I was wondering about that great idea to get seal out . It is a frustrating thing in the car .
Why wouldn’t it pop out if you did that maneuver in daily driving ?
The snap ring would therefore hold it in ? I get it .
Often too , the shaft is roughened a bit by corrosion so a new seal drips too . Corrosion creeps up under the lip , probably if sitting and in areas with salt .
I have sort of decided to live with it if a drop or two a week , given effectiveness of repair attempts on your own car at home —-sometimes you end up right back in same place , same slow drip after a lot of work .
But rebuilds by Sand G at least have not leaked , they must polish the shaft .
So at this point it is down to live with it if minor or rebuild the box . If a lot of work on car might as well do it right , but if shaft good , a quick way to change seal is wonderful stuff .
Your time and labor matter too , as far as success or not .
I understand you rebuild them too ? or used to ?
On the one assembled wrong , the symptom was one could not seat the snap ring in the groove as the pile up was taller when put together wrong . After trying to pound in more , as much as is reasonable , made a tool etc no go .Someone else had pounded too , deformed the seal metal , complicating all this. It had not moved down but nothing was holding it . Maybe it was someone’s “ good idea “ to move seal lip to an un corroded part of shaft ?
I made a bushing after measuring , that sits on top of pitman arm —of brass , it holds the damaged metal seal in if it should move down . I had visions of it popping out and suddenly no PS .
This has worked fine. I know crude but works and brass is a bearing material against steel of bushing / seal .
Suddenly no PS , caused me to crash a 65 NY wagon once . No thanks . In that case original oem HP hose burst . Change those ….
While on this , just as an anecdote , I had this same apparently loose mesh problem with Jeep 02 GC , and 67 dart ps
The GC factory manual tells you to take jeep box out to adjust , big long involved multi page process on a bench involving measuring inch pounds of torque . You would not believe the effort to get one out , as in days of hard work , just to adjust a nut you can see in the car ? What the hell were they thinking ? Garage is not an engineering lab . All you can do at end of day is adjust the nut, anyway !!? After success with dart ( just turn it 1/4 turn in and see what you have ) — dart took about 1.2 turns , done by wiggling steering back and forth on center until pitman moves without play .compared to input shaft . I did not go beyond that . Done by side of road in NB Canada , as car danced around badly when crazy Canadian truck drivers pass you at 85 . You can see input shaft and pitman in those . Engine on …. then check ends of travel . I think Iteration works .
Tried same thing with 4 WD GC , but had trouble as steering wheel became tight with only half turn on nut , it would not return cleanly . So backed off on try # two slightly .
Both have been OK for three years now .
I am NOT advocating it , but at the end of the day how it acts on road is either ok or not , no matter how fancy your setup method to adjust it … or what is going on . Wear happens somewhere —you can compensate for it at least once? Why it has an adjustment even at the
beginning .
Anyway , FYI
Sent from my iPhone
On Jan 3, 2023, at 9:17 AM, Donald Verity <chryslerdon@xxxxxxx> wrote:
The 1 turn in on the adjuster is to seat the gears after a rebuild. The proper pre-load is 3/8 - 1/2. The most wear on the teeth is going to be at the two extremes of travel. That would be where the most load is. When adjusted properly, the center may be slightly tight, and there should be minimal play at the extremes. A new box would be the same all the way across. I have seen the gear teeth wear enough to be unusable. The factory manual says to replace them as assemblies. Ball wear should be minimal. As soon as the wheel moves, hydraulic pressure is pushing the pistons. I have never had to replace them. They are not really made for that kind on repair. It is not like a saginaw box. I did the one in my Dodge truck once, and that was enough for me.
Don
Since I will be sending my box in for rebuilding when I swap it out for my spare, I have been calling and talking to the repair shops. Some will actually have a discussion about exactly what they do and some others are not too interested
in going into great detail.
The one common theme I have gotten out of the shops is that the actual worm and sector gear faces usually are not so worn as to need replacing. I have been told that the balls inside the piston that ride on the input shaft wear and that
is the main wear point.
The “worm” gear is really two sets of “worm” gears. The first worm on the input shaft and uses balls like the old Saginaw worm and roller manual boxes and is inside the piston. The second worm is on the outside of the piston and acts on
the sector shaft (the roller) like the old Gemmer manual boxes.
In the old Gemmer design the gears can wear out of they are over adjusted or just get a lot of miles on them. I assume that can happen on these boxes, but that “inner worm” from what I am told is what takes the wear hit. Perhaps Don Verity
can shed some light on this subject.
I know that when I bench tested the spare unit the other day to see if I could follow the service recommendation on adjustment on the bench I could not. There was no way to get that 1 plus more turn to mesh the gears. If one tried the box
would just lock up.
What I did notice was that the input shaft and piston could be felt moving forward and back while I tried to adjust the sector shaft screw. It moved a lot. In an old Gemmer manual box that is a sure sign that the worm bearings need adjusting.
In this box, I assume that it means that the balls inside the piston have worn.
I wish there was more specific information on the rebuilding of these boxes, like down to the level of the factory blue prints on all the parts.
James
From: chrysler-300-club-international@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <chrysler-300-club-international@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
On Behalf Of Rich Barber
Sent: Monday, January 2, 2023 18:10
To: 'John Grady' <jkg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; 'Donald Verity' <chryslerdon@xxxxxxx>
Cc: 'Chrysler 300 Club International' <chrysler-300-club-international@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; 'Loren Nelson' <lorenhelenn@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: RE: {Chrysler 300} Power Steering Gear
OK: Once, again displaying my ignorance and paranoia.
Do these steering gear shops replace the inner gears when needed, or just replace/service seals, bushings & bearings as needed? Or do the big parts like gears run forever/or
new/restored available somewhere/somehow? Similarly, anyone have a source for a boogered-up brass fitting on a ’64 box? The one that has straight threads to the box and tapered hose fitting on the other? Damaged in storage—may even be a steel fitting, not
brass.
Rich Barber
Grateful for the knowledge base out there.
We had one , rebuilt by somebody , where seal was in wrong side of bronze bushing
Unbelievable .
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