it from Greg but it didn't happen so I can't say what's on the data plate. He brought it to that 300 club meet because in his own words "The Regal Lancer is every bit as special as a 300". I heard that Greg sold this car but I'm not sure about that.
As far as rear fin inserts they're common on Regal lancers (my car has them). The license plate escutcheon is not as common (not on my car) and neither are the bumper spuds/guards (got those).
Regal Lancer intro was around the date of the Chicago Auto Show in early January '58 as recorded in this or an another RL thread. Earliest schedule date I've seen is 12/27/57, latest is 6/1/58. It does seem that the initial run was the XSX (white/copper poly/white) colors as all newspaper photos show this one combo. I wonder if this was done because the marketing guys thought it would look good in black and white print or if that's what the paint shop was set up for?
Posted 2012-09-18 5:42 PM (#339389 - in reply to #338875) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Good information, Joe. Have you seen Edward Petrus' 1957 De Soto registry?
I know you are working on a Regal Registry and if it is in a form like Petrus' (non-specific, by state), perhaps you could post it here?
Last time I checked in, you had about 25 cars registered...
Posted 2012-09-18 7:38 PM (#339404 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
The Spring Special trim, obviously, was not included referenced or shown in the Regal Lancer's introductory literature.
I forget when the S.-S. trim was introduced, but it would be interesting to compare that date with the Regals which are
sporting the end-of-fin trim and/or the decklid Escutcheon.
A car's IBM card would confirm whether any S.-S. trim was OEM-installed on that car.
I probably have a Registration Form completed on Greg's car, but neither it, nor the P/T plate, will confirm the installation
of any/all of the S.-S. trim on a car....altho the PNT and/or TRM codes will confirm whether a certain car had the 'special'
S.-S. colors and interior motifs.
Posted 2012-10-07 6:13 PM (#342140 - in reply to #339404) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 390
I've read this entire thread with great interest. Have virtually nothing to add, but do have some questions. Were the RLs batch run at all?
This is mixing apples and oranges, but I do know that when Windsor Assembly built Monaco convertibles for the 1966 model year for Canada, the cars were serialized as the orders were received, but the cars were all batch built in the spring of 1966 which goes a long way towards explaining how the sequence numbers could be all over the map, but the SO numbers were either the same or similar. Is it possible that something similar happened with the RLs?
Grille emblems: Black versus coral etc. Were the RLs all "supposed" to have a coral emblem and those with a black emblem are just mis-builds? I've talked to a number of people over the years about cars built at Hamtramck, and the consensus was that mis-builds were more the order of the day than the exception.
Several other tidbits from this thread have created questions in my mind, but given that I'm a new kid on the block here, I don't want to start off by diving into the deep end.
Posted 2012-10-07 8:47 PM (#342154 - in reply to #342152) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
No, there is no evidence that the factory built the Regals (or the 1957 D501 models) in dedicated batches, or runs,
of consecutive VIN's.
Back on Page 6 of this thread, there is a listing of the unique Regal trim pieces.
There is only one part number for the grille 'medallion': 1757 189 .
That P/N almost certainly pertains to the coral colored grille ornament, since only the Regals sported
a coral colored medallion.
But, whether, and how many, Regals got a black painted grille ornament----and/or whether the black
medallions shared the same P/N as the coral guys---- is subject to actual physical part-observations.
Posted 2012-10-08 1:42 PM (#342233 - in reply to #342154) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Ok, I have one of the coral medallions, I will check the pn when I get home. The pn for the black medallion is 1863 728 (funny those pn's are so far apart) - so maybe those were the ones used on regular ol' Custom Royal and Royal Spring Specials.
Posted 2012-10-08 10:54 PM (#342297 - in reply to #342293) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Very curious! I wonder what that "radiator grille moulding" is?
I have a "power steering" horn ring (with ornament) for the 1958 Dodge and the pn is 1829 586, but I can't tell any difference from those I have seen in Regal Lancer photos.
Posted 2012-10-09 10:26 AM (#342343 - in reply to #342285) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 390
Is the part number you've found cast into the back of the part or is it ink stamped?
If it's cast into the part, then I believe that part number is for the casting only. Every variation of the casting (black shield, coral shield) will have a separate part number.
Parts books show service part numbers. The only documents I've ever seen that show production part numbers are the body & chassis graphics books. The earliest graphics books I'm aware of are from 1960, and then they're only chassis books.
From what I've learned of these graphics books (what the Chebby guys call "Assembly Manuals"), there's a book for Body in White, another for Trim, another for Chassis and I also suspect, but have never seen, that there are additional books for the asembly of the engine, transmission, rear axle and other major sub-assemblies.
Posted 2012-10-09 2:06 PM (#342372 - in reply to #342343) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Hi, Kevin:
It is cast into the part itself, not stamped.
Thanks, John - that does help. For the Regal parts list, I was a bit confused about the number of radiator grille mouldings specified (1) - and though it might be a different part. It seems like it should be at least three - cap and two sides - if not more.
Posted 2012-10-09 2:32 PM (#342376 - in reply to #342300) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
So I also have a NOS Coronet SS grille emblem and it is pn 1863 729. From the information John provided, it looks like the red-and-black striped D emblem went with the Coronets and the Royals (LD1 & LD2) and the black shield went with the Custom Royals (LD3) and the red shield went with the Regals.
Which leaves the remaining "Base, Medallion - All Spring Special" pn 1863 742 - a bit of a mystery.
I think all that may have been the intent, but in practice they may have slapped those grille medallions on cars almost willy nilly. From what I have seen, the Coronet SS's got the black-and-red D emblem - but I have never seen a Royal with that emblem. Regals seem to be either black or red.
Posted 2012-10-10 2:03 PM (#342527 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1493 Location: Jamaica Plain, MA
And though grammatically correct, the use of the word "peculiar" in the PIB is very mid-century. We would generally say "particular," these days, lest we not imply that these medallions you are all focused on, are strange, odd, off-putting.
Posted 2012-10-10 11:27 PM (#342610 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
OK guys, here's the scoop on medallions. The 1757 189 was very early production, probably a carryover from the '57 model year where these were put on the rear quarters of station wagons. In the picture below is the back of one of these that is off my car built in late '57 (sorry for the picture quality but you can just make out the 175 and 9 under the grille bar on the bottom). You'll note that in the picture of the front that it is black and lacks the proper notches for grille mounting. Also pictured is the the later medallion 1863 729 which does have the notches on the sides to recess onto the grille bars. A much nicer look.
Posted 2012-10-10 11:40 PM (#342615 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
I didn't notice before but the mounting pins are located very differently on these two medallions. They don't interchange. Fortunately I have another grille that I'm going to use on my car that's perfectly straight and had no medallion. My original grille was damaged at some point. I'll locate the new holes for the later medallion. I don't know who started this topic but it forced me look and answer a question I always had. Was the black medallion without notches a replacement? Now I know it's correct.
Posted 2012-10-12 3:26 PM (#342870 - in reply to #342615) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
Joe Mac - 2012-10-11 4:40 AM
I didn't notice before but the mounting pins are located very differently on these two medallions. They don't interchange. Fortunately I have another grille that I'm going to use on my car that's perfectly straight and had no medallion. My original grille was damaged at some point. I'll locate the new holes for the later medallion. I don't know who started this topic but it forced me look and answer a question I always had. Was the black medallion without notches a replacement? Now I know it's correct.
Joe,
do you have the metal plate that goes behind the grill to attatch the two pins into, i may have a spare one if not, also my emblem is Black also,
Posted 2012-10-12 5:01 PM (#342883 - in reply to #342870) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
According to the above Repair Manual:
.....the 1863 729 was ONLY to be installed in the Spring Special Coronets and Royals, but
NOT on the Custom Royals, which have medallion 1863 728 ????
Is this later 1863 729 (or, 1863 728) 'crest-emblem' produced in Coral and/or Black?
The medallion's reconfiguration, with its different mounting pins, means that the grille, itself, would have to be
changed, to accept the different pins' locations, on the Spring Specials?
The Repair Manual, above, reflects the installation of the older-original P/N : 1757 189 on the Regal Lancers (only).
According to the Repair Manual "729" would be that little black-and-red 'winged' grille emblem, and "728"
would be the full-on 'crest-guy'.
This ain't confusing????
-----JUST noticed, that Joe is actually holding-up P/N 1863 728 (!!)----which is 'clearly' intended for
installation on the CRL SPRING SPECIALS, only.
So, this clears 'that' up: notched-sided "728" on the S.-S.'s, only, and the flat-sided "189" on the REGALS, only.
Posted 2012-11-05 11:22 AM (#345847 - in reply to #342883) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Rick Carter sent me these images of his Regal - with this story:
There is very little rust and the car has all of its original parts including all emblems, hubcaps, and badges. It has only 112,280 original miles. There is one small crease dinged into the door on the passenger side. The bumpers are just OK and need to be re-chromed. It is cream with Copper insets. The car was purchased new in 1958 in Athens, Ga. The man who owned it had a service station in town and was very meticulouse about maintenance. He died in the early 70s and his wife (non-driver) kept the car in a carport until 1986. A friend of mine bought the car and put it under a shed, where it has been ever since. The car was cranked occasionally and finally left sitting for the last ten years. I am taking my time and going by the book before I crank the car but I am pretty sure I will not have any trouble getting it to run. I got it just because it is rare but I'm probably over my head on a proper restoration. The best attributes about the car is that I know its history, and that all of it is in its original state.
Posted 2012-11-05 4:05 PM (#345897 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 245 Location: Lewisville, TX.
Wow, great find! Add some more pics. Especially the interior. Oops, I started this reply but had to do something. When I came back and finished, I noticed there were more pics added. Sorry. Lol!
Posted 2012-11-05 4:52 PM (#345902 - in reply to #345897) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Rick FOUND this car's Broadcast Sheet up/behind the glove box, today!
Never give up hope on finding one, just because the car may be in rough condition.
This car was well optioned, but its most unusual feature may be that it has only a tinted/shaded windshield,
with the remainder of the glass being plain, and non-tinted.
Some earlier owner repainted the roof in white, maybe about the time when the OEM foam ("Accoustifoam") headliner
was replaced with its current vinyl headliner material.
