| I think you are correct Ryan ; however that is torque on the bolt which may or may not result in a perfectly uniform bolt tension as discussed before . But it is good to achieve that anyway ... pointer or click ,,same value oftorque targeted . While not a gasket engineer , I doubt there is a magic clamp force say within 5-8% of bolt design torque below which a gasket fails . And both head and block are pretty rigid . Even out clamp between the bolts too . It is good to think of the bolts as stretched to a big number rubber bands .. why it stays tight with temp . The reason i thunk the variation within reason is ok is I noticed that once the 4 1/2 “ bolts were chosen per cylinder for the hemi , the designers said “torque them right to the max a grade 8 bolt can take” , ( 85) allowing the cast iron thread is deep enough . So not specific to gasket needs? A lot more probably . And many kinds of gaskets. —
More , it was “ tighten it like crazy — “ just go more than gasket needs ? And for blown fuel engines they doubled the clamp force by going to 5/8 bolts , also tightened to the max . And solid copper gaskets .
Personally I like to “see it happen “ on the pointer progressively , along with feel . I really missed that with click wrench , a whole sensory thing gone . I admit to my own error snapping a smaller one with click wrench waiting for the click that did not happen ,,even as mind said “ wow that is tight for this size bolt” I am 100 % sure I am not the first guy to misread a vernier that is upside down or sideways . Happened to me last week on a dial indicator vernier measuring push rods. Easy to go wrong way on rotary vernier or off a turn on setting click wrench. Just cannot happen with a beam type. And all preferences are ok . a continuous reading digital readout might be good too , but not a preset number .., ? Click is excellent in repetitive factory work ? Good discussion , ... both work , used right ..
Sent from my iPhone not by choice
While on the subject, I’ll throw in a question for those engineers out there. It’s always been my understanding that even and equal torque is more important than nailing the actual spec (within reason of course). I feel the click wrench I use, regardless of
it’s accuracy, will give me a more consistent result than eye balling a needle on each bolt.
Ryan Hill
You get monogramed driving gloves with a BMW? Really? I got a Ford key fob with the used Mercury Grand Marquis I'm driving. I thought that was cool.
But I digress...
I really think it's all about feel. You should be able to feel the main cap bolt coming up to torque smoothly. If you are using a clicker wrench, the click shouldn't surprise you, just the same as you watch the pointer
on the beam come to the number smoothly.
It really does come down to personal preference though. I like the clicker wrench for engine assembly and have used it on a lot of engines. But I always say to do what works for you.
I 100% agree that the beam style wrench will give you the most repeatable readings. The clicker type gives up some repeatability and accuracy for ease of use. When you start really getting up in the heavier ranges of torque,
the clicker is nice. Start getting towards 100 ft/lbs and having to start bracing your foot against the engine stand, then it really gets safer to use.
And I have boxes full of Craftsman tools! Love them. For a guy like me, that isn't making a living turning wrenches, the Craftsman stuff had always been the best bang for the buck. I still seek out used Craftsman tools if
I need them.
Since Stanley/ Black and Decker bought Craftsman, I don't know... They still seem OK, but honestly, the better Harbor Freight tools have come up and the Craftsman line has come down a bit and they seem to have met. The
Kobalt stuff looks decent though.
quick comment , i broke a critical bolt once with clicker because I read vernier scale wrong , setting it . very easy to misread a vernier scale in the moment , or off one whole turn . I hate them . Make a mistake, may cost you an engine block .
You hear the click but you don’t really know if that is accurate on a given day. Or how close you are to it clicking as you approach it . Maybe good in a factory.
If beam / pointer is on zero it has to be very near correct , bending of steel is totally repeatable . And you can tell / get a feel as it approaches the desired setting , especially if doing in 3 steps. Reset the clicker 3 times?
Feel matters a lot as you approach full torque if something not right?
Last , process of torquing bolts itself will have errors way more than 2-3 % , tapped thread variations , lube , bolt hardness , rolled or cut threads , washers, bolt finish or plating etc . Why for really precision setting like race rod bolts they measure
stretch .
To each his own .
Craftsman tools to me every bit as good as snap on , and Kobalt seems ok especially for the $, but it gets down to “like buying bmw for the kidney grill and free monogrammed driving gloves .”
And all that is ok if it makes you happy !
Sent from my iPhone not by choice
As someone that has calibrated a lot of torque wrenches, stick with what you have and have them checked periodically.
Ask 10 guys, and you'll get 10 answers and 9 of those answers will be BS.
Three types of torque wrenches for the average guy in their garage.
Beam type. This is your old style torque wrench that has been around forever. Dependable and accurate. A little hard to read and some parallax error can happen if you don't get your eyeball over the pointer. Generally approx 3% accuracy.
Clicker type. Everyone's favorite. Dial it up and feel for the click. They are OK, but need to be checked and used periodically. ALWAYS crank it down to a lower setting to store. If you forget, go "exercise" the wrench by tightening some lug
nuts or something like that and you'll probably be OK. Accuracy is usually 4% CW and 6% CCW
Dial Type. These are the most expensive and most fragile of the bunch. Also the most accurate. They are basically a beam type wrench with a dial indicator that measures deflection (kinda over simplified) . They can be very easily overstressed
and then they aren't accurate at all. They really belong in the lab rather than the garage, but your Snap-On rep won't tell you that. Accuracy is 2% for the better ones, 3 % for the cheaper versions but some with are available with 1% accuracy.
Treat the torque wrench for what it is... a precision tool. It's not a breaker bar. That seems to be the biggest abuse I see.
The cheap (Harbor Fright) torque wrenches aren't bad. The Snap On reps go berserk when I say this, but I've found just as many bad Snap-On wrenches as I've found Craftsman and whatever brands. It really comes down to the guy with the $40 Harbor
Freight wrench might keep it in the drawer with his mics, and the guy with the Snap-On wrench might use it to break rusty bolts loose. Just take care of it. All the tools are crap now.
I have the clicker and the beam type in my box. The SK beams are close to celebrating their 50 birthdays and the Utica clickers were some that I pieced together and repaired (and checked) .
On Wednesday, January 20, 2021, 07:14:13 AM EST, Bob Merritt < bob@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
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