Re: 727 torqueflite rebuild kit?

[Jim Altemose <jaltemoose@xxxxxxxxx>]

Below is a random pile of emails from Herb and Don Dulmage discussing
the Torqueflite band adjustment.  For those of you new to the board,
Don's knowledge and experience is worth it's weight in gold.

- Jim
Jim Altemose, Long Island, NY
'63 Polara 500 (Max Wedge)
'63 Polara 500 (383)
'65 Belvedere I (Street Wedge)
'71 Bronco

Jim and brian. if there is a shydder between 2nd and 3rd gear then the
kickdown band is to tight. remove trans pan and adjust it so you can
pull the leaver down 1/4 inch from the servo. forget the tighten to
[[inch lbs and back of bla bla bla. The 1/4 inch thing is fool proof.
trans is trying to apply third before second os released completley.
probably because it is to snug.  Couldbevalve body problem but I am
thinking the band adjustment is too tight.
DonJim;

Drain your converter! 80% of the fluid is in it. Pull the inspection cover
from front of tranny and turn engine over by hand till you see the drain
plug, remove it, go get a cold one, and let it drain.  You will probably
finish before it will! (-;  You will get about 6 + qt's out of it. Reinstall
plug & pan.  Fill with 4 qt's only and start. Then add the rest of the fluid
engine running. If you attempt to fill it all the way before starting it
will spit most of it on the ground when you do start it!!   Also if someone
has over torqued the pan bolts and bowed the flange inward around the bolt
holes now is the time to fix it. Take the pan and a piece of two by four and
rest the flange on the edge of the two by four and with a hammer tap the
area around each hole till it is flat like the surrounding flange. If you
are comfortable with it, now is a great time to adjust your bands!  What Say
You?  Thumbs up to Mobil synthetic.  But as always every one has their own
favorite product!!
         Jim:

If ya don't ask ya don't learn!! Don is dead on! If you take the time and
adjust the bands by torqueing and backing off you will find your self very
close to what you get doing it by sight. You have two adjustments one kind
of hard to get at on the outside by the linkage and one on the inside back
of the pan. Loosen the lock nut, back it off about 4 or 5 turns and tighten
the center stud down snug till no play at front servo and back it off till
you get about 1/4 in gap between the lever and the servo. Hold the center
stud in place and tighten the locknut. The reason to hold it from turning is
to keep your adjustment. The easy one is the inside one after filter removal
 Follow the same procedures as the front adjuster arm and wola you got it!!
PS: don't get to upset if you find some metal in the pan that is normal.
(AAmco will try and tell you it's transmission time, BS!) Also a lot of
Torqueflite's have a round magnet like a doughnut stuck to the pan make sure
you clean it & the pan as well as you can with any solvent! Also start all
of your pan bolts, then snug them and lastly tighten them but not to tight
that the gasket swells out of the sides! And when your dropping the pan
remove the bolts from three corners of the pan and leave one corner tight.
Pry the pan gently from the opposite corner that is tight with a big pan 12
qt + under it. Your going to get about 4 quarts or more gushing out from the
pan. Go slow and let it drain slow and you wont have any big mess to clean
up! Be sure to make sure the pan is flat all the way around the flange and
not bowed at the bolt holes because it will leak if left as is. Previously I
explained how to straighten it with a 2 by 4 and hammer. Hope this helps!
Any other questions feel free to ask, the only dumb question is the one you
Don't ask!

HerbJim:

Sounds like your ready for anything!  Go Figure on the rain!  One last thing
you might want to do is make sure your kickdown linkage is adjusted
correctly.  Have someone floor the car (Not Running) and see if the kickdown
linkage travels all the way as far as it will go to the rear. If it does not
 adjust the threaded rod/rods till it does.  Your car should shift 1>2 at
about 25 and 2>3 at about 35 mph under normal acceleration.

Herb

Don Dulmage big-d@xxxxxxxxxxxx via boing.topica.com

	7/22/06
 		
to 1962to1965mopa.

	
Way back in the dark ages , (aka long long ago) I had a hemi powered
car. I first installed the engine in a 1963 Dodge post car. Some may
have seen pictures of it on my website. The engine was a 68 Street
Hemi that I rebuilt in Race Hemi form (12.5 to 1 comp) . I had got the
engine in trade for a 383 I had built and had been running on the
street in my 64 Dodge wagon. The Hemi would destroy transmissions
quickly when RPM was pushed above 7000 RPM. I lived with the problem
but later put the whole driveline in a Dart to loose some weight.
About that time I met a fellow who had built auto trans for funny cars
(back when they were using them before the Lenco came on the scene) He
told me that the reason my trans were dying was I had an overlap in
the second to 3rd shift since the same pressure used to apply third
gear is also used to release the second gear band. He told me to buy a
cheetah  turbo actions valve body and that would be a cure . He also
shpwed methe resrictor from the transco kit and how it went in the
third gear or direct clutch passage to slow down the apply of the
direct clutch and give the second gear band a tiny moment more to
release. He went on to say that what we all thought was a good hard
shift from second to 3rd in the torque flite was actually the trans
binding up from both the band and the clutch being on at the same time
for a moment. He said as RPM increased above normal the problem was
more severe. I was not impressed. After all I had a B&M valve body and
thee was nothing wrong with that I was sure. He gave me a challenge.
He said bring your car to my shop. we will put it on the hoist and
have someone you trust run it through the gears even at moderate RPM.
So I did and much to my surprise when the shift was made from 2nd to
3rd even at only 4000 RPM I could plainly see the wheel actually stop
and all the lug nuts where plainly visable to my eye. I could not
believe it. He then installed the Cheetah valve body and we retried
the test. The wheel did not stop and the nuts were only a constant
blurr. He went on to explain that the small transco kit was for the
exact same problem in street trans with normal automatic function (I
had a reverse  manual valve body in (both B&M and the Cheetah)
Later when I started to do my own trans a friend came who did them for
a living and showed me the second gear band adjustment trick. Between
these two men i learned how to build bullet proof trannies.
Both were aware that the second gear third gear overlap is the biggest
 problem in these trans. While i am on the trans subject the other
weak spot is the front sealing ring on the stator suport that saels
the direct drum supply pressure  . The ring right at the front in
normal use has only oil on one side and tends to wear severely in a
race trans at high rpm. Turbo actions makes a stainless ring set and
now we even have nometalic ones but the thing that really cured it for
me was the switch to Synthetic trans fluid.
That put an instant end to the sealin ring problem. An engineer from
MObil  told me it would and I tried it rather dubiously but it is now
something we neverr have trouble with.  His exact words to me were
"well Don , aluminum melts at approx 1300 degrees. Mobil 1 trans fluid
is stable to 1600 degrees so unless your trans has melted and run out
on the ground the front sealing ring will still be sufficiently
lubricated. BTW firstsign you are having that problem in a race car is
youur mPH goes away with no explainable reason , usually a couple or 3
mph. If you pull the trans you will find the direct clutch burn or
beginning to burn and that front sealing ring on the stator support
inside where the drum runs so worn that you will be able to shave with
the sharp edge.