Of all the Unobtanium materials in our cars, the Accoustifoam headliners are probably the rarest item(s).
They literally disintegrated from heat/cold/vibration/abuse/mistakes/age, right over the heads of the cars' occupants.
Posted 2012-11-05 5:45 PM (#345910 - in reply to #345907) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I've never seen 'naked' Accoustifoam backing.
Whatever it is, it is sagging down, like a cloth material.
That rear speaker is probably a dealer add-on item; it's not coded for having one,
and, the rear seats might just be in Primo condition (or not), under those seat
covers....
Posted 2012-11-05 10:42 PM (#345956 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Member
Posts: 6
It is the waffleboard. There were thick chunks of the accoustifoam under the back seat. The cloth insets in the seats are toast. The foam padding in all the seats crunches like a crouton. lol
Posted 2012-11-05 10:45 PM (#345957 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Member
Posts: 6
I can't thank you guys enough for the advice and information you gave me today. It's nice to know that tere are guys out there willing to share valuable information with a complete greenhorn like me just because you love the car! I'll do my best to bring the car back to it's glory days. It will be awesome to have your help along the way.
Posted 2012-11-05 11:10 PM (#345963 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Another Regal Lancer surfaces! These pictures bring back memories of my car when I first got it. This one is actually more solid than mine, a great car to restore, very complete. This car has some of the items found on the early Regal Lancers; the lance and shield on the glove box door, and the chrome cap on the end of the windlace on the rear door pillar. These are not usually found on later cars. This car was built about one month into Regal production. Take lots of pictures. It will only be this original until you start the restoration and you'll be surprised how unique your car is. There are no two alike. I'd like to get a picture of the grille medallion to see if it has the flat edges. I have a theory that this medallion was disco'd when the the spring special trim package was in production and that at some point the Regals got the notched ones. Those are indeed what naked roof panels look like when the Acoustifoam turns to dust. The factory must have used a roller to apply the adhesive to make that pattern. I wouldn't worry too much about unobtanium Acoustifoam; it can be replicated. New foam sheets applied to the backer boards and sprayed with the correct color latex paint looks indistinguishable from the original. I've seen this done. BTW; what type of antenna did this car have? Fender mounts are not unusual in the early Regals. Is the carpet black loop pile? There is some discussion about what was original. I think mine was replaced so I can't be sure. Good luck and keep us posted.
Posted 2012-11-07 10:49 PM (#346231 - in reply to #345977) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I had a nice chat with Rick tonight and I understand Joe talked to him too. Nice fellow! I think he and his wife are really going to enjoy this car. Turns out Mrs. Carter was the driving force behind the acquisition of this very, very fine car. Hopefully, he will be a regular on the forwardlook.net
Posted 2012-11-10 11:58 AM (#346571 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Member
Posts: 6
My wife Nickie is a VW collector. She has a 73 Karmann Ghia convertible and a 74 Beetle. She just sold her 71 Beetle to help pay for restoration of the 58 Regal Lancer. I am in the process of creating a trunk mat for the 58. i'll keep you posted.
Posted 2012-11-10 8:35 PM (#346621 - in reply to #346571) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
riclemenza - 2012-11-10 9:58 AM
My wife Nickie is a VW collector. She just sold her 71 Beetle to help pay for restoration of the 58 Regal Lancer.
Good choice!
Unfortunately, many junk yards puncture their gas tanks. There are plenty of good sources on this website for a used one. John Fowlie "Big M" and M'Lisa Fowlie "Deloverly" are a good bet. I think there is a manufacturer of reproduction tanks on eBay too.
Posted 2012-11-16 11:49 AM (#347391 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Member
Posts: 6
Ok Guys, I've been doing some homework. I am sculpting and molding a reproduction trunk mat to place back into the car.(58 Regal Lancer) It will require the time to set up the sculpture and the time to make a fiberglass mold from the sculpture. Then, I will take the fiberglass mold to NC to have it sprayed with a flexible black urethane rubberized coating. The urethane coating is much more expensive than I anticipated but there is no other alternative that I know of. I am probably going to do this whether or not anyone else wants a trunk mat. I will have well over $2000 of travel, time and materials in the first mat. If I leave the fiberglass mold with the coating place, they could make additional mats to be drop shipped for a rough estimate of $350 to $400 each. They may become cheaper if a large quantity of mats are made. These mats will look very much like the originals. Before I go off the deep end I would like to have some idea concerning the demand for the product. Let me know if you are definitely interested. Either post comments (pro or con) or send me an email. I can probably have the mold ready by the New Year.
Posted 2012-11-16 12:24 PM (#347402 - in reply to #347391) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
Hi Rick,
Yes put me down for a trunk mat, have you had chance to look around your car yet, just wondering if you can see any evidence of the copper/bronze color around the dash inserts, dont know if you have seen my thread but it looks like they may have been colored at one time?
Posted 2012-11-16 9:14 PM (#347463 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Member
Posts: 6
I went and looked and didn't see any paint on dash inserts. The metal dash panel was all painted copper and the knobs, gages, and dials are all chrome.
Posted 2012-11-18 12:53 PM (#347647 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Rick,
So glad you took the trunk mat project on and have a plan to produce them. I definitely want one. I will speak to other owners to get more sold. Can I suggest that you post this project under Parts for Sale for more exposure?
Posted 2012-11-18 1:00 PM (#347649 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Paul,
Rick also is tackling the rectangular seat button reproduction that you and I discussed some time back. He seemed to think that was a relatively easy task (no pressure, Rick).
Posted 2012-11-18 6:47 PM (#347698 - in reply to #347649) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
Hi Joe,
you must have been reading my mind, i was just going to post about those seat trims, anyway i have found the bracket for the grill badge, pm me your address,
Posted 2012-11-18 6:51 PM (#347699 - in reply to #347698) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
Just out of curiosity i had a look at the badge on mine, and guess what different again? when i did my 58 with the spring trim on the badge was notched at the side to fit the grill bars, this one on the Regal is flat at the sides but it has a 2 bolt adapter plate on the back rivited to the badge with the original 3 pins? plus the bracket that goes behind the grill is a different shape?
Posted 2012-11-20 9:31 AM (#347950 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Regular
Posts: 72 Location: Fayetteville, NC
Add me to your list of those interested in your trunk mats. I would be interested in two trunk mats. I have both a regal and a convertible in need of truck mats.
Thanks
Harry in NC
Posted 2012-11-20 3:50 PM (#347999 - in reply to #347995) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
...NOW.....the next question is: Did the Regal Lancer grille emblem, 1757 189, come in just Coral face-paint, or also in Black
face-painting?
The 1958 CRL trunk's script "DODGE" emblem is seen in both chromed potmetal, and in gold-anodized aluminum, applications.
So, maybe P/N 189 was painted in two colors, altho that prospect seems to be improbable, given the very limited
production of it.
The Regal that LancerMike posted up above here, appears to have a "Chrome" finish trunk "DODGE"
emblem.
Can't really see what color its grille emblem is, but it appears to be black.
Without pulling off a Regal's grille emblem, the GOOD thing is we can easily see if its sides are flat,
or not(ched).....and, hopefully, what its OEM paint finish is.
Posted 2012-11-20 5:10 PM (#348009 - in reply to #347999) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
OK....here's another real mystery:
WAY up on this page, LancerMike wondered about the identity of the "Molding, Radiator Grille; P/N 1686 756" , as shown on
the dedicated Regal Lancer Parts listing.
Also up-above, Joe Mac shows what appears to be a flat sided Regal Lancer medallion, which is painted black, and which is
very-TIGHTLY speed-nutted right through a grille bar (and which would be a bee-otch to have to remove, from the grille!).
[....Just noticed that Joe's grille ALSO has a THIRD emblem mounting(?) hole, in its middle-vertical 'bar'....]
Paul shows us his R.L. medallion, which features a very-CONVENIENT separate mounting bracket, so that the medallion can
be installed with its two mounting studs located BETWEEN the grille bars.
Now, we look at P/N 1686 756 (the "Molding Radiator Grille", above), in the 55-58 Master Parts Book.
The Good Book shows it to be a 1-piece item (and apparently WITHOUT Joe Mac's "Regal Lancer" emblem-mounting holes in
it, IF.....Paul's Regal Lancer grille and emblem are to be believed).
The Good book also shows that the 'regular' 1958 Dodge grilles are 2-piece assemblies (1754 534 & 1754 535).
However....the G.B. also lists 1686 756 as pertaining to the "CENTER" of the 1958 models LS1(Dodge-bodied Firesweep) and
LC1(Dodge-bodied Windsor).
Posted 2012-11-21 2:42 AM (#348061 - in reply to #347995) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: Parts Unknown
On this trunk mat, ... bring me up to speed here, ... is it marked "Dodge" or in any way peculiar to
Dodge ? Or would it be a generic (but nice fitting) mat that would look as right in a Plymouth as in a
Dodge ? I will be needing to detail the Plaza trunk soon enough and this might be the ticket.
Posted 2012-11-21 1:53 PM (#348118 - in reply to #348061) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Brent, I think someone already makes a reproduction Plymouth trunk mat that is very good. There are some significant differences in the Dodge mat and the Plymouth mat, most notably the spare tire location. Since someone already makes the Plymouth mat, I would go that direction.
No specific "Dodge" markers on the Dodge mat, but very different design from Plymouth or De Soto. I would love to get a De Soto mat!
Posted 2012-11-21 4:17 PM (#348149 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
This is NOT the place to discuss the availability of 57+ Dodge trunk mats, but, since the
subject was brought up, here are views of a typically worn out mat, and a really nice one.
IF.....the Dodge mat extends fully up and under the spare tire's location, it may be of use to
Brent and others, who don't care about absolute authenticity in their OEM-type rubber trunk
mats.
They could merely cut-out the area, as necessary, on the lower/left side of the mat in order
to accommodate the location and installation of the Plymouth-type spare tire.
Posted 2012-12-06 5:49 PM (#349970 - in reply to #342154) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Here is an eBay auction for a shield emblem - it is the correct part number, but you can see on the image it has barrel clips on the back. So is this Regal emblem exactly the same as the garden-variety '57 and '58 fender badge? It seems like the drilled grille to fit it would be the rarer item.
