Re: [Chrysler300] Re: Coker tire and wire wheel balance

Back in the day, mid 90's, I was the Certified NSX Tech in my Acura shop.

There was a different tire for each wheel, they were directional and different sizes on front and back.

Shifting into 3rd at 80 or so, balance was VERY important. And if you normally drove this way, you would need tires, often.

The manual and papers the buyer signed stated that the tread life was about 7K miles.

So, I mounted many of them and always balanced the wheel first, then mounted the tire.

Starting with a perfectly balanced wheel makes a big difference.

Usually the reason for the fast tire wear was the Owner would race the car with Traction Control turned off.

Bubba thought he had better clutch feel than the control brain, he didn't. He also turned slower times and speeds.

Sometimes we would have a balance problem on the standard vehicles, and if they required a lot of weight, I would break it down and rotate the tire. If it still required too much weight, then do just the wheel.

Rare occasions would turn up a bad rim, never found out why. By that time didn't care..

Also, we had the Factory Rep. come to demonstrate proper balancing.

He balanced a tire and wheel to perfect. Then he loosened the wheel, took the cellophane off a pack of cigarettes,

Slid a sliver of the cellophane between the wheel and the shaft, and re-balanced it.

It wanted weight. He was showing us that the shaft and the wheel hole must be perfectly clean.

Have a great time at the meet, Tell the Hosts Thanks for busting ass and need to know they did good.
Ray

On Wed, May 9, 2018 at 2:44 PM, Ryan Hill ryan_hillc300@xxxxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300] <Chrysler300-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Sounds to me like the wheels aren't the problem, although it couldn't hurt to start with a rim that is proven to be as balanced as possible. I would imagine on a steel rim (not chromed) that required weight, one could weld on weight for longevity or use stick-on weights, both in areas clear of any interference from the tire bead. Would a stick-on weight placed on the outside of the barrel be subject to fly off eventually due to centrifugal forces? Typically they are mounted where centrifugal force works in favor of staying stuck....

As for hubcaps, if they are full size, indexing would be naturally provided by the valve stem. Hubcaps can be ruled out as the culprit of out of balance rolling mass by simply removing them. I've never seen a tire machine that could accommodate a hubcap but I can't imagine how a hubcap could go out of balance or be out of balance unless it were damaged. (for example, broken teeth)

Ryan Hill

From: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> on behalf of Ray Melton rfmelton@xxxxxxx [Chrysler300] <Chrysler300-noreply@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: May 9, 2018 12:08 PM
To: Lindsey; Chrysler 300 Club, Int'l
Subject: [Chrysler300] Coker tire and wire wheel balance

Hello -

My recently restored 1957 Chrysler 300C convertible has a set of new-ish wide-whitewall 235/75-15 Coker Classic tires on a set of chrome wire wheels made by Motor Wheels. The wheels are at least 40 years old, but are still in excellent condition.   However, due to an extended restoration, the tires are now over 6 years old, but still have the "whiskers", having accumulated only 500 miles. I had the steering aligned and the wheels/tires balanced at a very meticulous and cooperative alignment shop using the Hunter "Road Force" equipment. I was surprised that each wheel took at least 5 ounces of weights, with one requiring 8 ounces - all over the inside and outside of the rims!   The Hunter equipment showed that lateral and radial runout of the wheels and tires were within specs, but the total "roadforce" was above spec on two of the wheel/tire assemblies. The shop had already tried relocating the tires on the rims, so they said that's the best they could do; the residual roadforce was because of internal inconsistencies (stiffness and thickness) within the tire carcass.

The tires seem to flat-spot pretty significantly from sitting in the garage for a couple of weeks, and even after driving 20 miles at highway speeds, there is still noticeable wheel vibration. I took the car back to the alignment/balance shop and they ran it through the full balancing routine again (not just the plain spin-balancing typical at most tire shops), and their re-run came up with almost identical numbers. (They very generously only charged half-price for the re-run!)

This is the first time I've heard of separately balancing the rims alone, and was surprised that you found that it made a significant difference; I was under the impression that the combined wheel/tire balancing process took care of any imbalance of the rims alone. What did your shop do to balance just the rims alone? It seems like they wouldn't just put knock-on rim weights on the rim because that would probably interfere with the additional weights when the tire was installed. Maybe tape-weights on the inside of the rim that would not interfere with the knock-on weights after tire installation?

Can anyone clarify what I should ask the shop to do to have the rims balanced separately? Should I have the simulated knock-off hubcaps installed, since they are actually rather heavy and are somewhat unsymmetrical due the the knock-off "ears"? Seems like I would have to keep each hubcap dedicated to a particular wheel, and indexed somehow - maybe paint dots.   And even if that's technically the right thing to do, I'm not sure the wheel mounting apparatus on the balancing machine could accommodate having the hubcap installed - as I recall, the wheel is held on with a big spin-on nut with large "ears" of its own.

Ray Melton Las Cruces, New Mexico

On 5/8/2018 3:38 PM, Lindsey lindsey@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300] wrote:

Do we have any new updates on the Coker 14" whitewalls that have been coming along for several years? I have had good results from my last set after having the rims balanced first. Have to check when back home, but probably well over 12,000 miles and most at highway speeds up to 95 mph. Usually 75-80 on your nice midwest interstates. I was not happy until Coker suggested getting the rims balanced. New ballgame after that.

High 80's in Winnipeg area yesterday!

Sent from my iPad

On May 8, 2018, at 12:10 PM, Gary Gettleman gary.gettleman@xxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300] <Chrysler300-noreply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

   Harry,

              Thanks for your updates on the F tire project.

              Have you had a chance to run them at speed. How about the balancing process.

              gary gettleman



On 5/1/2018 3:17 PM, Harry Torgeson torg66@xxxxxxxxx [Chrysler300] wrote:

I just installed American Classics and are happy so far, but have not got on the freeway yet.

Harry

Ray Jones. Y'all come on down an see us. Ya hear?