Re: [Chrysler300] 1957 Air conditioning

["Burton Bouwkamp" <northburt@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

Jim,

When we built your car (June 12, 1957) we had not solved the problem on production vehicles. If your car has a snorkel it was probably dealer installed. The snorkel worked - it just looked awful - especially if it was made by some local sheet metal shop. We specified that they be painted flat black to make them less visible. The components (compressor, condenser, evaporator, blower) were all the right size - we just didn't flow enough cool air through the system because the molded plastic ducts (behind the instrument panel) were not big enough. If you look under the instrument panel you will see that the snorkel was mounted to the back of the evaporator - thereby bypassing the distribution ducts.

I can't remember what we did on 1958 models but I think we installed a more professional looking snorkel in production - one that was designed by Engineering and vendor tooled and assembled.

By 1959 we fixed the problem by increasing air flow. If the instrument panel in 1959 was a carryover design, the 1959 parts should adapt to a 1957 or 8 model. What I can't remember is whether the instrument panel was carryover in 1959. It probably was because the 1960 Chrysler was an all new design and we didn't usually design/tool an instrument panel for one year's use.

Burt
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: BARJAM300@xxxxxxx 
  To: northburt@xxxxxxxxxxx 
  Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2009 8:07 PM
  Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] 1957 Air conditioning


  Burt,

  Thanks for the history! If you had not enlightened the 300 world, no one would have understood why they had a "tacky" looking snorkel duct under their dashes of A/C cars.

  Should I expect to find the same thing in my '57 300C built around June 12, 1957 special ordered with New Yorker engine and suspension? It's serial # 3n572862.

  Did you intend to say that all the hardware from a '59 A/C system, except compressor mounting brackets, would work on a '57 300C?

  Thank you again.

  Jim Bartuska
  Niles, Mich




  In a message dated 10/27/2009 4:36:25 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, northburt@xxxxxxxxxxx writes:
      I was a product engineer at the Jefferson Plant in 1957.

    As initially designed the 1957 factory air conditioning system did not flow enough cool air so it would not cool the car on hot/humid days. The basic problem was too much restriction (not big enough duct cross sectional area) downstream of the evaporator; i.e. the ducts behind the instrument panel. In January 1957 we knew we were in trouble because the complaints started to roll in from Cuba. (The problem was worse in Cuba because the owner usually rode in the back seat of 4 door Chrysler's). 

    This problem was one of the consequences of taking a year out of testing and development of the 1957 models. At that time A/C was one of the last features that was engineered on the car so it was short changed more than other car systems. Also, it was treated as an "add on" option and it should have been engineered into the car as it is today. Another example of the consequence of inadequate testing was the torsion bar failures that our owners experienced in geographical areas using salt to deice the roads. The bars broke near the end due to surface corrosion from snow/salt/mud packed around the bar anchors. THE MESSAGE IS - DON'T SHORTCUT THE DEVELOPMENT CYCLE BECAUSE OWNERS, DEALERS AND THE COMPANY WILL PAY FOR IT.

    We ended up having to conduct a field campaign of all 1957 "C" Bodies built and already in service. The fix was to add a "snorkel" cold air outlet under the instrument panel. The snorkel bypassed the inadequate ducts. The snorkel design was fabricated by John Moren (head of the A/C engineering department) in his hotel room in Havana. When we realized how much trouble we were in the USA, engineers and service personnel were sent all over the USA to teach mechanics how to make and install snorkels. We called in all cars and added snorkels which we had fabricated in local sheet metal shops. They looked terrible but they worked!

    I was assigned New Mexico and Arizona. The Director of Service (Claude McClure) said to me, "you are one of the S.O.B.'s that got us in this trouble - you are going to NM and AZ!" I was gone for a month and conducted schools in Yuma, Las Vegas and Los Angeles.

    My message to Chrysler 300C owners is - if you are restoring a 1957 "C" Body make the A/C system like a 1958 - or even better yet a 1959 - "C" Body.

    Burt Bouwkamp 

    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: rob kern 
    To: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ; keboonstra 
    Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2009 3:14 PM
    Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] 1957 Air conditioning

    Keith,
    Some thoughts on the A/C issue. My C has factory A/C and I added rear A/C from Old Air Products in Fort Worth. I also added a 1100 cfm condenser fan and a trinary switch to protect the Chrysler compressor. I'm running R-12 as refrigerant and have factory Solex glass since it was a factory A/C car. The Model 900 HVAC system parts are extremely hard to come by and the underdash componentry is a "Rube Goldberg" scenario of Chrysler engineering at best. Fortunately the oil mechanisms and solenoids all work. Many previous owners found getting the A/C system to be cold a venerable money pit with tepid results. I spent countless $$$ thousands getting replacement parts , etc. to get it keeping cold and working to parameters. Starting off with anything short of NOS will be a nightmare of a Stephen King novel proportion. George McKovich installed aftermarket A/C in his non-factory C and is very pleased. Bill Woodman installed a '56 rear unit with a Sandin compressor and is very pleased. Merle Wolfer is working on a factory unit for his D. Jeff Carter knows these units thoroughly and may be able to get you headed in the right direction if you must have a factory unit. My advice would be to contact George McKovich and persue that route since you don't have a factory A/C car. My 2 cents worth. 300'ly, ROB KERN
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: keboonstra 
    To: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
    Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2009 12:34 PM
    Subject: [Chrysler300] 1957 Air conditioning

    OK Folks, our '57 300C has sat in the barn way too much in the summers just because I'm too spoiled rotten to ride around without A/C anymore in a car that doesn't have a flip top. And besides that, it needed a few improvements that are long overdue.

    After owning it now (for the second time) for 26 years, I'm finally taking care of a lot of the things I should have been doing right along. I'm putting in seat belts, re-installing correct carbs, finally putting on that right side mirror, fixing up the armrests, and maybe I'll throw a set of WW radials on it so it can safely hit the road.

    So now I would also like to install a complete original A/C system, and I don't know where to start. Who out there might have everything I'm going to need to accomplish this (both the parts and the knowledge)? I know this won't be cheap, but in my view it will add that much long term value to the car. And it will add immensely to our pleasure in heading halfway across the country for a meet.

    Who's got parts or ideas for a starting point? Your thoughts?

    Many thanks,
    Keith Boonstra
    Holland, Michigan

    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



    

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

To send a message to this group, send an email to:
Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

For list server instructions, go to http://www.chrysler300club.com/yahoolist/inst.htm

For archives go to http://www.forwardlook.net/300-archive/Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Chrysler300/

<*> Your email settings:
    Individual Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Chrysler300/join
    (Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
    mailto:Chrysler300-digest@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
    mailto:Chrysler300-fullfeatured@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    Chrysler300-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
    http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/