1958 DODGE CUSTOM ROYAL REGAL LANCER GRILLE ORNAMENT NEW!!! MAY FIT OTHER YEARS and I'm offering free shipping to 48 and will ship anywhere for a little extra
On Dec-02-12 at 16:49:55 PST, seller added the following information:
Posted 2012-12-06 6:15 PM (#349977 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
If you research the back of the Parts Book, for this P/N, you'll see cross-references for this piece on the 58 Custom Sierra wagon's
fins, but also for the 57 CR sedan fins, and Custom Sierra wagon, altho there are no P/N's shown, on those pages, which reference
this P/N.
Confusing, but since it is flush sided, it should have multiple applications.
Here's a bit of a mystery: here's my own NOS emblem, but it has no P/N on it, and its mounting posts are not reinforced at/on
their bases, like your Ebay-guy is.
Posted 2012-12-06 6:31 PM (#349979 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
You want a Mystery?
The Good Book says that this P/N (1757 189) pertains to the Regal Lancers.
The above auction piece (and my no-part-number piece) have the standard triangulated mounting pins on it/them.
But, if you scroll up to Paul's pics of his emblem, you will see that it appears to have a separate mounting plate on it, with
two in-line-horizontal mounting pins on it, and, of course, a separate, dedicated, mounting-backing-plate.
Technically, it does appear that the above emblem 1757 189 would be able to be mounted directly onto a Regal Lancer's grille, with
the grille bars having to be very carefully drilled to accept those three mounting pins' locations (but, it would be real tough
to remove that emblem from the grille, once it is speed-nutted To the grille).
That separate mounting plate has what appears to be three triangulated 'die-ports' (or something) on it, which appear to align with
the three mounting pins' locations.
Those three die-ports probably have concavities on the back side which connect to shortened mounting
pins on the emblem....the back of the 'attached' mounting plate probably press-fits to the emblems' (shortened?) mounting
pins.
Posted 2012-12-07 12:23 AM (#350031 - in reply to #349979) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
strange indeed! I went down to the parts room and I have three of the 1757 189 badges - common as ketchup. I am just amazed that those are correct for (at the very least the early) Regals!
There almost seems to be an evolution of these badges:
Neil's is like a prototype - here it is, but - oh those pins are weak - reinforce them and go to production
Then you have the regular old 1757 189s - run 60,000 of those babies.
Oh, now we are going to slap those on the Regal grille
That didn't work very well because we are ruining all these grilles!
Make another prototype that mounts to the grille better - you get Paul's badge.
Notch 'em out and run the Spring Specials!
Posted 2012-12-07 2:10 AM (#350040 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
Ya know; mine might just be a prototype; I got it at a WPC national meet, in the 80's.
Its back side definitely looks hand-worked, and you can see where its (never installed) mounting pins were hand-brazed onto its
backside.
And, the Regals did come out before the Spring Specials.....wow.
Recall that these emblems were installed two-per on the 1957 Custom Royal sedans and on the Custom
Sierra wagons.
They were on the decklids of some wagons, too, IIRC, as well as on the sides of some 58 cars, and, oh
yeah, on the Regal Lancers; not rare pieces, necessarily.
Posted 2012-12-09 1:08 PM (#350374 - in reply to #349970) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
Lancer Mike - 2012-12-06 10:49 PM
Here is an eBay auction for a shield emblem - it is the correct part number, but you can see on the image it has barrel clips on the back. So is this Regal emblem exactly the same as the garden-variety '57 and '58 fender badge? It seems like the drilled grille to fit it would be the rarer item.
1958 DODGE CUSTOM ROYAL REGAL LANCER GRILLE ORNAMENT NEW!!! MAY FIT OTHER YEARS and I'm offering free shipping to 48 and will ship anywhere for a little extra
On Dec-02-12 at 16:49:55 PST, seller added the following information:
Posted 2012-12-10 7:27 PM (#350599 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
Ok this adds to my theory about the dash insets, the vertical lines on the Regal horn ring have copper paint in the inserts, and either polishes away or fades,
Posted 2012-12-12 5:14 PM (#350968 - in reply to #350607) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Boy-oh-boy! That copper-wash paint must have come off pretty easily! All the horn rings and dash inserts you see on original examples are nearly bare - restored cars seem to have gone with the flow and skipped the color!
Posted 2013-02-12 8:52 PM (#359734 - in reply to #358968) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Yes Neil, Randy's Regal Lancer is the ex-Ruffalo car, aka the Barrett Jackson RL, also the magazine cover car. This is no doubt the most widely known and shown Regal Lancer.
Posted 2013-02-15 9:57 PM (#360206 - in reply to #351001) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
d500neil - 2012-12-12 9:23 PM BINGO----Mike/anyone have the regular horn ring?
Here's the two types of horn rings which share the same casting (part also?) number. The copper color was also applied to the Power Sterring script on the Regal Lancer. The other horn ring looks like argent silver was applied. The difference in color is subtle but obvious side-by side. The original paint is very weak. I used a soft brush to clean the grooves and still lost some paint. Eventually I'll repaint it. PITA masking job. Yes, I did pick up "plain" horn ring for $10 at a swap meet years ago.
Posted 2013-07-31 10:11 PM (#388764 - in reply to #358986) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2312 Location: Arizona
christine-lover - 2013-02-08 2:14 AM Sure looks like it Neil. Though I've noticed those shield emblems facing the wrong direction on many Lancers.
In my limited experiance on my Pontiac restoration I discovered that none of the emblems, shields, dodads could be installed "wrong" because the factory had made sure that the mounting holes for each one would be such that it was simply imppossible to put the left piece on the right side, etc. Is that not the case on these cars? Were the left and right literally interchangable as far as the location of the mounting holes or are these mistakes due to people putting new metal in without the holes and then putting the wrong holes on the wrong side so to speak?
Posted 2013-08-13 11:07 PM (#391137 - in reply to #391112) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1115 Location: CA
I can't believe anyone would pay 14-15K for that frostbite car needing all the work it needs with the added value of a rod knock. For a few thousand more you could have a nicer more original car without the cushy blue velvet seats!
Posted 2013-08-14 9:09 PM (#391317 - in reply to #391137) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
The first time I saw the Frostbite, I was turned off too. But it grew on me! I think the buyer found a great deal at $14,500 on a very rare car. If I owned it, I would leave the interior just as it is - velvet lazy-boys and all. I would even replace the (very nice) original steering wheel with the little chain wheel. Drive it and have fun.
Cars are nothing without humanity. This car has a pretty cool "human" history to it.
It also reminds me of a coin collection I once heard about: "the worst of the best" - a fella collected all the CC Morgan Dollar years in the worst possible condition he could find them in, allowing for each to be still recognizable for date and mint mark. Several lucky folks have full sets of CC Morgans and fully restored or over-restored Regal Lancers.
This here is probably The Only Krazy Kustom Regal!
Posted 2013-09-10 8:46 PM (#396883 - in reply to #391317) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
I suppose some of you were wondering when I would wake up! I just bought this IPad, joined this forum and am trying to learn how to work both.
Neil's pics 28&29 are both my car. I can't explain the rear antenna. I didn't take that pic. Pics 30 & 31 are of a car in a WI yard ( many years ago ) .The only info I bothered to get was the sch build date was 0110 (early car). Pt code
5 XSX.
My car coded for TF, radio group, convenience group, solex ws only and undercoat. That's ALL! No ps or PB. Sch build date 0318 and pt 5ASA. Aivars car is sch the next day yet there are almost 1000 vins between them!
Those pics of my car don't look all that bad but the entire drivetrain, the frame and all suspensions were all rusty junk as well as all floors. Without the original engine block and the frame I didn't have a numbers matching car so I was, at least in my opinion, free to restore it just like I wanted so I loaded it up with every factory option I could find. After parting out dozens of cars and rebuilding all these options for close to 20 years I got it done. It's a fabulous driving car and I put 8000 miles on it in 3 seasons! Mike's photo of the car was taken on it's maiden voyage to RI.
I'll try to get photos to post when I learn how.
Great thread, well done guys!
Posted 2013-09-10 9:06 PM (#396889 - in reply to #396883) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Amazing!! That actually worked!!
For the headliner I cut .040" aluminum the exact size for each panel. I used ordinary everyday fabric/foam and glued it to the alum with the out and spray painted the foam with a copper/bronze latex. To make up the thickness difference I put 3/16" X 3/8" adhesive weatherstrip on each side of each bow. My panels were much thinner than the original hardboard. I just used the cream coloured bow covers with the chromed regal end caps. It looks fine!
My padded sun visors with the silver Mylar bands were not good enough so Gary made me two using the bronze vinyl.
Posted 2013-09-15 8:38 PM (#397866 - in reply to #397860) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Neil,
What you see is just rust dripping down!!
My medallion was chrome and black that had a steel plate sort of crimped on the back and the steel plate had the prongs, through the grill, secured by another plate with speed nuts. I think Paul described his that same way.
Posted 2013-09-18 3:44 PM (#398397 - in reply to #145237) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Greg and Susan sent me these pictures of their outstanding Regal to post here (thank you). Besides for Neil's photos of Greg's unrestored car, there is one more photo of this car in its restored condition all the way back on page one, near the bottom. Pictures one through five did not come through, so those may be on the way.
Posted 2013-09-18 3:49 PM (#398398 - in reply to #398397) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Greg can tell more about his own car, but from what I see:
D-500
Bumper appearance group
fin-end caps
rear license insert and eschutcheon
padded dash
electric lift windows
air conditioning
dual rear antennae
rear defogger
two rear speakers
they have this done to the nines and one of the best trunk mats I have seen!
Posted 2013-09-18 4:41 PM (#398407 - in reply to #398399) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Thanks Mike,
I took these pics yesterday but the restoration was finished 12 years ago.The headliner stood up very well- much more durable than I thought it would be. The car shows a little wear and tear.
It needs some corrections like steering wheel, handbrake handle and wind lace and the trunk is a little "dressed-up".
The engine is a 58 CDN Custom Royal 354 with a 2650 AFB carb. The same set-up as a 58 Saratoga. Sure grip 3.15 axle and H.D "export" ( Fury) T-bars 956/7. These bars really help the ride with the heavy engine and factory A/C.