PS Please forgive my previous post. This keyboard is giving me fits.If
I press hard it will repeat the letter too quickly and if I pres
normal it skips. I should have been in bed when I wrote the one last
night. Sorry for the mess
Don
Author of
Return to Deutschland (True Adventure)
Old Reliable (Mopar)
http://stores.ebay.ca/Don-Dulmage-Enterprises
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



On Wed, Apr 11, 2012 at 9:42 AM, Jim Altemose <jaltemoose@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Does adjusting the bands have anything to do with shifting between 1
> and 2?  I was having trouble shifting between 2nd and 3rd several
> years ago.  Herb and Don Dulmage posted a simple procedure for
> adjusting the bands which I did myself and worked fine.  Cars been
> shifting well for 4 years since.  I can post the procedure.  Could
> save you a lot of trouble and it's easy to try first.
>
> - Jim
> Jim Altemose, Long Island, NY
> '63 Polara 500 (Max Wedge)
> '63 Polara 500 (383)
> '65 Belvedere I (Street Wedge)
> '71 Bronco
>
> On Wed, Apr 11, 2012 at 12:25 AM, Gary Wilson <gwwilson70@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> Trans Parts in Portland Or  Probably has the parts.  May be call Portland
>> Transmission now.  They alway had what I needed and prices were fair.  The
>> 727s are easy to do if you read up on them and pay attention. l Main think
>> is clean clean and clean.  Pay attention to the clutch pacs and main sure
>> valve body is clean.  Don't loose the little ball bearings.
>>
>> On Tue, Apr 10, 2012 at 3:28 PM, doug daniel <dougdaniel50@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>
>>> buy new fluid and filter drain torque converter and replace fluid ,,,it
>>> may help ,,for a while
>>>
>>>
>>> From: Zachary Ross <zachross07@xxxxxxxxx>
>>> To: 1962to1965mopars@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 10, 2012 6:22 PM
>>> Subject: 727 torqueflite rebuild kit?
>>>
>>> Hey to all!
>>>
>>> I have a 1964 Dodge 880 Custom with a push button automatic 727
>>> torqueflite transmission.
>>>
>>> My transmission is having trouble shifting from 1st to 2nd.... It has
>>> fluid in it.. and the fluid is clean (if that matters at all)
>>>
>>> What should I do?
>>>
>>> Buy a rebuilt kit and rebuild it? If so, where can I get a great kit with
>>> everything I need?  Also how hard is it?  I'm pretty good with fixing most
>>> things, and I do all the work on the car myself.  But i've never done a
>>> tranny rebuild.
>>>
>>> I have had the car for about 8 months... I don't know anything about it
>>> other then what i've learned since having it.  Someone unplugged the
>>> speedometer... so who knows how many miles it has on it!
>>>
>>> Thank you all!
>>>
>>> Zach
>>> 64 dodge 880 Custom
>>> 4DHT Push Button Trans.
>>> --
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>>> your privacy, reduce the total volume of mail and fine tune the content
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>>> 1962 to 1965 Mopar Clubhouse Discussion Guidelines:
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Gwwilson
>>
>> --
>> --
>> Please address private mail -- mail of interest to only one person --
>> directly to that person. That is, send parts/car transactions and
>> negotiations as well as other personal messages only to the intended
>> recipient, not to the Clubhouse public address. This practice will protect
>> your privacy, reduce the total volume of mail and fine tune the content
>> signal to Mopar topic. Thanks!
>>
>> 1962 to 1965 Mopar Clubhouse Discussion Guidelines:
>> http://www.1962to1965mopar.ornocar.org/mletiq.html and
>> http://www.1962to1965mopar.ornocar.com/general_disclaimer.html.
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "The 1962 to 1965 Mopar Mail List Clubhouse" group.
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Please address private mail -- mail of interest to only one person -- directly to that person. That is, send parts/car transactions and negotiations as well as other personal messages only to the intended recipient, not to the Clubhouse public address. This practice will protect your privacy, reduce the total volume of mail and fine tune the content signal to Mopar topic.  Thanks!

1962 to 1965 Mopar Clubhouse Discussion Guidelines:
http://www.1962to1965mopar.ornocar.org/mletiq.html and http://www.1962to1965mopar.ornocar.com/general_disclaimer.html.
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You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "The 1962 to 1965 Mopar Mail List Clubhouse" group.
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