Re: [Chrysler300] more fuel

[<smopar@xxxxxxxxxxxx>]

> "Ethanol does not harm rubber"  I would take issue with this statement since I have discussed this with some engineers in the fuel systems labs from the auto industry, and they still dislike ethanol in gasoline because it does break down elastomers (rubber), even though materials now are better.  Years ago, they even advised against using fuel with ethanol in it because it shortened the life of elastomers.  Now they "permit" it.  I don't know if carb rebuilding kits for older carbs contain ethanol resistant materials in the diaphragms/accel pumps?  It is true, however, that premium grades of gasoline may still continue to use ethanol even in the absence of a mandate since it does provide enhanced octane and is cheap (because of subsidies).  
Steve Albu
> From: "Bob Merritt" <rcmerritt@xxxxxxxxxx>
> Date: 2004/05/31 Mon AM 07:34:20 EDT
> To: <Chrysler300@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: [Chrysler300] more fuel
> 
> Forwarding this from George Riehl:
> 
>   With the discussion lately about gasolone with various additives at the
> gas stations, I have this to comment.
>   In the early 80s I was Plant and Equipment manager for a gasoline
> convenience store company. We had 28 stations in the Ann Arbor/Detroit
> areas. All of our gasoline had ethanol, GULF, SUNOCO, SHELL and TOTAL.
> Federal law allowed 10% ethanol as an additive. In other words, every 110
> gallons of product had 10 (aprox) gallons of ethanol. As many of you can
> remember, the pumps had a notice that the gasoline had "10% alcohol". then a
> few years later, the notice was no longer required. Even in todays gasoline,
> ethanol is present of at least 10%. Some brands are less.
>   At the time, my company paid $1.58 for a gallon of ethanol. Gasoline at
> the bulk plants was $.87 per gallon. The company sent a form to the Federal
> government and got a refund of $1.00 per ethanol gallon. The State refunded
> $.50. So, a gallon of ethanol cost the company $.08. When we picked up 900
> gallons of ethanol first with our tank trucks, we then added 9,000 gallons
> of gas. Reason? The gas then mixed with the ethanol during loading. The gas
> loaded was 86 octane, not 87 octane.
>   Now you wonder? Why? Well, ethanol introduced to gas raises the octane
> rating. Lower octane gas burns at a faster rate, ethanol retards the burn.
> So, this means that the small amount of ethanol actually raises the octane
> rating to the next higher octane. "Premium" gas burns at a slower rate than
> the lower brand of gas. Low octane burns "fast" causing "knock" in the
> engine. "Premium" burns at a slower rate over a longer time frame. That is
> why higher compression engines need the "premium". Because it starts to burn
> at a slower rate but burns for a longer period of time. More energy is
> produced, more "push". That is why ignition timing has to be changed when
> going to Premium from Regular, and vice versa.
>   Ethanol enhanced fuels also "burn" cooler than 100% gas. Ever notice
> alcohol burning dragsters exhaust at the drag strips? Blue flames that
> extend much further from the headders show that the "burn" rate is much
> slower. But more ethanol is used than gas would be used.
>   Ethanol does not harm rubber, methanol does, which is a petroleum product
> and very corrosive. Fuel manufactureres tried methanol a few years ago as an
> additive, but with the new cars using fuel injectors, the injectors "froze"
> because methanol has no lubricant in it like ethanol (a corn product).
>   One disadvantage of ethanol, when sitting in a gas tank for a few months,
> the ethanol drops out of the gas and goes to the bottom of the tank. When
> starting a car that has been sitting for a long period of time, you will be
> pulling pure ethanol to the pump and carb. Ethanol is "heavier" than
> gasoline. Vice versa like oil on water. Sometimes the car will not run
> untill you add more "new" gas to the tank, and in doing so, the gas and
> ethanol will remix.
>   People that add "fuel line" additives to their tank is a waste. You are
> adding more ethanol and another solvent. Also, winter gas has more ethanol
> than summer gas so that water condensation will be absorbed by the ethanol
> and fuel lines will not freeze.
>   A car in long storage with ethanol, the rear end of the car should be
> shaken from side to side to remix the ethanol with the gas in the tank for a
> better "start".
>   MTBE additives do attack the fuel pump diaphram. "New old stock" pumps
> that one would buy will not last long. All pump manufacturers and rebuilders
> use a new style diaphram that is not affected by MTBE. My rebuilder uses the
> new diaphram material exclusivly.
>   Now, I wonder if the "new" additive will be harmful to fuel pumps since
> MTBE is being eliminated. But word is, the mileage per gallon will be less
> with the "new" additive. One just can't win!  And the price will be higher!
>   Another point to make, when filling your tank and you notice a "alcohol"
> odor, then the supplier has more than 10% ethanol in his gas, maybe as much
> at 20%. Ethanol is cheaper than a gallon of gas....hence more profit to the
> station. Your car will run, but with lower performance, ever happen to you?
> Has to me when traveling on the road looking for "cheaper" gas at some of
> the off brand stations. Best to deal with well known gas stations.
>    George Riehl
> 
> 
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