As I said earlier, the car was close to being non-restorable so I brought it back to life and had fun doing it!
Posted 2013-09-18 8:37 PM (#398441 - in reply to #398440) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
The 956/957 torsion bars are Nuke-proof; the 952/953 bars (which were standard on the Furys and Coronets/Royals,
but optional on the Custom Royal series) should be plenty strong, even with the 354 Poly head engine.
if you put 2-way gas shocks on it, the front end will be very stiff, alright; you should consider beefing up the rear end to match it,
by installing another leaf spring (second shortest), and, maybe a full-length shortest-leaf, too.
Big M should be able to break-apart a station wagon's leaf springs to provide/sell these guys to you.
He also should have a 1958 parking brake, to sell to you.
Posted 2013-09-18 9:32 PM (#398454 - in reply to #398441) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
auto-pilot! holy moly! absolutely fantastic. Polara Paul recently purchased a 1958 Dodge with the factory auto-pilot right on the speedometer display - I can't recall ever seeing another.
Posted 2013-09-18 10:32 PM (#398467 - in reply to #398454) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
I had the 952/3 bars in it. If it had a sway bar that would have helped a lot. The 58 frames were not even lanced to accurately position brackets for a sway bar, otherwise, I would have installed one! Gas shocks is a good idea.
In the rear I have a pair of excellent Monroe shocks with exterior coil springs over them. Not those horrible aftermarket things. These springs are built right into each shock. It will carry a lot of weight in the trunk just fine. I'll save the best for last ---- the shocks are dated Dec. 57!!
Yeah, I couldn't believe I didn't save a 58 handle .
The autopilot is fantastic, you can drive the car with it-- sort of like hand controls.
Posted 2013-09-19 3:45 PM (#398608 - in reply to #398605) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
My pleasure, Greg - you have a truly outstanding example of a rare and wonderful car. I meant to ask: what is the story with the black box in the trunk?
Posted 2013-09-19 4:37 PM (#398613 - in reply to #398608) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1115 Location: CA
Thats a lovely car but what engine is that in there? Given the D500 badge on the trunk and it being a '58 it should be a 361, right? The distributor is in the back so it can't be a B series engine. What is it?
Posted 2013-09-19 7:08 PM (#398639 - in reply to #398620) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
That is not the original engine. As Neil said, it is a 58 CDN Dodge engine. The original engine had been left open(intake off) in the yard for years. I scrapped it. It was not an original D500.car.
Neil, I'm sure I sent you our registration form. it was dated Nov 15, 1991! VIN. LD3 23578. I can't send you the data plate --- I don't know how!
I said the bows were chrome on the form.
Mike, I built this car to drive 1000 miles to 5or6 day 300club meets. So, with a weeks clothes, lawn chairs, coolers and cleaning supplies where do the emergency fluids, parts and special tools & stuff go? In that box. I made it to fit over the jack shaft and kinda lock in place because it was so heavy. It used up space not much good for anything else.
Posted 2013-09-19 10:29 PM (#398668 - in reply to #398662) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Yeah,Neil,it's me.A voice from the past and a lot older! If I crawled under a car today I wouldn't be able to see what I was looking at and I wouldn't be able to get back out! It's a real shame.
Posted 2013-09-20 1:21 PM (#398757 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Beautiful car Greg! The a/c and autopilot make for a very busy engine bay. Nicely done. Your RL is one that I've been seeking info on; thanks for the pictures. What carb does that 354 run?
Posted 2013-09-21 7:18 PM (#398969 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Hi Matt,
On the steering column. You'll see an overlay sort of patch on the column in one of my pics. That is the bezel for the control- it's quite big, you need quite a hole in the column to accommodate the right angle gear.
Posted 2013-09-21 9:01 PM (#398981 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
The control projects to the right. I couldn't get a good pic with the iPad. I think it's the same as a 58/9 Chrysler. I don't have a camera any more but I could try some artificial light if you really want.
Greg
Posted 2013-09-21 10:05 PM (#398992 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2996 Location: Sept. 1958
I've never seen the controls for this, never noticed it in a Chrysler. If you can get a photo sometime of it that would be great. Was it available on 1958 Dodges?
On another note, here's speed warning in a 58 Dodge. This seems to be a late in the model year accessory, probably to compete with 1958 Edsel's speed warning that glowed the speedometer red.
Posted 2013-09-22 9:27 AM (#399041 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Matt, Thanks for that photo. I've never seen one in a car. OK, I found my autopilot in a junked Dodge but was in poor shape with parts missing. Factory? I don't know but I presumed it was. There is no place I can see for one to be coded on the broadcast sheet but there isn't for the speed minder either. I will try to send a copy of a Dodge announcement for the speed minder.
I'm second guessing myself. I'm now thinking that 59 Chrysler control was on the dash and that the steering column one was 58 only. Anyway I needed 58 Chrysler parts to get my project done.
BTW, what is the significance of Sept 1958 on tour profile?
Posted 2013-09-22 10:16 AM (#399054 - in reply to #399041) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2996 Location: Sept. 1958
That must have been factory or dealer installed if it was in a junked Dodge. Last year there was a D at Hershey on the showfield with Autopilot, but I didn't take notice of the controls, perhaps it will be there in 3 weeks.
My profile photo now is a photo that was taken in Sept. 58, I bought the studio slide on eBay and that was the date written on it. It is an awesome SS convertible.
Posted 2013-09-25 11:51 AM (#399640 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1493 Location: Jamaica Plain, MA
What a great car. I love this thread. The headliner-- I want to try this technique. Does one spray glue the foam onto the aluminum, and then spray glue the fabric onto the foam? And for the paint, is that just water-based spray paint, or some other latex paint through a paint-gun on the fabric?
Posted 2013-09-25 1:18 PM (#399655 - in reply to #399640) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
The headliner material is the stuff available for today's cars. Fabric on one side and foam on the other. Glue the fabric to the aluminum and spray the foam. I just used spray cans! Do a few little test panels first.
Posted 2013-09-27 1:40 PM (#399997 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1493 Location: Jamaica Plain, MA
I wonder if any of the Acousti-Foam headliners survived as a reference. Seems unlikely. In any case, I'm going to try Greg's technique this weekend. See how much of a mess I can make.
Posted 2013-10-01 12:55 PM (#400800 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
I saved some bits and peices of acouti-faom that I recovered from under the chrome header and side trim that was in relatively good condition. I kept them for future matching but haven't seen them in years. I'll dig them out and post some pictures if I can find them.
Posted 2013-10-01 4:21 PM (#400835 - in reply to #400800) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Some 1958 Coronets came with white accusti-foam headliners - they also had accusti-foam sun visors. I saved a few bits too. The hard board backing was the same as a Royal or Custom Royal hardtop (minus the never-ending loop pattern). The accousti-foam was about 1/16 inch thick and spongy. It was either sprayed on to the hard board or glued on.
Posted 2013-10-01 4:48 PM (#400839 - in reply to #399997) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 8443 Location: Perth Australia
JT Vincent - 2013-09-28 1:40 AM
I wonder if any of the Acousti-Foam headliners survived as a reference. Seems unlikely. In any case, I'm going to try Greg's technique this weekend. See how much of a mess I can make.
Posted 2013-10-01 5:53 PM (#400847 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 7207 Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada
The 1960 Dodge hardtops came with an acoustic-foam headliner as well, with a cardboard surround around the perimeter on the sides and rear. There were chromed plastic divider bows separating three sections on the 1960 jobs. The foam was slightly ribbed in a greyish-brown color and I found that a ribbed corduroy material was an almost perfect match for the foam.
Posted 2013-10-05 8:06 PM (#401654 - in reply to #401651) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 7207 Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada
d500neil - 2013-10-05 4:37 PM
Ian, do you have any pics available of that ribbed corduroy material???
How did you attach that stuff to a backing material?
Sorry, no pics of it. It was installed at a local upholstery shop, not on my ex-Polara but on a Matador 4 door Hardtop I owned for a while. The Polara has a similar material in a color that matches the original foam, but it's not ribbed like the foam was.
Posted 2013-10-06 2:30 AM (#401684 - in reply to #401654) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
I think Ian is correct. I had a bunch of panel segments of the original foam as well and I do recall that there was some sort of corrugation to the overall panels. It was'nt smooth like my repro stuff.
Hey, Neil, does Ivar have photos of it? I flew to FL to check that car out before Ivar bought it and as I remember the headliner was pretty much intact.
Posted 2013-10-06 3:22 AM (#401689 - in reply to #401684) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
I thought/think that its headliner is in bronze vinyl.
Aivar used to have a 61 Phoenix Dart stripper (like, with the 6-banger) in all-red; its license was 1961UFO; anyway, it
had an Accoustafoam headliner in it.
Posted 2013-11-10 11:55 PM (#409790 - in reply to #401689) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
I've been thinking about the Regal headliners since our last posts. We know that the actual hardboard panels were sort of ribbed or corrugated. We know that the foam overtop was quite thin. So, I guess I am still wondering if the final foam surface was slightly "ribbed" or smooth! My original samples are gone--- I can't find them.
Greg
Posted 2013-11-11 1:10 AM (#409800 - in reply to #409790) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
What I recall, from having examined a 1961 Dodge's Accoustafoam headliner, is that the headliner was definitely
textured; not smooth-like-vinyl, at all.
You may have sent me a small sample of it, along with some upholstery swatches. I'll go check for it.
Posted 2013-12-26 11:39 PM (#418625 - in reply to #409800) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Let me have another "go" at this. No question in my mind that I duplicated the GENERAL appearance of accustafoam with my headliner. But, I glued my foam onto a smooth surface. We all know that the OEM accustafoam was glued or applied to a hardboard panel that was NOT smooth. It was embossed with a pattern. Call it ridged, corduroy or waffled or whatever. My question is simply this. Did this ridged, corduroy or waffled underlying embossing SHOW through in the final appearance of this headliner. If, in fact it did, then my restoration attempt has to stand back. If it didn't, well guys, do it my way. I chose alum panels because they will never lose their "memory" and collapse like hardboard under any climatic condition.
