RE: [Chrysler300] 1955 AMA Specs (Last update?)

["Dan Elliott" <us@xxxxxxxxxx>]

>From the info I have seen, the truck manifolds were not part of the 355 HP
package.
Were they used on the NASCAR engines?  Good question.  I suspect they were
because
NASCAR rules seemed to allow bigger exhaust .  A Kiekhaefer by the name of
Fenrich was
in charge of the dyno room, I believe.  Carl K. was meticulous about dyno
runs for all race
engines.  Rumor is that the hottest engines were put into the race cars for
the best racer,
some politics could have been involved as well, per Tim Flock.  To my
knowledge, the
Kiekhaefer records are still not in a position of being accessed.  When that
day comes,
perhaps many of your questions will be answered.

Dan

  -----Original Message-----
  From: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]On
Behalf Of RLS
  Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2008 12:39 PM
  To: Rich Barber; Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx; Dan Elliott
  Cc: us@xxxxxxxxxx
  Subject: Re: [Chrysler300] 1955 AMA Specs (Last update?)


  Is there any information on how the 355 hp head was achieved? Was it a
mere milling of the 340 head, was it a thinner head gasket, WAS there really
a different part number for the 355 head. My understanding is that the only
other changes for the hp increase was the use of the Dodge truck exhaust
manifolds(I have pair of them) and a larger diameter on the exhaust piping.
Seems to me with a 1 point increase in compression plus the exhaust system
upgrade(and likely carb jetting and ignition timing changes to capitalize on
these changes) that a mere 15 hp change in output sounds a bit conservative.
Would really be of interest to find if any of these old race engines had
dyno runs to measure true hp and how it may have compared to "factory stock"
engines. As an aside to achieve 139 mph in the flying mile on sand at
Daytona with a car with the aerodynamics of a ship's sail seems quite a
stretch with a 340 hp(gross hp in those days). I also would be interested in
the rear axle ratios on these flying mile cars(there were several of them
that ran in Daytona in 1956, a number of which exceeded 135 mph is rumored).
With an engine that is pretty much out of rpms at less than 5,500, seems
that a stock 3:54 Powerflite rear axle does not seem likely. Anyone else out
there with information to chime in?

  With the suggested octane levels from 1956, does this mean that one could
run today's regular fuel instead of premium? I know that there is a
calculation that is made to arrive at today's octane number. This current
octane number is a combination of the so called "research" and "motor"
numbers in some formula to arrive at today's octane number posted on the
gasoline pumps.

  Roger Schaaf
  300 B Calyfornua
  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Dan Elliott
  To: Rich Barber ; Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
  Cc: us@xxxxxxxxxx
  Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2008 8:19 AM
  Subject: RE: [Chrysler300] 1955 AMA Specs (Last update?)

  Rich, I certainly believe that the AMA specs would have been updated for
the
  1955 300 at least once, to add the three speed manual transmission used in
  NASCAR starting about April 1. Then there would have been a NASCAR
bulletin
  approving the use of the manual trans. I just returned from NASCAR
  archives,
  they don't have alot of that info publically available, so one needs to go
  to private
  sources.

  On a slightly different question, it would be interested to know if the
355
  HP heads
  had any markings on them that are different than the 340 heads. My guess
is
  "NO", but one never can tell. The part numbers were different of course,
  but
  no 300B ever came down the assembly line with 355 HP heads because the
last
  300B was built and shipped before Chrysler dealers were notified that the
  optional
  heads were available. An unanswered question is whether the 355 HP heads
  were
  used in NASCAR, to date no photos have appeared showing a car in actual
  competition
  with 355HP painted on the hood, a NASCAR requirement after it approved the
  use
  of the heads. Photos at ElkHart Lake in August, and Darlington in
September
  both
  show cars with 340HP. Carl K. could have snuck them in, unless he won with
  the
  subsequent teardown, so I'm assuming he didn't. He did sneak in higher
  octane gas,
  which may have been his thinking with the 355 HP heads. But perhaps by the
  time
  they were approved by NASCAR in mid June, someone had gotten onto his
trick
  with the gas, and he couldn't use it anymore. He certainly didn't want any
  disqualifications,
  because Buck Baker was behind Herb Thomas during mid season, until the
  infamous
  crash at the Shelby fairgrounds. So if the 355HP heads were used at all,
  perhaps it
  was after mid September, 1956.

  Dan Elliott

  -----Original Message-----
  From: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]On
  Behalf Of Rich Barber
  Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2008 12:10 AM
  To: Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
  Subject: [Chrysler300] 1955 AMA Specs (Last update?)

  I have been able to obtain a copy of the 1955 AMA Chrysler specs with the
  2-15-55 updated sheets that added the 1955 Chrysler C-300 on that date. I
  find it interesting to note the similarities and differences in the
  Windsor,
  New Yorker and C-300. Imperials are not included. I think they were
  considered to be a separate brand at that time.

  I had been asking about exhaust and tail pipe diameters and find they are
  the same for the '55 NY and C-300. 2" exhaust and 1.8" tailpipe. It is not
  clear as to whether these are OD or ID, but I guess muffler shop guys
  would
  know. I plan to go with 2" and 1-3/4" if those are the standard nominal
  sizes.

  I would appreciate hearing from anyone that has another set of 1955
  Chrysler
  AMA specs as to whether their set shows any further changes were made to
  the
  specs after 2-15-55 during the year. I believe the idle speed of the C-300
  was changed if nothing else.

  Twelve pages of the 1956 AMA specs were published in the most recent Brute
  Force magazine and contained modifications into mid-April, 1956, primarily
  to add the 355 HP engine with 10.0:1 heads. 1956 exhaust pipes for the
  "B's" are shown as 2.25" std, 3.0" optional-probably for the 355's.
  "300-B"
  tailpipes had swollen to 2" in 1956. With the NY tailpipe now spec'd at
  1-3/4".

  I recall seeing a photo of the trunk of a '55 or '56 Kiekhaefer car that
  had
  the tail pipes running across the top of the trunk floor and out the rear
  panel below the trunk lid. Those tail pipes looked huge--3" or 4" and the
  routing avoided the problem of minimal clearance between the rear axle and
  frame and the likelihood of the tail pipe getting damaged or collapsed
  during the race and restricting flow. Probably a NASCAR rule allowed this
  as it would also minimize broken off pieces of tailpipes on the track.

  The standard 354 hemi 300-B engine had 340 HP with 9.0:1 heads. The NY
  also
  had the 9.0:1 heads and 280 HP at 600 fewer RPM and a single 4-barrel.
  86.5
  octane gasoline was specified for all 1956 engines, as compared to 85
  (Motor) octane fuel for all engines in 1955. Anyone know whether that was
  regular or premium "Ethyl" fuel at that time? I think it was regular as I
  remember working in a Clark station that sold only one grade of gas-Clark
  Super 100 and it was lower octane than major brand "Ethyl", but worked
  well
  in most cars of the mid-late '50's.

  C-300'ly,
  Rich Barber
  Brentwood, CA
  1955 Chrysler C-300 (218.6"L x 60.1"H x 79.1"W, 43'-9" turning
  diameter-curb-curb)

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