Greg
Posted 2013-12-28 2:40 PM (#418924 - in reply to #418625) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 7207 Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada
As I mentioned somewhere in this thread previously, in my ex-60 Polara the accoustifoam was ribbed but the ribbing was actually molded into the foam itself. Here is a photo of another 60 Polara where the restorer obviously had the same idea for his headliner. The front bow on this one has come loose- it is chromed plastic and just clips in place to a steel rib on the underside of the roof. The blue sections around the perimeter of the headliner are molded hardboard. In my ex-Polara with a red and black interior, those sections were in a dark gray color, with the tan/brownish foam in between. As I mentioned above, my foam got replaced with a non textured velour material in the same color, but on a Matador I had owned at one point, the new owner had the headliner re-done with a ribbed corduroy material like in this photo.
Posted 2014-01-02 9:24 PM (#419910 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Greg,
I think you did it right. I took my headliner boards out in 1980 and stored them. I just dug them out to see what we think is embossing really is. What I found is that there appears to be a linear glue pattern that was applied to a smooth cardboard surface. There is a raised pattern left where remnants of the foam are still adhered to the glue striping, but it's not embossed. I've also attached pictures from earlier in this thread that supports this. The advertising brochure (that is sometimes wrong but I this is accurate in this case) shows a smooth foam surface. The best evidence is the photo of the tattered Regal headliner that shows both the old surface and the glue pattern underneath. Note how smooth the front section looks. I'm going to try to duplicate that smooth look. I like your idea of using aluminum sheet.
Posted 2014-01-02 11:25 PM (#419926 - in reply to #419910) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Thanks Joe. That makes me feel better. I guess we all have pieces of foam that have fallen off, and, it doesn't have any sort of embossing to it. When I started seeing pics of the underlying panels with a definite "pattern" to it I started to second guess what I had done. It appears it might be just the chrome bows that are the hard part now!
Greg
Posted 2014-01-02 11:57 PM (#419937 - in reply to #419910) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
I have another topic on my thought list. We all saw that copper/bronze colouring on the dash and glovebox aluminum inserts. I don't think it was thick enough to be paint. I think it was an anodizing colouring. I didn't pick up on the fact it was done on the horn ring. Thanks, guys for pointing it out! If, in fact, it was an anodizing colouring it would have been much more fragile applied to a chrome surface than an aluminum one. Regardless of what this colouring was, I think it would have been applied to the alum.sheets before they were stamped with their pattern. In which case, the bottoms of these "dots" would have been more silver than bronze. Just a thought.
I really don't think it is that much of a deal to have an anodizer do this. I'm sure they just use cheap food colouring!!
Posted 2014-01-03 4:31 PM (#420041 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
The hardest thing to reproduce are the headliner bows, they appear to be clear plastic with the chrome applied to the inside, but the headliner does appear to have a smooth finish to it, just wondering if the polyurethene material they put under laminate floors may be of similar texture?
Posted 2014-01-11 3:25 PM (#421530 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
The RL brochure shows bronze colored dash panel inserts, but, the official parts-listings for the RL's (see pages 2 and 6 of
this thread) do not list the 'bronze' dash insert panels as being installed on the RL's.
Any bronze colored insert panels would appear to be prototype pieces (yeah!) or owner add-ons.
(and, YEAH, Mick...that is quite the optical illusion, there...)
Posted 2014-01-21 10:57 PM (#423317 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Over the weekend I was getting interior parts together for painting and on the back side of the windshield header molding I found remnants of the acoustifoam headliner pretty well preserved. The open cell sponge rubber is the base material. It appears to be painted with a beige kind of color. This old foam is so fragile it nearly disintegrates on contact. This part was taken off the car and wrapped in 1980 and stored indoors ever since.
Posted 2014-01-22 1:07 AM (#423321 - in reply to #423317) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
So, there are FOUR substrates, or section-layers to Accousti-foam: the corrugated or waffled-texture base, two posterboard-
Masonite-like layers, and the sprayed-on texture coat.
At least, there is/are no painted-on design motifs, like we are faced with, on the regular solid-masonite headliners.
Posted 2014-01-22 10:12 AM (#423349 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 3155 Location: NY & VT
It's weird, all the varying headliner treatments Mopar/Dodge used on hardtop models, these Dodge foam ones, with chrome (stainless?) bows, my '58 FireSweep had molded fiberboard with holes and painted on? patterns, no foam, but with white plastic (and very fragile) bows, my '58 Windsor has vinyl/cloth soft material with holes, and chrome bows.. sedans had the soft material and NO visible bows... and all of these cars were built in the same Dodge (Lynch Road?) plant!
Posted 2014-01-22 10:11 PM (#423523 - in reply to #423321) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
d500neil - 2014-01-21 11:07 PM
So, there are FOUR substrates, or section-layers to Accousti-foam: the corrugated or waffled-texture base, two posterboard-
Masonite-like layers, and the sprayed-on texture coat.
At least, there is/are no painted-on design motifs, like we are faced with, on the regular solid-masonite headliners.
I think there are only two layers: the composite board and the foam. I don't know if that spongy foam was sprayed on or, it looks more likely glued on, which is why you see the waffled pattern. One of my old Coronets had an Accoustifoam headliner.
Posted 2014-02-20 3:34 PM (#428180 - in reply to #423547) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Greg Leggatt recently sent me this photograph with the following note:
I just found this pic I took in 01. It belongs to ----- "Spanky" --- of Illinois. I think he had just finished the restoration. As far as I know he still has it.
Posted 2014-02-22 5:14 AM (#428433 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 133
have the frame like this to get all sand/steel out steel and sandblasted and then warmzinked ,waxed inside ,its56years old now and it`s gonna last another 256 years rustwise``
Posted 2014-02-22 6:09 PM (#428501 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
That's gonna need one heckava patch-panel on that 1/4 panel, but, really, installing a complete quarter panel to the
body should be relatively easy to do, and it allows for easy restoration/preparation of the inner 1/4 panel areas, too.
There was no Broadcast Sheet found on Frostbite, behind the glove box or underneath the carpeting?
Posted 2014-02-23 5:06 AM (#428563 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 133
No sorry ,probebly dissapered in the customicing ,the rug looked like it came from the living-room and it was heavy-duty glued to the floors,needs a total frame-off resto ,it`s ruff, like always on these years, seems like it was white w copper sweep and roof orginal,it has power-windows and i can se they been there all the time, the rear antenna holes were welded ,350 w4baroll D500??
Posted 2014-08-27 2:08 PM (#454377 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
When I first bought this car I was surprised that there was no gold on it at all! Even the Q panel shields had no gold on the helmet. Anyone seen any others like this?
It came with no wheel covers, so, in keeping with the rest of the car I buffed off the gold on the covers.
Greg
Posted 2014-08-27 3:09 PM (#454388 - in reply to #454377) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146 Location: bishop, ca
The decklid "Dodge" nameplate was produced, for the Custom Royals (at least) in either chromed pot metal or in gold anodizing; doesn't
seem to be any pattern in whether a CR got either type.
The Regal's "spear" is clearly/"always" provided in chrome finish; not 'gold' (but Greg & I know that, from decades-ago).
Here's one of Greg's research-photos, on the spears being chrome-silver finish.
Don't seem to have a similar one, on the shields, but, here's an OEM photo with the knight's head definitely appearing to be in
gold finish.
Also, this third photo, of a weathered lance/shield, but, in the photograph, the knight's head definitely is more 'gold' colored than is
the clearly chrome-silver finish on the spear, but I have no info on the 'story' behind this third photo.
The knight's head on the spinners should be gold lacquer finish; 24K gold plating is relatively permanent, and, against
the chrome-spinner, really looks OEM (.....as compared to 'gold-plated' lances and other nameplates that we see on
various 'restored' cars).
And, here's an example of that lacquer finish, on a 58 D500 emblem, that I used to have.
Posted 2014-10-31 3:14 PM (#460693 - in reply to #454570) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
There is a fellow who has been advertising on Craigslist looking for 1957, 1958, and 1959 Dodge, De Soto, and Chrysler convertibles. This picture of a stripped-down Regal was included in his advertisement. It may be one of the Regals already in this thread, but perhaps not...
Posted 2014-11-02 1:04 AM (#460797 - in reply to #460693) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Lancer Mike - 2014-10-31 3:14 P
Does anyone know more about it?
No I don't but if he has ALL the stainless trim it looks like a doable project. I had to make one piece of SS which I thought would be easy. It certainly was not!!!
Greg
Posted 2014-11-05 5:59 PM (#461087 - in reply to #461046) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I wondered if the craigslist advertisement I saw might be from Bo - it looked like it was centered around the state of Arizona and broadcast to surrounding regions! Unfortunately, I did not see a picture of this Regal on Bo's site. Thanks for the link, though. Good stuff!
Posted 2015-01-02 4:46 PM (#466504 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Greg,
These are great ads. I've never seen the two-page spread on the Regal Lancer or the acoustic-foam ad. Interesting that the acoustic-foam ad says it's available as an option across the line on Lancers; I've only seen this applied to Regal Lancers. Has anyone seen this option in another model? Thanks for sharing these. Happy New Year everyone! I hope to see many of you at Carlisle this year. I may have a surprise with me...
Posted 2015-01-02 11:46 PM (#466530 - in reply to #466504) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Happy New Year! I had a '58 Coronet Lancer coupe equipped with the acousti-foam headliner. It was an L.A. build. I have also seen another hardtop with the acoustic-foam headliner and I think the Dodge Main cars have this option coded into their cowl plates. Great stuff, Greg!
Posted 2015-05-15 12:50 PM (#478358 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Great early 60's shot Matt. Look how plain the bug and Falcon are in comparison to the Regal Lancer. Ever wonder where a car in an old photo is today? Did it survive? Is it hidden in a barn somewhere? Is it one of the ones we see regularly on these pages?
Posted 2015-05-17 10:21 AM (#478559 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 5006
proud new owner of a Regal Lancer "parts" car no engine, no title, no interior(except for dash and two perfect sun visors!).
I posted the body tag, thanks for the info.
This thing is in bad shape. very very very bad shape so I have a 58 coronet donor car coming, it needs a fair amount of work itself but the price is right and it will actually move.
There isn't even a "hint" of a trunk drop, the gas tank was on the ground, the tack welds they put in place to move the car broke in transit so we used tie straps to hold the leaf springs up and push the car. The frame looks reasonable though, doors aren't bad. I am missing those 3 pieces of trim so I will need to make or find those
I think the back of the car sat on the ground and rotted away. You can see my trunk, wowsers...
Posted 2015-09-19 1:06 AM (#490015 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 5006
Well I have figured out a way to obtain the last missing piece of long trim from my Regal donor. it appears that the 57 coronet trim is curved in the reverse mode. I have a full 57 and a full 58 set of coronet trim. I even accidentally got an extra set of 57. This compares a 57 Coronet trim vs a 58 Regal lancer. there is no real curve on the Regal until you hit the very end while the 57 coronet has a longer entire curve going the wrong way. Using a 57 coronet trim will be tricky but I think the better option is use a 58 and putting two pieces together with that slight bend in the back.
I still need one front fender (C) and both rear "points" and i will have a complete set of body trim...
Posted 2015-09-30 11:05 AM (#491023 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 5006
I think I found a guy who can make them actually from stainless, I have the "underlying" connection piece. I may make it out of clay and mold and cast it if this guy is too expensive.
Posted 2015-09-30 3:14 PM (#491041 - in reply to #491023) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 7207 Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada
That part looks really similar to the front joiner trim on a 1960 Windsor or Saratoga with the optional color sweep. Take a look at mine. It's probably longer but could be cut down to fit if the widths are the same, and it would be relatively easy to find one of these pieces.
Posted 2015-10-03 5:06 PM (#491311 - in reply to #491041) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 5006
imopar380 - 2015-09-30 3:14 PM That part looks really similar to the front joiner trim on a 1960 Windsor or Saratoga with the optional color sweep. Take a look at mine. It's probably longer but could be cut down to fit if the widths are the same, and it would be relatively easy to find one of these pieces.
Posted 2016-11-11 2:11 PM (#525881 - in reply to #347391) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
riclemenza - 2012-11-16 4:49 PM
Ok Guys, I've been doing some homework. I am sculpting and molding a reproduction trunk mat to place back into the car.(58 Regal Lancer) It will require the time to set up the sculpture and the time to make a fiberglass mold from the sculpture. Then, I will take the fiberglass mold to NC to have it sprayed with a flexible black urethane rubberized coating. The urethane coating is much more expensive than I anticipated but there is no other alternative that I know of. I am probably going to do this whether or not anyone else wants a trunk mat. I will have well over $2000 of travel, time and materials in the first mat. If I leave the fiberglass mold with the coating place, they could make additional mats to be drop shipped for a rough estimate of $350 to $400 each. They may become cheaper if a large quantity of mats are made. These mats will look very much like the originals. Before I go off the deep end I would like to have some idea concerning the demand for the product. Let me know if you are definitely interested. Either post comments (pro or con) or send me an email. I can probably have the mold ready by the New Year.
What ever happened on this project for the repro mats??
Posted 2017-05-31 10:04 PM (#541305 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 9672 Location: So. Cal
The three different lancer colors on this brochure seem to indicate that they were colored differently depending on which color scheme you chose for the car. If that isn't what it signifies, what does it mean? Anyone have a color version of this ad?
Posted 2017-06-01 4:49 PM (#541353 - in reply to #491294) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
That looks like the poster ad. I think I have a color copy, but I don't think it fits on my scanner.
The only color combinations available for the Regal were
5XSX - copper with eggshell fins and roof
5SXS - eggshell with copper fins and roof
5ASA - copper with black fins and roof
5SAS - black with copper fins and roof
Posted 2017-06-07 7:00 AM (#541677 - in reply to #541662) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
Copy of build card, but FCA to busy to do a breakdown on it , after waiting nearly 2 months to get it? They sent a letter just giving the original dealer .
The Regal Lancer model was added in February and only available as a two-door hardtop with special colors, exterior trim and interior. Four color combinations where available: bronze with white trim, bronze with black trim, black with bronze trim, and white with bronze trim. It featured special nameplates at the front of the side spear trim and heavy eyebrow trim. Inside, Regal Lancers got their own interior with unique trim and door panels featuring molded armrests. A special Acousti-Foam headliner with chrome bows and roof rails was a Regal Lancer exclusive, as was the bronze instrument panel with textured aluminum inserts. The standard engine offered for Regal Lancers was the 350 cubic inch displacement "Super Red Ram" V8. Optional engine choices were the 361 cubic inch displacement D-500 and Super D-500 iterations. Only 1,163 were produced. The car is in awesome original shape with a full restoration on the interior. The exterior has about 70% original paint. This is a very rare model. It's a D500 with the single four barrel 361 engine. Options are front bumper teeth rear exhaust tips power steering. It's been a blast to drive but I just have to many cars. Please ask questions is you have any and bid to win. Inquiry about the buy it now price. I can assist with overseas shipping if needed. Harrison 760 898 8434
Posted 2017-06-07 2:28 PM (#541713 - in reply to #541708) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
Looks a nice original car, this is the one with the White centre seat bolsters, headliner looks like it's been replaced with standard cardboard panels?
Posted 2017-06-07 5:18 PM (#541726 - in reply to #541713) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
It definitely has the white center bolsters, it could only be the same car.
The headliner (from previous images) does look like flat board, perhaps not even perforated - I guess they could have stripped the acusti-foam off and repainted the board.
From what I remember, the board underneath the acusti-foam headliners is not perforated.
In the earlier images, there are no front bumper spuds and no D500 emblem on the trunk. Those must have been added along the way.
It would be interesting to see if this is actually a D500 car. The air cleaner what looks like under-coating on it, and it had that the last time it sold.
It's a neat-looking car!
Posted 2017-06-25 10:41 AM (#542835 - in reply to #542831) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
Mary says she may be able to get the missing trims made, this is the only thing that would put off buyers as they would be near impossible to find a pair, but looking at the car and that steering wheel the car does look a good example to restore , there are a few incorrect parts on the engine and the seats need trimming, no pictures of headliner though,
If anyone buys this and is having Gary do the seats let me know as I need mine doing also,
Posted 2017-06-25 12:02 PM (#542840 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 9672 Location: So. Cal
Do you know what she is asking for it? That missing 1958, big block only air cleaner isn't real easy to find either, but I guess you could go to dual quads instead.
Posted 2017-06-25 12:29 PM (#542842 - in reply to #542840) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
Powerflite - 2017-06-25 5:02 PM
Do you know what she is asking for it? That missing 1958, big block only air cleaner isn't real easy to find either, but I guess you could go to dual quads instead.
Hi Nathan,
No and I don't think Mary does, I gave it a 10 - 15K price on Facebook, due to the missing parts, all down to looking at car and condition really, if it had the missing trims would have been in the 20K spot , don't know if it's a D500 but looks to be similar spec to mine with no bumper spuds or power seats/ windows, seats will need recovering and that's 2K of Gary if he's doing them anymore, not replied back to me on mine?
But at end of day they rarely come up for sale in this condition and as the other on eBay was a scam , this and nick's are the only ones I have seen for sale that look reasonably restorable since Frostbite, which I think went for around 10K in the end?
I have been asking around £12k for mine but not had much interest?
Posted 2017-06-26 12:19 AM (#542869 - in reply to #542835) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Member
Posts: 5
Sad to say the headliner does need to be done. I completely blitzed it on a picture. I would like to mention that it does run but needs to have the freeze plugs replaced. Father has them but no time.
Posted 2018-03-05 2:22 PM (#559279 - in reply to #559266) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Wow! Great walk-around by Charles Phoenix! That is a beautiful car. I like the metal fleck carpeting - nice touch!
It doesn't appear to be a heavily-optioned Regal. It looks like it has an AACA show badge on the grille.
My guess is that this is the Ruffalo/Guyer Regal (see page 11) that I actually sat in as it rolled across the Barrett-Jackson block in Scottsday in 2008.
Posted 2018-04-23 9:58 PM (#562157 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Haven't posted an update on this car in a long time. It's been a long road and there's light at the end of the tunnel. I haven't even seen the car myself yet; just got this email from the body shop today. Will try to pick it up this weekend. Man am I eager. I may not sleep tonight.
Posted 2018-04-24 1:43 PM (#562208 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 471 Location: MN
Thank you, interestingly small # for production, my uncle sold one NEW in our small tow of prob 6000 @ the time but he & my dad were @ the right age for promoting & trying new things, their 40s. White bronze fin roof
Posted 2018-05-06 11:17 AM (#562877 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
More pictures from when I picked her up. Looks great; got her home without any problems and she's safely tucked away in my garage. I'm going to let the paint harden and then carefully put all the pretty stuff on. I'll post pictures of the progress.
Posted 2018-05-06 11:18 AM (#562878 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
More pictures from when I picked her up. Looks great; got her home without any problems and she's safely tucked away in my garage. I'm going to let the paint harden and then carefully put all the pretty stuff on. I'll post pictures of the progress.
Posted 2018-05-06 11:10 PM (#562898 - in reply to #562896) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Looks great Joe! BTW, I have a bunch of NOS vinyl , embossed and otherwise left over if you want it. Just let me know by email. We are planning to attend the 300 club meet in RI this fall.
Posted 2018-05-09 8:20 PM (#563055 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
My Mopar garage. The wall art fenders are the originals that were on the car. Some miscellaneous Fury parts. One of my other projects; a 62 Polara 500 with non-original 413 and 4 speed (413 on the hook). Not a Forward Look but a beautiful Exner design IMHO.
Posted 2018-07-13 4:43 PM (#566555 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Member
Posts: 5
I am missing ONE piece of chrome on my RL. Any suggestions on what to do if I can’t get it. One of my Regal emblems is broken in half recommendations on fixing it. Also I am very nervous on who to have work on it. It needs trunk and a couple other rust areas done. Also who do you recommend for chrome work? Has anyone every dealt with Legendary Auto Interiors on having them copy the interior material?
Posted 2018-07-13 5:06 PM (#566557 - in reply to #566555) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
MoparMej - 2018-07-13 9:43 PM
I am missing ONE piece of chrome on my RL. Any suggestions on what to do if I can’t get it. One of my Regal emblems is broken in half recommendations on fixing it. Also I am very nervous on who to have work on it. It needs trunk and a couple other rust areas done. Also who do you recommend for chrome work? Has anyone every dealt with Legendary Auto Interiors on having them copy the interior material?
Thanks for any input!
Mary,
that piece can be repaired by a good plating company, as for the interior, SMS are on with my seat covers at moment, I had to buy a set of patterns for them, give Doug a call he may do a deal seeing as he is already on with a set?
Posted 2018-07-14 6:18 AM (#566577 - in reply to #566564) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
MoparMej - 2018-07-14 12:07 AM
How correct is the pattern? Looking at their website right now. Which fabric did you go with and where did you get the correct pattern?
Mary,
Gary goers used to make up the covers, but because he is unwell ,no longer makes them, so I bought the patterns from him to send to SMS so they could make up the covers, the door panels SMS have done before for Gary, they have the material and are on with mine at the moment, I am missing the plastic rectangles that go on the seats, are you missing any, I could do with one to copy some,
Posted 2018-07-14 1:07 PM (#566592 - in reply to #566577) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Member
Posts: 5
Plastic rectangles? I’m going to have to look at them. I bet they are there. The original seats were just covered up.
I was just re-reading your resto thread. Brought up some question. Is it necessary to do a body off frame restoration? How much of the parts were new vs original? I look at your and just think there is no way I can do that myself!
Posted 2018-07-14 4:56 PM (#566597 - in reply to #566592) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
MoparMej - 2018-07-14 6:07 PM
I was just re-reading your resto thread. Brought up some question. Is it necessary to do a body off frame restoration? How much of the parts were new vs original? I look at your and just think there is no way I can do that myself!
Mary
Most of it is just cleaning and painting, only new parts are bushes, joints etc, everything else has either been rebuilt cleaned or painted, all the nuts bolts etc are all electroplated.
A lot easier to do over there I would have thought as saves on importing parts, all depends on how far you want to go on you're restoration, having a good body would make it easier to do a frame restoration, I never had my car running plus the engine was in bits, so I never knew how good anything was so it was rebuilt before going back together.
Posted 2018-08-14 9:25 PM (#568440 - in reply to #566596) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 314 Location: Fairfield County, CT
Paul,
Sorry for the one year lag in responding to your request for info on the seat buttons. Here are some pictures and a description that will help. I have a full set but some need recovering. The buttons are actually metal plates covered in white vinyl; folded, rolled over the edge and glued on. The plates measure 1-5/8" long by 5/8" wide. There are 2 pins, 1 inch apart that pierce the seat to keep the button from rotating. The pins look to be equal to a 6d finish nail that is swedged on the back and extend 7/16". The center has a cupped washer pierced by a loop that is folded over on the front. The front and back buttons are held to each other through the seat by a fabric strap. A clip one one end of the strap allows conection inside the seat by reaching up inside (the seat needs to be compressed to attach it). The front seat bottons are 5 inches apart. The single rear seat buttons has a 6 inch strap that clips to the seat frame. The pictures show how these are constructed. There may be an easier way to replicate these than the factory method; you can decide. The attachment of the vinyl looks like fussy work. It's amazing how precise the edges are. I'm sure I've left out some dimensions or other descriptions so feel free to ask questions. Again, sorry for the delay in responding; I moved last year and my parts got completely disorganized. I was relieved to find these.
Posted 2018-08-14 10:26 PM (#568445 - in reply to #568440) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Those are the buttons. Thanks, Joe! I too, owe you an apology! I have lots of the embossed door panel vinyl and I will be sure to get you enough for your car and I'm sorry I didn't get back to you. I just moved as well and all my stuff is mixed up.
Paul. Those door panels look fantastic!! I've done a number of this family of cars and the Regal door panels are most definitely the most difficult to make. Way more difficult than a 57 Fireflight!
Posted 2018-08-15 7:36 AM (#568468 - in reply to #568467) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
On my car the door windlace at the front was woven cloth and copper vinyl at rear,
SMS does not have the woven stuff, but I have found some that looks close, mine is probably faded?
Posted 2018-12-20 12:19 AM (#575525 - in reply to #575523) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
I wonder why Aivar is selling it. It really is a fabulous car. I flew to Florida to check it out before Aivar bought it. If it had been a factory Super D, I would own it today!!
Posted 2018-12-21 11:13 AM (#575591 - in reply to #575525) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 2996 Location: Sept. 1958
LD3 Greg - 2018-12-20 12:19 AM
I wonder why Aivar is selling it. It really is a fabulous car. I flew to Florida to check it out before Aivar bought it. If it had been a factory Super D, I would own it today!!
Greg
I’m assuming he’s getting up there and wants to part with some of his cars. I believe the C convertible up at that auction is his too.
Posted 2019-01-01 9:25 AM (#576089 - in reply to #575525) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
LD3 Greg - 2018-12-20 5:19 AM
I wonder why Aivar is selling it. It really is a fabulous car. I flew to Florida to check it out before Aivar bought it. If it had been a factory Super D, I would own it today!!
Greg
Hi Greg,
Auction looks to have dissapeared, do you know if its been pulled or sold?
Posted 2019-01-01 9:59 AM (#576090 - in reply to #576089) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
springsweptwing - 2019-01-01 9:25 AM
LD3 Greg - 2018-12-20 5:19 AM
I wonder why Aivar is selling it. It really is a fabulous car. I flew to Florida to check it out before Aivar bought it. If it had been a factory Super D, I would own it today!!
Greg
Hi Greg,
Auction looks to have dissapeared, do you know if its been pulled or sold?
Thanks Paul.
Hi Paul,
I don't know but it wouldn't surprise me if he sold it privately. The car was absolutely sound when I saw it and I know Aivar drove it back to CA as soon as he bought it.
Posted 2020-03-24 12:20 AM (#595941 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Here is the punch card for my Regal. Good copy and fairly easy to read. There is nothing seemingly Regal Lancer specific except the trim code and the paint code. The LD3 does give a clue that it is a high priced Dodge.
Posted 2020-03-24 9:57 PM (#595979 - in reply to #595978) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 9905 Location: Lower Mainland BC
Lancer Mike - 2020-03-24 5:54 PM Is the hood ornament code any different for the Regal?
There is a separate listing for the Right, LD3-H Regal Lancer and Left, LD3-H Regal Lancer57-58 Regal Lancer Hood top Ornament, in two parts 1686 330 and 1686 331.
Posted 2020-03-25 12:44 AM (#595985 - in reply to #595978) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Lancer Mike - 2020-03-24 8:54 PM
Thanks for sharing Greg:
Interesting to see they have a TEXAN code.
A couple of questions:
Is the hood ornament code any different for the Regal?
Is there a code for the Acousti-foam headliner?
Hi Mike.
Short answer, I don’t know. But, for a Regal, I am sure that trim code 277 tells the whole story for the factory build team with respect to hood ornaments and headliner and all the other Regal specific items.
The punch card only needs to do two things:
1. It contains sufficient information to build the car as it was ordered.
2. It contains sufficient information to invoice the car as it was built.
Those are the only two things a manufacturing facility must do to be successful.
When we see penciled key lock numbers and engine numbers and build date on the card we know the process is complete. The car got built as ordered and was invoiced as such!
Posted 2020-03-25 10:56 AM (#596002 - in reply to #595979) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
56D500boy - 2020-03-25 2:57 AM
Lancer Mike - 2020-03-24 5:54 PM Is the hood ornament code any different for the Regal?
There is a separate listing for the Right, LD3-H Regal Lancer and Left, LD3-H Regal Lancer57-58 Regal Lancer Hood top Ornament, in two parts 1686 330 and 1686 331.
Posted 2020-03-25 8:41 PM (#596028 - in reply to #596002) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Yeah, those eBay listings are definitely NOT Regal.
The reason I asked about the Acousti-Foam coding was that I know all Regals came with Acousti-Foam headliner, but I had a Coronet two-door hardtop that also came equipped with Acousti-Foam - which seems very unusual in anything but a Regal!
Posted 2020-03-26 12:51 AM (#596041 - in reply to #596028) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Lancer Mike - 2020-03-25 8:41 PM
Yeah, those eBay listings are definitely NOT Regal.
The reason I asked about the Acousti-Foam coding was that I know all Regals came with Acousti-Foam headliner, but I had a Coronet two-door hardtop that also came equipped with Acousti-Foam - which seems very unusual in anything but a Regal!
Yeah, I know, Mike and Paul. Those eBay postings should never have been posted here!! Just pure ignorance!!
This is certainly a puzzle. In Neils extensive research he found countless examples of stuff like you describe. The only paper trail he ever found were broadcast sheets with pencilled in notes that seemed to address odd things!! Just as if an order was placed and there was an Oh, Yeah, I also want this!
Might need to ask Karl Pippard. Maybe he can shed some light on it. Maybe he already has in the 56 Dodge and CK cars where he clearly showed that CK's cars had special order codes.
Maybe the factory had standard packages offered for sale that fit the paperwork we have. Anything beyond that was a special order and had it's own purchase order code or number??
Did you get the punch card for the Coronet you had?
Posted 2020-03-26 7:26 PM (#596083 - in reply to #596041) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
LD3 Greg - 2020-03-25 10:51 PM Did you get the punch card for the Coronet you had? Greg
I did not (that I recall)! But I know the current owner - I'll ask. I always wondered if Acousti-Foam (or whatever they called it) was called out on either the punch card or the data plate...
Posted 2020-03-26 11:37 PM (#596100 - in reply to #596083) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Lancer Mike - 2020-03-26 7:26 PM
LD3 Greg - 2020-03-25 10:51 PM Did you get the punch card for the Coronet you had? Greg
I did not (that I recall)! But I know the current owner - I'll ask. I always wondered if Acousti-Foam (or whatever they called it) was called out on either the punch card or the data plate...
Good thought. You and I both have been surprised what can show up on body plates! Personally, I don't think it will because that headliner doesn't influence body assembly parts and procedures. But, Hey, neither do sun visors!!
Maybe he could provide a pic of the body plate?
Posted 2020-04-15 4:23 PM (#596882 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 214
I'm trying to figure out the punch card for my Regal Lancer. The car has a D500 emblem on it that looks like it has been there for many years but the engine is a 350. I recently ordered the punch card to see what engine it came with and the section for "motor number" is blank. Was it common to leave the motor number blank or does that indicate that the engine could have been a 361 since it was a late production car(June 5th 1958)
Thanks in advance, Nick
Posted 2020-04-15 7:27 PM (#596891 - in reply to #596882) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Hi, Nick!
Greg and others will know more, I see a "4" code between car service and route columns. That may possibly indicate it was a Super D500 if that translates to the 24th position on the data plate. However, there have been some cars coded with a 4 or a 5 in the 25th position and I don't know what either of those numbers indicate. I can tell more from the firewall data plate.
Posted 2020-04-16 12:25 AM (#596911 - in reply to #596901) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Hi Nick,
Great car! It will be interesting to check it all out but I go by the punch card. Simply because it was the blueprint to build it and generated the invoice. Card column 37 is “power plants”. You have no code there so it was a 350 or at least it was to be invoiced as a “standard” 350.
Posted 2020-04-16 8:57 PM (#596964 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 9672 Location: So. Cal
I actually like the 350 motor better than the D500 because a smaller bore would be nice. Cut down a 413 crank to go into it, and you would have a very torquey motor that gets great fuel mileage too. Best of both worlds!
Posted 2020-04-16 11:03 PM (#596971 - in reply to #596964) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Veteran
Posts: 214
Okay guys. Thank you so much for the info!!
I always figured it was not a factory D500 but when the punch card came in the mail recently with no engine info I
started thinking that there may be a chance it was.
Posted 2020-04-18 3:44 PM (#597050 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1892
.
Yes – this is a ’58 Dodge Accessories Booklet, as Dave said.
Unfortunately, I don't have it, I saved the pictures only. It had sold on ebay.
Greg and Michael: check your email…
Posted 2020-04-18 4:00 PM (#597051 - in reply to #144239) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1892
.
Forgot to say:
If we are looking to the contents in the booklet – there are SIX groups in it.
Basic, Radio, Appearance, Convenience, Bumper Appearance and Safety…
But in the build sheet are SEVEN.
Maybe the difference hides in the Appearance Groups:
Appearance No. 1 = Wheel Covers
Appearance No. 2 = Deluxe Wheel Covers plus Rear Quarter Stone Shields
And in whole:
Accessory Group 311 – Basic
Accessory Group 312 – Radio
Accessory Group 313 – Convenience
Accessory Group 314 – Appearance
Accessory Group 315 – Deluxe Appearance
Accessory Group 316 – Safety
Accessory Group 317 – Bumper Appearance
Posted 2020-04-18 8:06 PM (#597059 - in reply to #597051) Subject: RE: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
The stone shields, two-tone plastic steering wheel, electric clock and regular wheel covers are included with the appearance group.
The deluxe appearance group is the same except includes the spinner wheel covers
Posted 2020-04-18 10:26 PM (#597062 - in reply to #144239) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert 5K+
Posts: 9672 Location: So. Cal
That makes a lot of sense. My '58 Coronet came with all those options at once, stone shields, 2-tone plastic steering wheel, electric clock, and standard wheel covers. Would the deluxe interior be included in one of these as well? My car has that as well.
Posted 2020-04-18 11:38 PM (#597063 - in reply to #597062) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
The Custom Coronet equipment will be coded in the “trim” code. Standard Coronet trim codes will be prefixed with numeral 1 whereas Custom Coronet trim codes will be prefixed as 2. They will be three numeral codes. At least for Detroit built Dodges. Not sure about others.
Posted 2020-04-18 11:55 PM (#597064 - in reply to #597063) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
Oops! Sorry, better disregard what I said. I was going by memory and and should realize now that old people shouldn’t do that!! I got 57 and 58 Dodges mixed up. What I said is true for 57 but not necessarily for 58.
Posted 2020-07-07 8:44 PM (#600578 - in reply to #600556) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
I ordered a full set of door panels for my Coronet convertible from SMS during their sale. They said the door panels would be ready in December. Not Regal, but 58 Dodge.
Something looks a little odd on the lower edge of the door panel in the image above.
Posted 2020-08-17 5:54 PM (#602184 - in reply to #602140) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
Maybe it is my monitor, but there appear to be three silvery lines in the black part of the lowest portion of the panel. The three silvery lines look kind of fuzzy, not like mylar pieces, but more like they are part of carpeting.
Posted 2020-08-17 6:12 PM (#602187 - in reply to #602184) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1141 Location: Blackpool, United Kingdom.
Lancer Mike - 2020-08-17 10:54 PM
Maybe it is my monitor, but there appear to be three silvery lines in the black part of the lowest portion of the panel. The three silvery lines look kind of fuzzy, not like mylar pieces, but more like they are part of carpeting.
Hi Mike,
There are 3 stainless trims in the carpet part about 1/4 inch thick, only other thing wrong is the patterned material should be in 3 parts to go around the bulge of the arm rest to keep the pattern in a straight line, and also the upper pleated section should be a separate part to the lower section and have a seam at the front, I am in talks with Doug at SMS to get these panels as close to original as possible.
Posted 2020-08-18 9:15 PM (#602253 - in reply to #602187) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
springsweptwing - 2020-08-17 6:12 PM
Lancer Mike - 2020-08-17 10:54 PM
Maybe it is my monitor, but there appear to be three silvery lines in the black part of the lowest portion of the panel. The three silvery lines look kind of fuzzy, not like mylar pieces, but more like they are part of carpeting.
Hi Mike,
There are 3 stainless trims in the carpet part about 1/4 inch thick, only other thing wrong is the patterned material should be in 3 parts to go around the bulge of the arm rest to keep the pattern in a straight line, and also the upper pleated section should be a separate part to the lower section and have a seam at the front, I am in talks with Doug at SMS to get these panels as close to original as possible.
Thanks Paul.
I took these photos of my door panels today. A local upholstery guy and I made them up. They look pretty good but it was an extremely difficult job. He told me that his sewing machine could sew through several layers of vinyl and two layers of tough cardboard but when it came time, he said no! So. We had to glue the welting at the top of the carpet to the backing. And the bottom line of stitches of the off white vinyl panel above the arm rest was supposed to go right through all layers which would have kept it all tight. We had to glue it also!
Greg
Posted 2020-08-18 9:15 PM (#602254 - in reply to #602187) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
springsweptwing - 2020-08-17 6:12 PM
Lancer Mike - 2020-08-17 10:54 PM
Maybe it is my monitor, but there appear to be three silvery lines in the black part of the lowest portion of the panel. The three silvery lines look kind of fuzzy, not like mylar pieces, but more like they are part of carpeting.
Hi Mike,
There are 3 stainless trims in the carpet part about 1/4 inch thick, only other thing wrong is the patterned material should be in 3 parts to go around the bulge of the arm rest to keep the pattern in a straight line, and also the upper pleated section should be a separate part to the lower section and have a seam at the front, I am in talks with Doug at SMS to get these panels as close to original as possible.
Thanks Paul.
I took these photos of my door panels today. A local upholstery guy and I made them up. They look pretty good but it was an extremely difficult job. He told me that his sewing machine could sew through several layers of vinyl and two layers of tough cardboard but when it came time, he said no! So. We had to glue the welting at the top of the carpet to the backing. And the bottom line of stitches of the off white vinyl panel above the arm rest was supposed to go right through all layers which would have kept it all tight. We had to glue it also!
Greg
Posted 2020-08-18 9:17 PM (#602255 - in reply to #602187) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Expert
Posts: 1906 Location: Ontario, Canada
springsweptwing - 2020-08-17 6:12 PM
Lancer Mike - 2020-08-17 10:54 PM
Maybe it is my monitor, but there appear to be three silvery lines in the black part of the lowest portion of the panel. The three silvery lines look kind of fuzzy, not like mylar pieces, but more like they are part of carpeting.
Hi Mike,
There are 3 stainless trims in the carpet part about 1/4 inch thick, only other thing wrong is the patterned material should be in 3 parts to go around the bulge of the arm rest to keep the pattern in a straight line, and also the upper pleated section should be a separate part to the lower section and have a seam at the front, I am in talks with Doug at SMS to get these panels as close to original as possible.
Thanks Paul.
I took these photos of my door panels today. A local upholstery guy and I made them up. They look pretty good but it was an extremely difficult job. He told me that his sewing machine could sew through several layers of vinyl and two layers of tough cardboard but when it came time, he said no! So. We had to glue the welting at the top of the carpet to the backing. And the bottom line of stitches of the off white vinyl panel above the arm rest was supposed to go right through all layers which would have kept it all tight. We had to glue it also!
Greg
Posted 2020-08-20 10:37 PM (#602350 - in reply to #602237) Subject: Re: 1958 Regal Lancer
Location: The Mile High City
57DODGECONV - 2020-08-18 5:05 PM Mike what Color Door panels are you Going with on your 58 Coronet Convertible ? I thought of Ordering Mine Soon for My 58 Coronet Convertible as Well.
Aha! I didn't realize there are stainless strips in there! I'm going with the green door panels, with the deluxe mylar swoop (I don't even know if they offer a standard straight line mylar). Good info on the fabric pattern as it crosses over the bump for the arm rest - I didn't notice until you mentioned it. Sharp eyes on this forum!
1958 Regal Lancer
I asked Jim if he had any of the original interior parts - nope! all that's left is the steering wheel. This is such a rare car that I had to find out more about it. For the Frostbite (love the name), you have to pay for the customizer's tastes. It is not my cup o' tea, but it may be the right car at the right price for someone else. 
I have talked to him about his Regal, but I have never seen a picture. Gary, if you can get a picture from him, I would be eternally grateful! From me, that is not much because it is a status you already have, but nonetheless - I would really appreciate it. 
That is fantastic!!! I wonder how they made that model? I didn't know AMT or any of the others were making a '58 Dodge. I have to find one of those beauties. That is a stunning model: look how the paint shines. Look how the chrome shines. It looks a little like the JoHan promotional cars, but they usually don't have an interior and they usually do have side windows. I have to get on eBay and check this out!
